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      10-04-2018, 08:23 AM   #1
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What to look out for when purchasing

Im looking to buy an E93. I got a great offer on it ... low miles and also low price. Im going to check the car out this week. What should i check when i get there? Please help!
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      10-04-2018, 08:50 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by iAjking View Post
Im looking to buy an E93. I got a great offer on it ... low miles and also low price. Im going to check the car out this week. What should i check when i get there? Please help!
- Carfax at a minimum, Autocheck optional.

This will show you if the car has been in an accident and how many owners it's had. If it's low miles be weary of more than an owner or two. You'll also want to see the service history on the Carfax... It'll have the dealership's name. CALL THEM or go there and have them tell you what the car has had repaired. For my car it just said "Serviced" which is lazy on the service writer's part because when I called the dealer it was more like "fuel pump replaced, lower control arm replaced, wheel repaired" — so... Don't trust Carfax in and of itself. It's a tool to be used during your investigation. Also- if throttle actuators have been done- awesome. Rod Bearings won't show up on a Carfax because it's not warranty work and nobody goes to the stealership for that (so if it were done, may not be reported). Rod bearings are preventative, engine replacement is the result of not doing rod bearings (and qualifies as warranty work). In short, you won't know if rod bearings have been done without a receipt, if they've not been, expect to do them.

- Take the car in for a pre purchase inspection but MAKE SURE to take it to a proper euro shop. Read their Google reviews, read their Facebook reviews, read through their website, make sure they they're the right people to do a PPI on your semi-collectible-ish high performance German sports car.

- receipts. Get receipts from the owner for anything that was done. Even if it's just general maintenance. Verify this against the dealership's info.

- search the VIN on google. Click every link. Don't buy anything if you end up on some "car history report" BS page though. You're looking for anything pertaining to previous sales.

- google the owner's name. You'll want to know if he has a YouTube Channel called "Best M3 Burnouts" or some crap.

- look the owner up on Facebook. If you know him, shoot him a friend request. If not, creep on him if he's not private. Make sure there are no "it's in the shop again for that transmission rattle" type posts.

- obviously drive the car. If you're not close by, have a member or someone you know drive the car. Make sure it feels and sounds good. If it's manual is the clutch slipping? If it's DCT are the shifts not strong when on 4 or higher? Go with your gut, the PPI will tell you the rest.

- take note of cheap tires or worn brakes... these are indicators that the owner did not have the money to maintain the car as well as they should have.

there's a lot of variables with these cars and they're starting to get a little older so issues will arise. Every car is different.

Just don't skimp on the PPI and the CarFax. Don't be lazy and not call the dealer on the Carfax.

Due diligence is particularly important when buying a car like this. If you buy a turd and try to sell it, the next guy will do his research. And you'll be the one stuck without a chair when the music stops.
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      10-04-2018, 09:10 AM   #3
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Autocheck is better than Carfax.
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      10-04-2018, 09:35 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
- Carfax at a minimum, Autocheck optional.

This will show you if the car has been in an accident and how many owners it's had. If it's low miles be weary of more than an owner or two. You'll also want to see the service history on the Carfax... It'll have the dealership's name. CALL THEM or go there and have them tell you what the car has had repaired. For my car it just said "Serviced" which is lazy on the service writer's part because when I called the dealer it was more like "fuel pump replaced, lower control arm replaced, wheel repaired" — so... Don't trust Carfax in and of itself. It's a tool to be used during your investigation. Also- if throttle actuators have been done- awesome. Rod Bearings won't show up on a Carfax because it's not warranty work and nobody goes to the stealership for that (so if it were done, may not be reported). Rod bearings are preventative, engine replacement is the result of not doing rod bearings (and qualifies as warranty work). In short, you won't know if rod bearings have been done without a receipt, if they've not been, expect to do them.

- Take the car in for a pre purchase inspection but MAKE SURE to take it to a proper euro shop. Read their Google reviews, read their Facebook reviews, read through their website, make sure they they're the right people to do a PPI on your semi-collectible-ish high performance German sports car.

- receipts. Get receipts from the owner for anything that was done. Even if it's just general maintenance. Verify this against the dealership's info.

- search the VIN on google. Click every link. Don't buy anything if you end up on some "car history report" BS page though. You're looking for anything pertaining to previous sales.

- google the owner's name. You'll want to know if he has a YouTube Channel called "Best M3 Burnouts" or some crap.

- look the owner up on Facebook. If you know him, shoot him a friend request. If not, creep on him if he's not private. Make sure there are no "it's in the shop again for that transmission rattle" type posts.

- obviously drive the car. If you're not close by, have a member or someone you know drive the car. Make sure it feels and sounds good. If it's manual is the clutch slipping? If it's DCT are the shifts not strong when on 4 or higher? Go with your gut, the PPI will tell you the rest.

