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      08-13-2019, 10:56 AM   #1
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Are all GTS tune the same?

Some company charges $150+ while some charges $60
Why is there a big price difference for the same tune?
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      08-13-2019, 11:57 AM   #2
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I cant answer if they are the same, but like anything else its worth what somebody is willing to pay.

Some people will load it into your car for free, so the value is all over the place.
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      08-13-2019, 12:53 PM   #3
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You can load the oem bmw gts tune for free if you know how to code. It is a wonderful thing to have
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      08-13-2019, 08:42 PM   #4
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Not sure if more expensive = better. I have one from Alpine for 3 years now and it's been flawless.
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      08-13-2019, 10:13 PM   #5
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Like SYTShadow said, If you're decent with computers you're better off buying the cable and learning how to flash it with WinKFP. It takes about 7 minutes to do each flash and I've tried like 4 different ones now. WinKFP is much easier to use than NCSDummy or NCSExpert too. The 335i / N54 sites offer better DIY guides on how to use these programs and get them running.

I should probably start this as its own thread but my brief notes

All ZBs are for the module GS40

ZB 7845773 - This is supposedly what shipped with the GTS.
-Smoother and smarter transmission settings in general.
- S1-S3 do not blip downshifts, they slip downshifts. For this reason I use S4 for most driving.
-S6 will ease into upshifts when around quarter throttle or less, no shift shock, stock US / Euro would upset the car a lot if you did this.
-S4-S6 slam into upshifts, absolutely no cut of power, will really spin from a 1-2 gear shift, 2-3 will sometimes spin even on a hot day.
-Been a minute but I believe launch control was like 3500-4500. Hooked up much better than the stock tune, which just spins tires.
-Sounds (exhaust note) like a torque converter automatic, meshing into upshifts.

ZB 7848442 - Updated GTS?
- Currently using this, very much the same, a minor upgrade
- Can say with certainty that launch control is at 4500, hooks much better than the 5500 launch
- Perhaps a bit smoother at low speeds, equally violent when pushed.

ZB 7847869 - Up to date Euro Flash?
- Smoother than US, faster to reverse
- Better at low speeds than US but still noticeably clunkier than GTS
- Interesting note: The best sounding transmission tune.
-----Gives a really, really nice overrun sound when doing 1-2s and 2-3s at lower speeds.
-----Clear, audible cut of power during some shifts in higher settings, sounds mechanical & satisfying, like racking a gun. Hard to explain.
-5500RPM launch, not very useful. pure entertainment, theater.
- I switch to this when tracking and would use it all the time if it was as intelligent at slipping the clutch as GTS when operating at low speeds.

ZB - 7847868 Current US tune???
- No notable characteristics. Felt very much like when I got the car, which came flashed with DME & trans with 2013 SPDaten flashes. Felt like many of the other stock M3s I've driven. Not bad, but could be better.

Taking the time to type this up because I was frustrated with the lack of notes on characteristics and ZB numbers for all of these flashes. Hopefully someone searching in the future will find this and know where to go.

I would spend your money on getting someone to do Euro MDM, because using those programs is more complicated. American MDM is legitimately no fun at all.

Last edited by chocstraw; 08-13-2019 at 10:38 PM..
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      08-14-2019, 03:23 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Like SYTShadow said, If you're decent with computers you're better off buying the cable and learning how to flash it with WinKFP. It takes about 7 minutes to do each flash and I've tried like 4 different ones now. WinKFP is much easier to use than NCSDummy or NCSExpert too. The 335i / N54 sites offer better DIY guides on how to use these programs and get them running.

