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[playground]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

Vorsteiner??? Please explain? Or link me to something?

They claimed to have their products made in USA when a member here on bimmerpost uncovered that they largely import from China.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=473671

They advertised that they used only the highest in quality materials, however the truth was that they used low-quality resin.

Originally Posted by Soorena

It's a shame that companies like ADV.1, Meisterschaft, Vorsteiner... Completely rip people off with their cheap made products yet admins let them participate in their forums. SMH

+1...

These companies should be buried dead long time ago. It's quite a shame how they still lurk around automotive community forums, not only bimmerpost.
Bad customer service and low-grade quality materials.

I'm going to compile everything into 1 thread if you guys wish to know more about these poor practicing companies located in the USofA.

[swamp2]

Originally Posted by Hai_Cheo

LOL.

Guy, what are you talking about? All the aforementioned companies use THE SAME EXACT HARDWARE. Which explains why i've replaced a "360 forged" lip with an "ISS" lip, WHY? BECAUSE THEYRE BOTH COR LIPS.

Consistensy, it really takes no special skill to start a wheel company, it's a common formula that has been repeated, same hardware, same parts, essentially same wheel.

You did not say lips, you said "Essentially ALL 'Forged' Wheel companies come from the same place, MHT/COR". The strong implication there is that the entire wheel is identical. But again same point, one can use identical lips/barrels and have an entirely different center and the center part can and often is the limiting part of a wheel assembly. Obviously not all of these companies in question use identical centers.

Also, you are misspeaking again, "hardware" most often means fasteners, but can also mean machinery.

[Detroit M3]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

Vorsteiner??? Please explain? Or link me to something?

I' ll be honest, vorsteiners carbon fiber quality looks pretty good but I see a lot of fitment issues with their products just rolling around at car meets.

[Kwando]

Looking forward to the TUV certification, MORR!

I know it's getting off-topic, but any more info about Meisterschaft business practices? Never heard about it. I've always liked their exhausts.

[aus]

Originally Posted by **********

Our wheels are not made at MHT and/or COR. We do not work with them nor have we ever worked with any of them in the almost 10 years we have been in business. This is not to say they make or don't make a quality product, this is simply to clarify the statement above regarding MORR being affiliated with the companies mentioned above (which we are not) and have never been.

All of three components (inner, outer and center) we use on 3PC wheels are all fully forged aluminum. We source all of our materials only from industry leaders such as APP, ARS, ARP, etc and all are made in USA. We do all of our design, engineering, assembly, inspection, packaging, etc in house. Our manufacturing process, material selection, suppliers, design, engineering, and machining is all very particular to us. Our products are 100% made in USA. We built every single one of our wheels according to TUV standards and using only TUV recommended minimum load ratings and we make sure these load ratings can support forces up to 1.3g for the application they are been built for, just in case. Every wheel is built with an OEM brake layout (directly from TUV) in order to guarantee proper clearance. We run Finite Element Analysis on every single wheel application we manufacture and the customer can request test results on their wheels once completed, which is something only a few companies, if any, do. Our machining, especially our tool passes and surfacing are all proprietary to us. The intricate designs and functional aesthetics that go into our wheel designs take about 2.5-3 hours per center to machine, when most others out there take less than an hour, in order to reduce cost. Our bolts are plated to increase strength and reduce corrosion. Our backpad is lighten, provides channels for water flow (to prevent vibrations) and is designed for proper torque load. All wheels are application specific, profile specific, and engineered per order. All these details add up... We are in the process of being TUV-Verified as well.

