Redline D4 ATF fluid in manual trans

[DreamTime]

Kind of a long story, but since it looks like we maybe solved a problem I was having with my transmission, I felt it was worth sharing. Also interested in any input from other people using this fluid, or really any other experiences people have had.

One of the things I did not too long after purchasing my car was change the trans fluid. Per the advice from a very knowledgable friend who owns an indie shop in GA I used Redline D4 ATF fluid instead of the BMW specific trans oil. Shifting felt AMAZING after swapping out the fluid, and I had no issues for months. After the weather turned cold a few weeks ago however, (not sure if this is related or coincidental) I noticed a distinct high-pitched kind of whining noise that was definitely associated with either clutch or trans (as it only appeared when the car was in gear and driving - never while idling, it got worse as the rpms increased, and it immediately disappeared when I pushed in the clutch pedal to change gears and it was nonexistent while coasting in neutral). Based on what I was experiencing, it was determined that the sound was coming from a stressed bearing, and it was further determined that it was likely the throw out bearing in my clutch. Soooo, I pretty much accepted the fact that I would have to rebuild my clutch, as replacing the throw out bearing is so labor intensive that I may as well do the whole f*ing clutch while I’m in there (especially considering the miles on the car). I accepted it and moved on. Since the noise was getting worse, I left my car at my other friend’s shop where the clutch work would be done if needed. They had the car for a day, drove it a bunch, and their first suggestion was to change the trans fluid back to the BMW specified fluid to see if that helped. Cheapest solution first. I had originally just wanted to check the fluid level to see if that was an issue, but I went ahead and picked up some manual trans oil specific to my E90 M3 at the dealer when I grabbed the trans plugs to replace my stripped ones, then swapped it out. That was on Wednesday night. The noise from the bearing has slowly gotten better each day, and now, at day 5, has completely gone away. Looks like maybe not the clutch after all, but still waiting to see how things pan out over the next couple weeks before being 100% sure the problem is solved.

I see other people saying good things about using Redline D4 ATF in their 6MT. Has anyone else experienced subpar performance while using this fluid? What is the fluid most of you guys use??

Worth noting: the clutch feels great, no operational issues or excessive noise. Also, transmission feels great, (thank God) no issues there. Just that loud bearing noise that has gone away since changing the fluid.

[pbonsalb]

You can use MT90, MTL, D4ATF, LTE Shockproof, Synchromesh, BMW fluid, whatever. None of them will make any noises though the lighter weight ones might not mask as much gear rattle.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

You can use MT90, MTL, D4ATF, LTE Shockproof, Synchromesh, BMW fluid, whatever. None of them will make any noises though the lighter weight ones might not mask as much gear rattle.

Interesting, thanks. There was definitely a distinct whiny noise that has gone away since switching the fluid. This noise had me worried, maybe I worry too much about my car Never noticed an increase/decrease in gear rattle sounds. What do you use in your E90?

[Solo_M_Tech]

Redline MTL /thread

[1MOREMOD]

Yep use d4 in my e46 m3 and think it's in my x5d also

[pbonsalb]

I have BMW fluid in it now. Changed all fluids in 2014. But have used all the fluids I listed in other BMW trans that specified BMW fluid and had no issues in any conditions including winter. People often say some fluid makes a huge difference. It may — compared to 10 year old fluid.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

I have BMW fluid in it now. Changed all fluids in 2014. But have used all the fluids I listed in other BMW trans that specified BMW fluid and had no issues in any conditions including winter. People often say some fluid makes a huge difference. It may — compared to 10 year old fluid.

For sure on the big difference to 10 year old fluid... I know the trans fluid had not been changed at all over the course of my M3's life. It felt truly amazing to have new fluid in there when I first switched it to the D4. It feels even better now with the BMW gear oil in there. Shifts like butter I wonder what would have caused that noise I was hearing? I guess I'm just glad it went away. It reminds me of the whining sound my power steering pump was making before I put in new power steering fluid, that noise also went away and has not come back in months.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by ham_sammich

Redline MTL /thread

Please specify Is there a thread I should refer to?

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Yep use d4 in my e46 m3 and think it's in my x5d also

Silly question maybe, but I assume your E46 M3 is a manual?

[Solo_M_Tech]

Originally Posted by DreamTime

Please specify Is there a thread I should refer to?

Not a specific thread. More experience on my part. I've used D4, Syncromesh and MTL. MTL by far gave the best shift feeling (smoothness) and my 3rd gear notchiness is gone. Even after a year of abuse and track time.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by ham_sammich

Not a specific thread. More experience on my part. I've used D4, Syncromesh and MTL. MTL by far gave the best shift feeling (smoothness) and my 3rd gear notchiness is gone. Even after a year of abuse and track time.

Oh, this is fantastic. Thank you. I just looked up the MTL, it's 75w80, very close to the BMW 75w90 oil I ended up using. I appreciate the first hand experience with abusing and tracking the car This speaks to me lol. I push my car pretty hard, but I try to balance it with extra care and attention in the off time

[1MOREMOD]

Originally Posted by DreamTime

Please specify Is there a thread I should refer to?