I should probably start this as its own thread but my brief notes

All ZBs are for the module GS40

ZB 7845773 - This is supposedly what shipped with the GTS.
-Smoother and smarter transmission settings in general.
- S1-S3 do not blip downshifts, they slip downshifts. For this reason I use S4 for most driving.
-S6 will ease into upshifts when around quarter throttle or less, no shift shock, stock US / Euro would upset the car a lot if you did this.
-S4-S6 slam into upshifts, absolutely no cut of power, will really spin from a 1-2 gear shift, 2-3 will sometimes spin even on a hot day.
-Been a minute but I believe launch control was like 3500-4500. Hooked up much better than the stock tune, which just spins tires.
-Sounds (exhaust note) like a torque converter automatic, meshing into upshifts.

ZB 7848442 - Updated GTS?
- Currently using this, very much the same, a minor upgrade
- Can say with certainty that launch control is at 4500, hooks much better than the 5500 launch
- Perhaps a bit smoother at low speeds, equally violent when pushed.

ZB 7847869 - Up to date Euro Flash?
- Smoother than US, faster to reverse
- Better at low speeds than US but still noticeably clunkier than GTS
- Interesting note: The best sounding transmission tune.
-----Gives a really, really nice overrun sound when doing 1-2s and 2-3s at lower speeds.
-----Clear, audible cut of power during some shifts in higher settings, sounds mechanical & satisfying, like racking a gun. Hard to explain.
-5500RPM launch, not very useful. pure entertainment, theater.
- I switch to this when tracking and would use it all the time if it was as intelligent at slipping the clutch as GTS when operating at low speeds.

ZB - 7847868 Current US tune???
- No notable characteristics. Felt very much like when I got the car, which came flashed with DME & trans with 2013 SPDaten flashes. Felt like many of the other stock M3s I've driven. Not bad, but could be better.

Taking the time to type this up because I was frustrated with the lack of notes on characteristics and ZB numbers for all of these flashes. Hopefully someone searching in the future will find this and know where to go.

I would spend your money on getting someone to do Euro MDM, because using those programs is more complicated. American MDM is legitimately no fun at all.
My memory is a little hazy but I think the x442 is the CRT dct tune. So it's slightly evolved vs the GTS one.

Both the gts and crt are huge improvements over stock!!
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      08-14-2019, 04:08 AM   #7
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There are slight modifications made to GTS dct flash from tuners. Are they going to be noticeable to the consumer? No. The above posts explain the process of loading the raw GTS file onto the car. The 8442 one is the most up to date one.
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      08-14-2019, 01:32 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Like SYTShadow said, If you're decent with computers you're better off buying the cable and learning how to flash it with WinKFP. It takes about 7 minutes to do each flash and I've tried like 4 different ones now. WinKFP is much easier to use than NCSDummy or NCSExpert too. The 335i / N54 sites offer better DIY guides on how to use these programs and get them running.

I should probably start this as its own thread but my brief notes

All ZBs are for the module GS40

ZB 7845773 - This is supposedly what shipped with the GTS.
-Smoother and smarter transmission settings in general.
- S1-S3 do not blip downshifts, they slip downshifts. For this reason I use S4 for most driving.
-S6 will ease into upshifts when around quarter throttle or less, no shift shock, stock US / Euro would upset the car a lot if you did this.
-S4-S6 slam into upshifts, absolutely no cut of power, will really spin from a 1-2 gear shift, 2-3 will sometimes spin even on a hot day.
-Been a minute but I believe launch control was like 3500-4500. Hooked up much better than the stock tune, which just spins tires.
-Sounds (exhaust note) like a torque converter automatic, meshing into upshifts.

ZB 7848442 - Updated GTS?
- Currently using this, very much the same, a minor upgrade
- Can say with certainty that launch control is at 4500, hooks much better than the 5500 launch
- Perhaps a bit smoother at low speeds, equally violent when pushed.

ZB 7847869 - Up to date Euro Flash?
- Smoother than US, faster to reverse
- Better at low speeds than US but still noticeably clunkier than GTS
- Interesting note: The best sounding transmission tune.
-----Gives a really, really nice overrun sound when doing 1-2s and 2-3s at lower speeds.
-----Clear, audible cut of power during some shifts in higher settings, sounds mechanical & satisfying, like racking a gun. Hard to explain.
-5500RPM launch, not very useful. pure entertainment, theater.
- I switch to this when tracking and would use it all the time if it was as intelligent at slipping the clutch as GTS when operating at low speeds.

