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      12-07-2011, 01:43 PM   #1
niqui
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Dealer problems - Advice please

Hi guys
this is not BMW related, but id still appreciate the help. I am pissed and dont know what to honestly do.

We have a Porsche Panamea 2011, with 20 000 km on it. bought brand new from the dealer. Its driven to work and back nearly every day, and has never sat more than a week.

the brakes have been shakey for a while, it went in for service and they say the brakes are all rusted and need to be replaced, but we are 2 weeks over warranty for them. We did the claim process with Porsche Germany, they rejected it - the dealer says they think the car has sat for too long (it never has sat more than 4 days in a row in a garage).

Now, they essentially sayd to go open a claim with Porsche Canada to say we are dissatisfied - they are pretty much saying we are the dealer and it is fully upto Porsche to cover it or not

Its a 120k+ car thats 3 weeks out of first year warranty , bought brand new from them...what the hell do i do?
I have been very civil so far, and they have my car and i have their loaner currently.

Funny, cause I was supposed to get a gt3rs next year...

thks for the help

Nick
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      12-07-2011, 02:04 PM   #2
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If you are actually going to purchase a GT3RS next year I think they would do it
for you. Have you mentioned to them you are going to buy one? You are out of
warranty so there is no reason for them to want to cover it for you 120k car or not.
But if a future sale of say 100k+ will be jeopardized because of them not covering the
brakes/rotors for you then I think they will do it for you. If they dont, take your business elsewhere.
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      12-07-2011, 02:05 PM   #3
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Hi Nick,

Some questions...

1) are you in a major Canadian city?
2) when was your last service on this car?
3) do you have a main German address and contact phone number?

Here is why I am asking these questions;-

A) if in a major Canadian city did you go all the way to the Dealer / Owner if not you should and instil upon them that you will not let this ride and express your disappointment as a customer.

B) If the last service on this car was very resent you need to find out why this was not brought earlier to your attention. Wy are you being informed of this now that the warranty has passed? Surely the breaks did not rust up in the past 3 weeks!

I would let this dealership (the one you purchased the car from and had it serviced in the past) know in no uncertain terms that this would be the last Porsche you ever purchased and that spreading the wort of mouth will be very powerful and it will certainly impact future sales at his dealership. There are avenues like forums, news papers, Ombudsman and local television stations. You need to put your foot down and don't let go if you strongly believe that you are being taken for a ride.

C) Do file the claim and follow up with Porsche Headquarters in Germany. They all speak English very well, write to them include evedence of past maintenance reports/bills/invoices then follow up with phone calls.

Stick to your guns Nick and Good Luck,

Cheers,

Rolf-Dieter

PS. Did you post this in the Porsche forum also? Do others have a similar issue with this Porsche Model? Might it be a faulty brake issue if so this would be a safety issue.
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Last edited by Mr. ///M3 RD; 12-07-2011 at 02:13 PM.. Reason: minor typo corrected and PS added
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      12-07-2011, 02:09 PM   #4
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Is this a common issue with the Panamera's, I'm actually going shopping for a porsche, possible a panamera in the next few months...this is the first I've heard Porsche taking a hardline...
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      12-07-2011, 02:20 PM   #5
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Is the warranty that short in Canada? You have a one year old car, should still be covered. You may want to post on 6speedonline, there is some traffic on the Panamera forum there.
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      12-07-2011, 02:35 PM   #6
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Say if they don't make it right, Porsche and that dealership will lose your business and you'll change your mind about that gt3rs you were thinking about getting and get a M6 instead.
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      12-07-2011, 02:56 PM   #7
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Wow, I would never buy a porsche or any car with a 1 year warranty! Maintence or full, either way.

However I don't get why people expect a company to cover them in a situation like this. Before buying the car you knew ahead of time you had a 1 year warranty. You agreed to pay the 100k plus knowning this. They gave you the 1 year and now its over. Now its your responsiblity. Yes its nice if they do it for free for you but by no means should that influence your willing to buy that brand again-if it does your expectations are unrealistic and you are being entitled just because you spent 100 plus k. Everyone one of their customers spent the money you did so you are not a "high roller" to them necessarily.

The only way I see it their fault is if you did have the car in recently and they did not bring attention to this before warranty is up. Also rusted rotors are not a big deal-heavy braking gets ride of it, if that truly all it is.

