E92 M3 ZCP in SCCA Solo F Street

[Blue Gumby]

I see the argument for wider rim for sure. In my STR MX-5 the extra weight of a passenger can definetly be seen thru the times. You can feel the car is not as snappy. My MX-5 weight in at 2350 at a Pro event. Not sure how much a difference is the M3 with a passenger. Trying to find a low option, non sunroof Comp Package is like chasing a unicorn.

[m3peat]

Originally Posted by Blue Gumby

I see the argument for wider rim for sure. In my STR MX-5 the extra weight of a passenger can definetly be seen thru the times. You can feel the car is not as snappy. My MX-5 weight in at 2350 at a Pro event. Not sure how much a difference is the M3 with a passenger. Trying to a low option, non sunroof Comp Package is like chasing a unicorn.

I have a Low option DCT/Comp Pkg no sunroof car for sale

[chono]

Here's the ideal E90 for the F-Street:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1080835

(No affiliation - its in my area though.)

-'chono'

[Rexpelagi]

Originally Posted by chono

Here's the ideal E90 for the F-Street:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1080835

(No affiliation - its in my area though.)

-'chono'

That is a great looking car, but being a 4-door without the CF roof it will be a touch heavier than some other options. It probably isn't enough weight to even be noticeable though.

[chono]

Ideal **E90** for F-Street. For those with a family to haul.

We all know that the ideal **BMW** for F-Street is the M235i.
And we all know that the ideal **car** for F-Street is a Boss 302.

(I kid, I kid..)


-'chono'

[Rexpelagi]

Originally Posted by chono

Ideal **E90** for F-Street. For those with a family to haul.

We all know that the ideal **BMW** for F-Street is the M235i.
And we all know that the ideal **car** for F-Street is a Boss 302.

(I kid, I kid..)


-'chono'

I kinda glossed over the E90 part - fair point. :-)

I don't disagree on the Boss though, although that is up for debate.

[Blue Gumby]

So what's our option for shocks. MCS like Richbot or DA TC Kline. I had AST and Penske before, the only thing that I didn't like was the amount of maintenance needed to keep them in tip top shape. My local shock builder recommends a rebuild every year if it's street driven. I assume twintube will not to be serviced as often as high end monotube?

[Rexpelagi]

Originally Posted by Blue Gumby

So what's our option for shocks. MCS like Richbot or DA TC Kline. I had AST and Penske before, the only thing that I didn't like was the amount of maintenance needed to keep them in tip top shape. My local shock builder recommends a rebuild every year if it's street driven. I assume twintube will not to be serviced as often as high end monotube?

I'm going to try the stock ZCP setup at least initially. If it isn't hateful I'll probably keep it. If it is hateful I'm thinking MCS non-remotes. I think the listed price is $3350, not sure what they would be through my parts guy (Strano). I really don't want to have to go to that though - Konis are as far as I've been willing to go on most vehicles based on price.

[Richbot]

FWIW, the MCS have about 30k street miles plus autocross/track stuff and have no issues. I'd not hesitate to go there again.

I think you'll be pretty happy with the stock stuff, now that the Hoosiers are gone there's not as much need for extra "spring" from the dampers

[UNCbigM]

Any updates from anyone on tire choices? I'm going to order something for my 18's in the next week or so. Leaning toward either Dunlops or RS3s, but still knocking around rivals too...

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by UNCbigM

Any updates from anyone on tire choices? I'm going to order something for my 18's in the next week or so. Leaning toward either Dunlops or RS3s, but still knocking around rivals too...

I've tried to follow the various boards, and it still seems that it's just a rumor that a "Rival S" is on the way. I imagine if there is an "S" coming, it will be focused on improving grip on concrete courses like Nationals since on asphalt the Rival is a great tire...especially rough aggregate stuff that will shred some other tires, and not that it's a "bad" tire on concrete but just perhaps a few tenths off the best?