- take note of cheap tires or worn brakes... these are indicators that the owner did not have the money to maintain the car as well as they should have.

there's a lot of variables with these cars and they're starting to get a little older so issues will arise. Every car is different.

Just don't skimp on the PPI and the CarFax. Don't be lazy and not call the dealer on the Carfax.

Due diligence is particularly important when buying a car like this. If you buy a turd and try to sell it, the next guy will do his research. And you'll be the one stuck without a chair when the music stops.
What helpful feedback! Great post.
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      10-04-2018, 09:38 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Autocheck is better than Carfax.
That's what I thought. I initially did Autocheck only. While it was helpful with DMV info, it gave me no info on the service records, at all.

Personally- I'd do both. Small price to pay, IMO.

Side note, OP- if you want me to pull an autocheck for you I've got about 15 left that need to be used in the next week or so.
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      10-04-2018, 11:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
- Carfax at a minimum, Autocheck optional.

This will show you if the car has been in an accident and how many owners it's had. If it's low miles be weary of more than an owner or two. You'll also want to see the service history on the Carfax... It'll have the dealership's name. CALL THEM or go there and have them tell you what the car has had repaired. For my car it just said "Serviced" which is lazy on the service writer's part because when I called the dealer it was more like "fuel pump replaced, lower control arm replaced, wheel repaired" — so... Don't trust Carfax in and of itself. It's a tool to be used during your investigation. Also- if throttle actuators have been done- awesome. Rod Bearings won't show up on a Carfax because it's not warranty work and nobody goes to the stealership for that (so if it were done, may not be reported). Rod bearings are preventative, engine replacement is the result of not doing rod bearings (and qualifies as warranty work). In short, you won't know if rod bearings have been done without a receipt, if they've not been, expect to do them.

- Take the car in for a pre purchase inspection but MAKE SURE to take it to a proper euro shop. Read their Google reviews, read their Facebook reviews, read through their website, make sure they they're the right people to do a PPI on your semi-collectible-ish high performance German sports car.

- receipts. Get receipts from the owner for anything that was done. Even if it's just general maintenance. Verify this against the dealership's info.

- search the VIN on google. Click every link. Don't buy anything if you end up on some "car history report" BS page though. You're looking for anything pertaining to previous sales.

- google the owner's name. You'll want to know if he has a YouTube Channel called "Best M3 Burnouts" or some crap.

- look the owner up on Facebook. If you know him, shoot him a friend request. If not, creep on him if he's not private. Make sure there are no "it's in the shop again for that transmission rattle" type posts.

- obviously drive the car. If you're not close by, have a member or someone you know drive the car. Make sure it feels and sounds good. If it's manual is the clutch slipping? If it's DCT are the shifts not strong when on 4 or higher? Go with your gut, the PPI will tell you the rest.

- take note of cheap tires or worn brakes... these are indicators that the owner did not have the money to maintain the car as well as they should have.

there's a lot of variables with these cars and they're starting to get a little older so issues will arise. Every car is different.

Just don't skimp on the PPI and the CarFax. Don't be lazy and not call the dealer on the Carfax.

Due diligence is particularly important when buying a car like this. If you buy a turd and try to sell it, the next guy will do his research. And you'll be the one stuck without a chair when the music stops.
Thats some Great information,Thank you!

So i looked up the car and it said that there is a Lien reported on the car. Last service done for this car was 4 years ago. It has ran only 20k miles and the dealer bought the car from the auction. I called the dealer and he said theres no Lien on it anymore, i asked him for a picture of the title of the car and he said the previous owner has the title and he is out of town.
Im confused. And i live like 4 hours drive away.

Last edited by iAjking; 10-04-2018 at 12:26 PM..
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      10-04-2018, 12:30 PM   #7
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So i looked up the VIN on google and it turns out that this car was owned by someone who was involved in a $100M scheme. So the government took the car and the house and now hes in Jail. Then the car was sold at an auction which was bought by this dealer.
The whole process was so interesting that it makes me want the car even more!
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      10-04-2018, 01:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iAjking View Post
So i looked up the VIN on google and it turns out that this car was owned by someone who was involved in a $100M scheme. So the government took the car and the house and now hes in Jail. Then the car was sold at an auction which was bought by this dealer.
The whole process was so interesting that it makes me want the car even more!
Good lord. This would make me want the car even less haha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by iAjking View Post
previous owner has the title and he is out of town
Sounds like shenanigans are afoot.

If the car was purchased from an auction by a private dealer, the dealership would have the title or it would be in processing or en route to the dealer. The previous owner having it sounds fishy. The new dealership, if having purchased the car from auction, wouldn't even know who the previous owner is, and him knowing where the previous owner is... also not adding up.

If the car is sitting on a lot and being sold in some sort of consignment deal, that could make sense, but then it negates the whole auction thing. Unless it was bought at auction by a private party and being sold on a used car lot in a consignment deal?