I hope they cover you but don't buy something if you are not willing to play by the rules
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      12-07-2011, 03:44 PM   #8
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This may not help you. But brakes are one of the easiest things you can change on a car. Be it a $20k car or a $120k car. If the dealer does not want to do a warranty claim take it to an independent shop or buy the parts online and do it yourself.

Sorry for the heartache I think Porsche should step up and change them for you.

I would not really take this incident that far for not purchasing that GT3 that you are thinking about.
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      12-07-2011, 03:46 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nine View Post
Is this a common issue with the Panamera's, I'm actually going shopping for a porsche, possible a panamera in the next few months...this is the first I've heard Porsche taking a hardline...
Porsche is almost always near the top. Porsche and their 3.4,3.6,and 3.8 liter engines are almost perfect.

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      12-07-2011, 04:35 PM   #10
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Presuming you have a relationship with your preferred salesperson at the dealership you might want to let them know that a service issue is threatening the GT3RS sale. I guarantee you the salesperson or their manager will end up talking to the dealership GM and or owner very quickly...
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      12-07-2011, 04:41 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdollie View Post
Presuming you have a relationship with your preferred salesperson at the dealership you might want to let them know that a service issue is threatening the GT3RS sale. I guarantee you the salesperson or their manager will end up talking to the dealership GM and or owner very quickly...
What right does he have to be making ultimatums to the dealer. He is OUT OF WARRANTY! its not like they are denying a warranty claim within warrant for something he did to his brakes or by letting it sit without driving it or whatever. It is out of warranty, he signed and agreed to this. If he does not want to buy a gt3rs than they will find someone else who does. Porsche is not hurting.

I don't like how people, no matter how much money they have feel entitled to getting a "deal" or something for free. If you have the money to get a gt3 then why not pay up for your brakes on a car YOU agreed to drive with only 1 year of warranty.

Ridiculous!
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      12-07-2011, 04:48 PM   #12
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I think you're missing the point. Brakes on a 1 year old car that are used frequently should not rust up to the point of replacement regardless of what the warranty says. It simply doesn't meet expectations of a reasonable owner for a $20k car or a $120k car. Had this been a wear item then you could hold the owner at fault but unless the car was abused (e.g., parked in 9 inches of salt water at a boat ramp) it is reasonable for the owner to expect at least an investigation by the manufacturer if not some good will support.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ateam View Post
What right does he have to be making ultimatums to the dealer. He is OUT OF WARRANTY! its not like they are denying a warranty claim within warrant for something he did to his brakes or by letting it sit without driving it or whatever. It is out of warranty, he signed and agreed to this. If he does not want to buy a gt3rs than they will find someone else who does. Porsche is not hurting.

I don't like how people, no matter how much money they have feel entitled to getting a "deal" or something for free. If you have the money to get a gt3 then why not pay up for your brakes on a car YOU agreed to drive with only 1 year of warranty.

Ridiculous!
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      12-07-2011, 04:57 PM   #13
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Each dealer has a "goodwill" budget that this should fit perfectly into. I agree that this issue doesn't appear to be wear related so given the short amount of time since warranty expiration and the fact the he is looking at a GT3RS, his expectations are normal. There is more than one Porsche dealership in Ontario, OP have you tried contacting another one?

EDIT: I notice you may not be from Ontario - my point remains the same. Contact another dealership
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      12-07-2011, 05:10 PM   #14
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Thanks for all the replies

1) to those of you who think i have no right or shouldnt expect the dealer to do anything: I understand partially, but you need context. I had no idea that the brake warranty was 1 yr, but regardless, the car has been to porsche 3 times since we bought it for recalls. It is lady driven by and quite frankly she doesnt know the name of the car model half the time, so expecting her to notice her brakes rusting on her own is fairly far fetched. It makes absolutely no sense that brakes with 20k of very light driving and never sitting for more than a few days could need to be replaced after a year, let alone rust. That is my bone of contention. Everybody at work can vouch and witness to seeing the car everyday for the past year. The fact that this came out 2 weeks out of warranty leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Yes, perhaps we should have been more vigilant earlier, but I guess we did not expect that . It is fine if something goes after warranty is up and it is from wear and tear, but brakes dont rust in 2 weeks.