Our build process is also a bit different. Most wheel companies out there use standards, where they determine a certain range of concavity profiles and fitment, lathe-turn the raw forgings, and put them on a shelf. When an order comes in, they just machine the vehicle fitment information as well as the spoke design into the centers, and send it out to finish. At MORR, all of our wheels get engineered on a per-order basis. This means that whenever an order comes in, engineering starts from scratch to match the customers specific needs, and make the set of wheels specific to you vehicle, and to your order. We start by maximizing the concavity profile specific to your car, then weight optimize the wheels specifically for your car and to your needs, and then run FEA simulations on your specific set of wheels. Every set of wheels takes roughly 16-hours of application specific engineering before it ever hits the machines. Engineering then signs off on the wheels, and to production they go. Does this cost us more? Absolutely. But being that we're a niche, boutique wheel company, we have the luxury of having an incredible engineering staff in-house, and never having to cut corners. Once everything is all done, we assemble the wheels by hand for utmost care taking about 2 hours per wheel for a skilled craftsman to assemble them. They are then tested for lateral and radial runout, and once approved, they are delicately packaged for proper shipping.

We are proud to say we have one of the most qualified wheel designers in the industry on staff, and our company is ran by a professional, graduated engineer. How a wheel companies nowadays operate without any engineers on staff boggles us; it is not surprising to see the disasters we have seen lately.

We have been in business for almost a decade. We have learned a lot of things on the way. We cannot say that our products are of better quality than the names above because that's not for us to say. But, what we CAN say with assurance, is that our wheels are one of the highest quality wheels you can buy, and only a select few can come close to them.

If you have any questions, please feel free to email us to call us and we'd be happy to discuss. Cheers!

AWESOME job Carlos!!!
Once you're TUV, you're in a TOTALLY different class as all these other fly by night companies.
I've had MORR wheels on my wife's 335 since 2007 and tracked them a few times too. No issues at all.

.

[playground]

Originally Posted by Kwando

Looking forward to the TUV certification, MORR!

I know it's getting off-topic, but any more info about Meisterschaft business practices? Never heard about it. I've always liked their exhausts.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=443755

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=171815

http://www.gtrlife.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=40641

http://mbworld.org/forums/clk-class-...nhaus-com.html

They replicated name brand exhausts and sold it as the original. Meisterschaft is a fake, and will always be a fake. Meisterschaft's exhausts are no better then the ones on ebay, simply put.

[p7r4e7y]

Originally Posted by playground

Because ADV and 360forged produce wheels that look good. They don't meet safety standards.

Marketing is everything now a days, perception plays a big role here. People automatically think that the wheels are quality just because Ferrari/Super car owners roll on them. Most super car owners don't even drive their car, surely enough the "safety" of these kinds of wheels can be never tested in real life scenarios by supercar owners.

Forged wheels are like breast implants, sure they look like a million dollars but they will never come close to feeling like the real thing. Silicone or materials used in the breast implant could be fatal to the person in the short or long-run just like using lower grade materials (third world country imports) for forging a rim.

I am not trying to technically "bash" on a company, but I just want to keep the buyers aware of what they are truly getting.



Here we are with some more information to back my claim.

http://www.importgenius.com/importers/cor-llc

http://www.importgenius.com/supplier...yin-industrial

Now you can throw this "proudly made in USA" idea in the trash. Any so called "american made" forged wheel is just as bad as Rota's made in the philippines...

Knowledge is everything in this world, it is what keeps us safe and make the right choices. I hope you guys understand I do love the look of forged wheels, but the quality is what sets me back from actually owning them.

you make good points

knowledge is everything... unfortunately tho it is true, the adv1s do meet safety standards but those standards are set by the company the manufacturers the wheel. there is testing done but not nearly to the extent of tuv testing.

adv1s popularity is an evolution of jordan coming to full terms with how to market a product to a select group, as i have yet to see them run consistently in motorsport events

lets look at the rest of the truth here if you want a pretty wheel adv1s are fine. in reality they are manufactured by one of the largest wheel manufacturers in the united states. the problem is with the size.. a 22 or even 20in wheel with thin spokes shouldnt be on a car that is driven in a performance manner. even smaller wheels will loose structural integrity after as little as 2 years depending on how much stress is applied to them.

so i was in the car that cor forged wheel was on when it broke as an instructor...hell thats my picture..... i shouldnt have been in it because i questioned it before he even started the car. but i did because we have a general trust that the product will stand up to what the seller says its good for. i was wrong, and it breaking 30 seconds later could have cost me my life.