The things I most like about the Rivals are the stiff sidewalls/excellent steering response, how well they communicate through the wheel, and how forgiving they can be around the peak. That last point is actually profound for a tire with such absolute grip. Oh, and they wear really well too on a heavy, front-camber-challenged RWD car.

Here's a link to a guy who recently sent an e-mail to BFG. I though the reply was interesting: "We have not heard any new information about BFGoodrich launching a new BFGoodrich g-Force Rival design with a newer compound. Please check back with us in the near future." Perhaps I'm reading too much in the "near future" comment, lol.

I think per SCCA rules the widespread availability date requirement isn't until 4/30/2015? Hence it likely means if there is something new coming from BFG, we probably won't know about it for another 4-6 weeks?

Regards,
Chuck

[Richbot]

I have a bunch of ideas bouncing around in my head but most of them are stupid. Since the 295 Rival is not currently available (I think the 275 might be out of stock too?) and the S will prpobably be better for autocross, the easy button to me is the widest ZII you're comfortable with, square or the 265/285 RS3 (probably not even available, because Hankook). Square ZII because the ZII sidewall is stiff enough for the front, Staggered RS3 because it's not as stiff but the 285/35-18 rear is too nice to not take advantage of

I suspect there is juuuust enough room for a 285/35-18 up front, though maybe not without unacceptable fender liner casualties. I know for sure a 285/30 will fit. Just depends if the particular tire you choose can be happy pinched on an 8.5-9" wheel

[z3papa]

Originally Posted by Richbot

I have a bunch of ideas bouncing around in my head but most of them are stupid. Since the 295 Rival is not currently available (I think the 275 might be out of stock too?) and the S will prpobably be better for autocross, the easy button to me is the widest ZII you're comfortable with, square or the 265/285 RS3 (probably not even available, because Hankook). Square ZII because the ZII sidewall is stiff enough for the front, Staggered RS3 because it's not as stiff but the 285/35-18 rear is too nice to not take advantage of

I suspect there is juuuust enough room for a 285/35-18 up front, though maybe not without unacceptable fender liner casualties. I know for sure a 285/30 will fit. Just depends if the particular tire you choose can be happy pinched on an 8.5-9" wheel

There are some fresh 285's out and around, you just have to know where to look for them. I have a fresh set of 265/285 RS3's sitting unmounted in my office as I type. Just waiting for a few weeks before the first event of the season. Not hitting Blytheville but will be around. I figure I'll run RS3's for the first half even if they may be little off pace until the new tire lots come out. Word I've heard from BFG folks is the Rival S is coming but will be out early-mid April but SCCA will likely just treat it like a compound change. I'd like to see how V720's and the new Stones are like as well but am not buying 4 sets this year. Time to start hopping into co-drives.

[UNCbigM]

I'll be going with the Dunlops in 275 flavor. I decided I'd like to try the Rivals but can't get 'em and don't want to wait.

[Rexpelagi]

Originally Posted by UNCbigM

Any updates from anyone on tire choices? I'm going to order something for my 18's in the next week or so. Leaning toward either Dunlops or RS3s, but still knocking around rivals too...

There are at least two new tires coming out this year, so buying anything now would be premature unless you just need 'something' now. That said, I've decided on brand but not sizes yet. I'll be buying tires in March.

[chono]

Originally Posted by Richbot

FWIW, the MCS have about 30k street miles plus autocross/track stuff and have no issues. I'd not hesitate to go there again.

I would like to hear more about this setup!
I'd especially like to know where you put the remotes and how you routed the lines. Along with any other tips you may have.

[z3papa]

Originally Posted by Rexpelagi

There are at least two new tires coming out this year, so buying anything now would be premature unless you just need 'something' now. That said, I've decided on brand but not sizes yet. I'll be buying tires in March.

I'm going to cop out, run RS3's in the spring as our events start in March, and see what people think of the new release tires. Part of the process will be doing co-drives or hoping into cars which are on new tires to get a feel, but reality is testing what could be 2-3 tires against the current crop may be next to impossible.