2) thanks for the help Rolf - yes, I am in MTL. It has been to the dealer a few times, they told us about it about 3 weeks back when we sent the car in for winter tires and defective seat heaters....2 weeks out of brake warranty

3) we are filing the porsche headquarter report

4) regarding the gt3; I dunno, i thought that was a fairly immature card to play with the guy, but i dont think i have much choice but to remind him, and quite frankly, id buy it from the other dealer now if at all.
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      12-07-2011, 05:28 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post
Is the warranty that short in Canada? You have a one year old car, should still be covered. You may want to post on 6speedonline, there is some traffic on the Panamera forum there.
I think it is the same all over North America ... warranty appears to be NOT transferable from one owner to the next (like in the case of BMW's), however, Porsche offers warranty extensions ... if info is required one needs to Google that there are PDF files on the Net.
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      12-07-2011, 05:35 PM   #16
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you may be able to put 50 hard miles on them and allow for proper cool down and get them back into shape. I would try that before getting too worried.
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      12-07-2011, 05:40 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by jdemetry View Post
you may be able to put 50 hard miles on them and allow for proper cool down and get them back into shape. I would try that before getting too worried.
could u give me instructions please? ill give it a shot...i get the drift, like bed them?

rather not make it worse, so any clarification would be greaT?
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      12-07-2011, 05:46 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by niqui View Post
could u give me instructions please? ill give it a shot...i get the drift, like bed them?

rather not make it worse, so any clarification would be greaT?
Don't do this Nick! your breaks are your first line of defence don't gamble with your life. Follow your claim and go ofter the head .... in this case Porsche AG Germany to put this dealership in it's place.

BTW. was your warranty only one year? or did you purchase this Porsche 2nd hand and it came only with a 1 year warranty extension part of the price you paid? Was the warranty issue not explained to you properly? I'm just wondering, perhaps things are different in Canada.
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      12-07-2011, 05:53 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by niqui View Post
could u give me instructions please? ill give it a shot...i get the drift, like bed them?

rather not make it worse, so any clarification would be greaT?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolf-Dieter View Post
Don't do this Nick! your breaks are your first line of defence don't gamble with your life. Follow your claim and go ofter the head .... in this case Porsche AG Germany to put this dealership in it's place.

BTW. was your warranty only one year? or did you purchase this Porsche 2nd hand and it came only with a 1 year warranty extension part of the price you paid? Was the warranty issue not explained to you properly? I'm just wondering, perhaps things are different in Canada.
Rolf, it's not dangerous if nobody is on the road. All he has to do is get up to speed and slam on the brakes to clean them off.
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      12-07-2011, 05:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=Hot|Ice=- View Post
Rolf, it's not dangerous if nobody is on the road. All he has to do is get up to speed and slam on the brakes to clean them off.

I hope this in not your advice on how to bed pads


Bedding pads is not dangerous assuming there is pad and rotor left.

Sorry to hear this happened Nick. Definitely push Porsche Canada if you are just outide of warranty. Would have thought the dealer might have pushed harder or at least offered some sort of goodwill. Hope you get it sorted

Curious to know how badly the brakes could have rusted within a year
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      12-07-2011, 06:01 PM   #21
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Quote:
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I hope this in not your advice on how to bed pads


Bedding pads is not dangerous assuming there is pad and rotor left.

Sorry to hear this happened Nick. Definitely push Porsche Canada if you are just outide of warranty. Would have thought the dealer might have pushed harder or at least offered some sort of goodwill. Hope you get it sorted

Curious to know how badly the brakes could have rusted within a year
No, it's my advice on how to get rid of the rust on the rotors.I've done it on an empty road and it worked for me. Not sure if it will work for him as his case seems to be bad. Brake pads need to be bedded in gently.
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You sound like my buddies who have AMG's - Slam the gas, slam the brakes...
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      12-07-2011, 06:09 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twinbo View Post
Each dealer has a "goodwill" budget that this should fit perfectly into. I agree that this issue doesn't appear to be wear related so given the short amount of time since warranty expiration and the fact the he is looking at a GT3RS, his expectations are normal.
Completely agree.

Good luck OP. This kind of premature wear doesn't sound normal.
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