in the end it snot every forged wheel that is bad!!!! just look at the wheel if it looks too light and thin to drive hard then it probably is. but if its so good looking that you want it anyway, then this whole thread is a waste of your time its doubtful that you will do any harm to the wheels with it hardparked for photos.

but.... what do i know im just a random guy sitting at a computer, i dont even own a bmw

[p7r4e7y]

i was wrong thats not my picture... the caps werent on the wheels at the track
see

[AlexTek]

Nice pic
:-/

[Antonio1988]

Absolute BS, I wouldn't use anything other than a one piece from a trusted racing company or an OEM wheel

[AlexTek]

Originally Posted by Antonio1988

Absolute BS, I wouldn't use anything other than a one piece from a trusted racing company or an OEM wheel

I would only buy:
BBS
OZ Racing
Rays Engineering

Nothing else.

[Antonio1988]

Originally Posted by AlexTek

I would only buy:
BBS
OZ Racing
Rays Engineering

Nothing else.

Pretty much sums it up... adv 1 is trash, plain and simple. Same goes for 360

[Soorena]

Originally Posted by playground

I'm going to compile everything into 1 thread if you guys wish to know more about these poor practicing companies located in the USofA.

That would be very appreciated. It seems a lot of people don't know about shady companies in here.

[lsmkr01]

So the whole Meisterschaft exhaust line is just a continuation (rebadging) of the fake Eisenmann exhaust GTHaus was pushing as authentic????????????????

[playground]

Originally Posted by lsmkr01

So the whole Meisterschaft exhaust line is just a continuation (rebadging) of the fake Eisenmann exhaust GTHaus was pushing as authentic????????????????

Yup.

Originally Posted by Soorena

That would be very appreciated. It seems a lot of people on here don't know about shady companies in here.

Perhaps I shall.

By the way, nice rides

[Soorena]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

Vorsteiner??? Please explain? Or link me to something?

I was one of the very first people to get Vorsteiner's M6 hood. And i must say at first everything looked good. I had some troubles with fitment, but they were minor and Peter was a great guy to deal with. But after a few months the hood started to fall into pieces. Below the hood big cracks could be seen here and there. And then all of a sudden Peter was out of reach like forever. The vendor i got the hood from blamed me for not installing the hood properly and excuses like that. Poor piece backed by poor customer service. Just great.

Originally Posted by playground

Perhaps I shall.

By the way, nice rides

Thanks and Thanks.

Originally Posted by lsmkr01

So the whole Meisterschaft exhaust line is just a continuation (rebadging) of the fake Eisenmann exhaust GTHaus was pushing as authentic????????????????

They used to be. In older days you would get a quality exhaust from Meisterschaft as it was a rebadged Eisenmann untill Eisenmann found out about it. At that point everybody thought it's a game-over thing for EisenHaus. But just shortly after that event GTHaus was brought by the same group that ran EisenHaus before. If you ask GTHaus people they will tell you they no longer sell rebadged Eisenmann's and the fact is, they don't. They figured out there is a better way to make money and that's copying others work, building their very cheaped-out and shiny version products in South Korea and sell them under a very German name: Meisterschaft. The most famous victim of GTHaus is Kreissieg and their Gallardo exhaust. Now fanbois of GTHaus, surprisingly there are a handful of them out there, will tell you it's all BS and their exhaust sound best and the welds are holding together like champs but the truth is GTHaus is a shady company which doesn't desrve to get any financial support from any customer.

[AlexTek]

If you buy wheels they should be:
-BBS
-Advan
-OZ
-Rays Eng (Volk, Gram light, etc)

If you buy exhaust:
-Akra

Nothing else!