[CSBM5]

Rival stock in various sizes have been disappearing at Tire Rack while at the same time the sizes listed on BFG's web site have been increasing (although they don't have availability status listed). We should likely be hearing something soon one would think.

[z3papa]

As a newb, finally got around to pulling the alignment pins and the Longacre digital camber gauge on my alignment marks says -1.7. Thanks to Rich for the write up. Pretty uneventful 30 minute mod. Must have been my lack of beers in hand. Next up will be getting the tires mounted to the wheels but there is no rush.

[UNCbigM]

Dunlops will be here Monday. Our first event is in two weeks so it was time to pull the trigger, the PS2s are done and I want grip. I'm not autocrossing as seriously as in recent years due to 7 month old daughter and road racing, so even if a better tire comes out, I'll live. Priorities :-)

Pulling pins/alignment is my next step.

[m3peat]

I've gotten rid of the M and now getting an "M"235i. If I could have kept the M3, I would've, so don't ask

Anyone here have any experience, direct or indirect, with setting up the 235 for autox in FS?

Since it has quite a bit of understeer out of the box, do you think a stiffer front bar will help as it does in the M or are the suspensions too different? Is the M-sport adaptive suspension up to the task?

I'm asking here b/c the audience in the 2 series forum is quite small so far.

Thanks for any inputs!!

[CSBM5]

Originally Posted by m3peat

I've gotten rid of the M and now getting an "M"235i. If I could have kept the M3, I would've, so don't ask

Anyone here have any experience, direct or indirect, with setting up the 235 for autox in FS?

Since it has quite a bit of understeer out of the box, do you think a stiffer front bar will help as it does in the M or are the suspensions too different? Is the M-sport adaptive suspension up to the task?

I'm asking here b/c the audience in the 2 series forum is quite small so far.

Thanks for any inputs!!

I would think a much stiffer front sway bar is the way to go. I recall that Hotchkis had some prototype F2x bars a board member had on his/her car a number of months ago, so contact Hotchkis perhaps. I don't know of any currently available F2x sway bars available otherwise.

You'll get the needed relief with the larger bar -- less front body roll hence reduced camber loss, more inside rear tire grip (which will be very necessary without an LSD), etc. Does the F22 have camber pins? I'm guessing no if it's similar to the F3x/F8x platforms but hopefully that is a wrong guess.

Ten years back I was shocked at how adding a large front sway bar to my E46 ZHP in D-stock transformed the car in autox. Understeer decreased in almost all situations for reasons sited above, and it greatly improved inside rear wheel grip coming off elements. Front tire outside edge wear went down substantially also.

The problem with the M235 will be wheel widths and tire sizing. With 7.5 and 8.0 widths, it will be giving up a good bit compared to the E9x M3s. On the M3 I have been running 275/35-18 all around on stock width wheels (8.5, 9.5), and ZCP cars can run 9.0/10.0 wheels. Some are also running 295/35 rears. Wheel/tire size will hinder the F2x in front grip a good bit and also especially in rear longitudinal grip (hard to believe that BMW uses 8.0/245 rears on the M235i while the ZSP E9x 330i and E46 ZHP 330i came with 8.5/255 rears with dramatically less torque output engines).

Squeezing a 255/35 street tire onto the 7.5" front wheel likely will not work out well (but if it can fit and it was my car, I'd at least try it), so being able to run a square tire setup will be problematic on the F2x. You can probably get away with a 235/40 up front at most. Out back you're probably going to have to slightly pinch a 255/35 on the 8" wheels since there is little (none?) availability of the hottest street autox tires in 245/35 sizing, and you'll likely want the most rear grip you can get trying accelerate off elements, especially with no LSD.

Hopefully the above is useful...just random thoughts off the top of my head. The other guys in this thread have more setup experience than I do, hence they should have some thoughts too. Rich?

Regards,
Chuck