Silly question maybe, but I assume your E46 M3 is a manual?

Yes track only as well.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD

Yes track only as well.

Thanks! I appreciate the input. Ah, to have a track only E46 M3, lucky you...

[Scharbag]

I just swapped to D4 ATF and shifts are smooth, even when the transmission is cold. Synchros seem to like it as I can shift without the clutch when I want (except for 5th gear, I think they may have forgotten the synchro at the factory...) but it was that way before the fluid swap.

I put Redline 75w140 in the diff at the same time and it seems to work very well. Just about had a heart attack when BMW told me the price of the BMW diff oil... $260CAD for 3 bottles inc. tax and 2 new diff plugs... Unicorn tears and angle blood?

Cheers,

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by Scharbag

I just swapped to D4 ATF and shifts are smooth, even when the transmission is cold. Synchros seem to like it as I can shift without the clutch when I want (except for 5th gear, I think they may have forgotten the synchro at the factory...) but it was that way before the fluid swap.

I put Redline 75w140 in the diff at the same time and it seems to work very well. Just about had a heart attack when BMW told me the price of the BMW diff oil... $260CAD for 3 bottles inc. tax and 2 new diff plugs... Unicorn tears and angle blood?

Cheers,

Omg

Yeah, I think I recall some type of curse word escaping my mouth when they told me the price of the BMW diff fluid. I bought it anyways, but holy crap. It is nice to know there are other options for future fluid changes.

Thank you for your input on the D4 ATF. Right after I put it in I remember how great shifting felt. I was overjoyed! I have gotten a lot of positive feedback about this fluid, I am beginning to wonder if that noise I was hearing actually had nothing to do with the type of fluid I had in my transmission, although the timeline of events would suggest otherwise. These are the things I think about in my spare time…

[DreamTime]

Well, after weeks with no more transmission noise I am fairly confident it was the fluid, for some reason, that was making my transmission unhappy. I would not go so far as to steer people away from Redline D4 ATF for their 6MT, as the majority of people I have talked to who have used it had normal results. To each their own I suppose.

Actually, my 2 main takeaways from this experience are:

1. The importance of having a trusted indie shop to help figure out problems that are out of my scope. After weeks of friends diagnosing my car, I dropped it off expecting to spend 1000 bucks on a clutch rebuild. Instead, per their advice - I picked up the car after a day, took it home, then changed the trans fluid. That solved the problem. I spent under $100... Awesome.

2. To start at the least expensive fix and see if that works. Sometimes it does. I like this lesson

[dreamspeed]

I use Redline MTL. No issues


When i reached out to redline the actually recommended the D4 so kinda weird you had that issue

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by dreamspeed

I use Redline MTL. No issues


When i reached out to redline the actually recommended the D4 so kinda weird you had that issue

Yeah, I have not gotten any other feedback that is similar to what I experienced. Which is why I have nothing bad to say about that fluid. That being said, the problem is solved. I had one friend's indy shop recommend the D4, and another recommend that I stick with BMW fluid in my transmission. All I know is that distinct whining noise is gone after switching back. At the end of the day, that is really all I care about.

[bigjae1976]

I think D4ATF doesn't have the right slipperiness for the Getrag manual transmissions. Its a transmission fluid which is designed to build pressure and lubricate.

I'd stick with a GL4 lubricant specifically designed for a manual gearbox.

RP synchromesh is my favorite but its hard to find. I use redline MT90 and change it often.

[dparm]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

You can use MT90, MTL, D4ATF, LTE Shockproof, Synchromesh, BMW fluid, whatever. None of them will make any noises though the lighter weight ones might not mask as much gear rattle.

I'm pretty skeptical about using the Shockproof stuff. There are so many other outstanding fluids out there that it doesn't seem worth the risk.

[R3dliner]

Was going to use the D4 but glad I decided to stick with the BMW LT-2 fluid. I'm seeing LT-3 fluids now. Don't know if it got superseded to 3.

[pbonsalb]

I think it’s a ZF GS6-53. I have run only the BMW fluid on mine but I have had a few ZF320 and ran all the other fluids I listed in it, year round including winter and can’t say 1 is better than the others. I would not hesitate to run any of them — I won’t be buying any more overpriced BMW fluid. I tried the LTW Shockproof because I broke a ZF320 drag racing and thought it might help. My turbo E36M3 simply has too much power for the ZF320. I may swap in a ZF GS6-53 — the same as in my E90M3 but with a 335i or other 6 cylinder bell housing.

[DreamTime]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I think D4ATF doesn't have the right slipperiness for the Getrag manual transmissions. Its a transmission fluid which is designed to build pressure and lubricate.

I'd stick with a GL4 lubricant specifically designed for a manual gearbox.

RP synchromesh is my favorite but its hard to find. I use redline MT90 and change it often.

Awesome, thank you. I think I will try the Redline MT90 next time. That is the same type of gear oil as the BMW stuff I ended up using, 75w90. Perfect!

Perhaps this was the answer I was looking for when I started this thread