[M3PO]

Originally Posted by Soorena

They used to be. In older days you would get a quality exhaust from Meisterschaft as it was a rebadged Eisenmann untill Eisenmann found out about it. At that point everybody thought it's a game-over thing for EisenHaus. But just shortly after that event GTHaus was brought by the same group that ran EisenHaus before. If you ask GTHaus people they will tell you they no longer sell rebadged Eisenmann's and the fact is, they don't. They figured out there is a better way to make money and that's copying others work, building their very cheaped-out and shiny version products in South Korea and sell them under a very German name: Meisterschaft. The most famous victim of GTHaus is Kreissieg and their Gallardo exhaust. Now fanbois of GTHaus, surprisingly there are a handful of them out there, will tell you it's all BS and their exhaust sound best and the welds are holding together like champs but the truth is GTHaus is a shady company which doesn't desrve to get any financial support from any customer.

I don't consider myself a "fanboi" and I don't care for their history (or their current customer service) but I will say this. The one I had WAS a high quality exhaust and the welds were great. People in Korea CAN weld. Also, I have had a dozen exhausts on this car and while it is subjective, that exhaust sounded the best. I still miss it. It was just too loud so I sold it.

[s65e90]

Originally Posted by AlexTek

If you buy wheels they should be:
-BBS
-Advan
-OZ
-Rays Eng (Volk, Gram light, etc)

If you buy exhaust:
-Akra

Nothing else!

Ignorant post. Akra ain't all that!

[ms372]

Originally Posted by M3PO

I don't consider myself a "fanboi" and I don't care for their history (or their current customer service) but I will say this. The one I had WAS a high quality exhaust and the welds were great. People in Korea CAN weld. Also, I have had a dozen exhausts on this car and while it is subjective, that exhaust sounded the best. I still miss it. It was just too loud so I sold it.

+1 i had a GT2 for a few years on the car and had no issue at all. The GT2 is the best sound muffler for this car and the welds and the fit and finish was great.

[JPH704]

I'm late, Interesting read... Bump from the grave.

[NuclearSymphony]

Originally Posted by playground

They claimed to have their products made in USA when a member here on bimmerpost uncovered that they largely import from China.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=473671

They advertised that they used only the highest in quality materials, however the truth was that they used low-quality resin.

Since this thread is back, I'm a bit fuzzy on your statement here. I have no particular affinity towards Vorsteiner, but nowhere in the thread you quoted was it proven that any Vorsteiner products were imported from China, nor were any facts stated of their resin quality.

Start to finish, here were the items I believe you were referring to - every one of which was pure conjecture:

Originally Posted by lpphreakx06

They probably get their stuff done over in china as well.

Originally Posted by Mr. 5

(OP) My body shop brought up to Vorsteiner about how they are getting everything from China. They completely and 100% denied that.

Originally Posted by E92murdered

it maybe true what your body shop says it is most likely true because of cheap labor materials.

Originally Posted by josephr25

Sorry to hear about that... all the comments from others are probably true.
.

Originally Posted by Inspired

Originally Posted by kWonM3

It's only take about 2 weeks the most to make the trunk and get it ship out the door.

Now we know it's not made in the USA at all.

I count two "probably"s, one "most likely", and one speculative book cover pic, all of which are guesses and personal e-pinions. Perhaps you meant to quote a different thread? And despite this thread, which showed definitive proof of materials, vacuum molding, and just about the entire production process, there were still accusations of "no production proof".

Massive lead times and previous fitment issues notwithstanding, it seems a bit unfair to add further unproven statements to a company's reputation. But yeah, months and months for a hood (and then with a crack in it) would certainly drive me batty too, no matter who was making/selling it!

I guess I would be mostly in the camp of the poor guy (cookie295) who waited over half a year for his Vorsteiner part, in that I really prefer to give companies the benefit of the doubt, to a point. Mainly because I've been on the other side of the fence in the retail arena before - but of course, that definitely doesn't excuse bad communication during the process.

All of the negative aura surrounding their reputation is truly a shame, too, since some of their parts truly do look amazing. I really didn't think anyone could actually improve on a McLaren MP4 until I saw what they did with one.