That's tipped my scales in the "too many strange questions" direction. Seems like it would be easier to find another M3.

A few months ago there was an Alpine White e92 coupe on Craigslist in Tampa for a crazy low price with no title. The car was probably stolen.

Honestly, there are plenty of good E9Xs M3s on the market. I'd be cautious about tying yourself to one with a questionable history.

If it seems too good to be true....
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      10-04-2018, 01:49 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjm41 View Post
The new dealership, if having purchased the car from auction, wouldn't even know who the previous owner is, and him knowing where the previous owner is... also not adding up.
Excatly!!
I dont know if there are any consignment deals between the dealer and a private party.
And it is wayy easier to find another M3 but this one is like a steal if the papers are in order! because of the low mileage and im sure i can negotiate the price lower too! I didnt think it was legal to sell a car by a dealer without having possession of the title.
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      10-04-2018, 02:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iAjking View Post
Excatly!!
I dont know if there are any consignment deals between the dealer and a private party.
And it is wayy easier to find another M3 but this one is like a steal if the papers are in order! because of the low mileage and im sure i can negotiate the price lower too! I didnt think it was legal to sell a car by a dealer without having possession of the title.
Dealerships won't always have the title on-hand, especially if there was a previous lean and it's fresh inventory. The dealer may be waiting for the title, and they're not going to title it in the dealership's name (they'd have to pay tax, it would account for an owner on the CF/AC which can effect value, etc).

It can take the bank a couple weeks to get a title cut and mailed (I believe they do a "lien release" in many states and you take that to the DMV and apply for one), and a small dealer wants to move the inventory as fast as possible since they may have the car privately financed.

Every state is different, but you should be able to purchase a car and simply receive a bill of sale. If you are buying it with a loan, you won't ever see the title anyway as the bank owns the car, not you.

Also- remember, the title comes from the state and not the dealer. Because you're buying out of state you'll need to take your bill of sale to your local DMV, pay taxes, and apply for a title. When you buy a car privately, the seller usually gives you the title along with a bill of sale, as proof their is no lien. If you buy from a dealer and you aren't buying the car cash or with an UNSECURED loan, you'll simply pay tax/reg and the title will go to the financier.

All of that said....

I would highly recommend against purchasing a car with a weird history sight unseen.
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      10-04-2018, 02:25 PM   #11
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You're right. This car seems way too sketchy as it is. I'm Gonna call the MVA in Maryland and see what the laws are here with owning a car like that.
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      10-04-2018, 04:26 PM   #12
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So i called the DMV and they said that it is illegal to sell a car without a Clear title. So if the dealer provides me a picture of the clear title then ill go ahead with the car. If not, its just not smart to proceed
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      10-04-2018, 05:20 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iAjking View Post
So i called the DMV and they said that it is illegal to sell a car without a Clear title. So if the dealer provides me a picture of the clear title then ill go ahead with the car. If not, its just not smart to proceed
Google: (state car is in) DMV lien status.

When the site comes up, click on it and enter your VIN.

Autocheck, as of today, still reports my car as having a lien.

However, Florida DMV reports my car as having no lien (paid cash... well, cashiers check, I'm not a rapper in a strip club), with a title print date of the day I bought the car.

I don't know about the laws state-to-state, or how dealerships work.

But still, with the car's history... at least have someone go look at it and take it for a PPI.

Honestly... I hate to see fellow enthusiasts taken for a ride. I have been (not with the M3, but with a Mustang a long time ago). Let this thread serve as a cautionary tale of buying out-of-state cars site unseen:

https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1509685

That's the last warning I'm going to give on this thread! Good luck man, hopefully you'll come out on top with a killer ride at a great price. Keep us posted!
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      10-04-2018, 07:35 PM   #14
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I just read his post and oh man that is scary! I hope it doesn't happen to any of us enthusiasts.
Thank you so much for all the information that you've provided. I've decided that I am not going to go see the car and do PPI untill and unless i get the Picture of the Title. He said he will send the picture on monday.
Ill post the updates
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      10-04-2018, 11:30 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Autocheck is better than Carfax.
I wouldn't trust Autocheck. My M3 shows no accidents in it, but then ran a Carfax and it shows there was one. Rear ended no airbag deployed.
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      10-05-2018, 01:38 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skorpiond View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOOF-M3 View Post
Autocheck is better than Carfax.
I wouldn't trust Autocheck. My M3 shows no accidents in it, but then ran a Carfax and it shows there was one. Rear ended no airbag deployed.
Funny, same thing just happened to OP but it showed on Autocheck but not Carfax. Run them both together I guess would be the best answer. Did the seller know this and not disclose?
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      10-05-2018, 07:00 AM   #17
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Here are some free car history report websites....
Vehiclehistory.com
mycarfax.com
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