ZB - 7847868 Current US tune???
- No notable characteristics. Felt very much like when I got the car, which came flashed with DME & trans with 2013 SPDaten flashes. Felt like many of the other stock M3s I've driven. Not bad, but could be better.

Taking the time to type this up because I was frustrated with the lack of notes on characteristics and ZB numbers for all of these flashes. Hopefully someone searching in the future will find this and know where to go.

I would spend your money on getting someone to do Euro MDM, because using those programs is more complicated. American MDM is legitimately no fun at all.
Very nice post, thanks! Been wondering about what the DCT tunes actually are doing, reading the US OEM complains (Im EU), I was guessing it to some extend convert to EU sw but now I know better. Good input!

Ps. Didnt quite get the slipping clutch advantage with the GTS tune?
Ps. Ps. And yessir, you should definitely create a separate thread on this subject, comparing the different sw and its resulting features, haven't seen anything like that before.

Last edited by Helmsman; 08-14-2019 at 01:49 PM..
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      08-14-2019, 02:08 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
Ps. Didnt quite get the slipping clutch advantage with the GTS tune?
Like if you were driving a 3 pedal car, it is better about slowly engaging the clutch when trying to creep or move slowly.

Last edited by chocstraw; 08-14-2019 at 02:17 PM..
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      08-14-2019, 02:36 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Like if you were driving a 3 pedal car, it is better about slowly engaging the clutch when trying to creep or move slowly.
Ah, got it. Still mentioned you use S4 to avoid this, no? Sorry for all questions, curious!
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      08-14-2019, 03:18 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helmsman View Post
Ah, got it. Still mentioned you use S4 to avoid this, no? Sorry for all questions, curious!
Ah, to clarify, at higher speeds, S1-S3 will slip the clutch instead of blipping the throttle to downshift, where S4-S6 blip the throttle and then engage the clutch. Like a 3 pedal, you can either hit the gas a bit to get the RPMs up, or slowly release the clutch to get engine up to speed.

All of D1-D5 & S1-S6 are better about letting out the clutch when coming from a stop. D1 starts from second gear in all of these tunes.
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      08-14-2019, 03:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Ah, to clarify, at higher speeds, S1-S3 will slip the clutch instead of blipping the throttle to downshift, where S4-S6 blip the throttle and then engage the clutch. Like a 3 pedal, you can either hit the gas a bit to get the RPMs up, or slowly release the clutch to get engine up to speed.

All of D1-D5 & S1-S6 are better about letting out the clutch when coming from a stop. D1 starts from second gear in all of these tunes.
Got it, seem same way mine is working i.e downshift blip on S4-S6 only. D1 has the "Winter mode" with 2nd gear start.
Again, believe a thread with detailed explanations between the tunes would be highly appreciated mate.

Cheers
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      08-17-2019, 06:03 PM   #13
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After posting in this thread, I went back and flashed the trans flash ending in 69, and I'm back to say that I've solidified it as my choice as best transmission tune. The GTS tunes are arguably faster, but there is no denying that the 69 flash (Euro flash?) is the best sounding and maybe the most organic feeling, without many sacrifices to performance.

- Again, sound has nice overrun, somehow more backfiring, and a nice pop -> power cut on upshifts. Can't stress enough how good it sounds, especially with my cutouts open.
- better at on-throttle downshifts
- Still decent comfort in bumper-to-bumper traffic
- faster to switch between reverse and drive
- Makes gear shifts feel like more of an event than the GTS / CRT tunes.

Performance gains of the GTS / CRT are pretty negligible, and I almost never use launch control. If you're thinking about getting a transmission tune done, my vote is for this one, having tried out all 4 recently.

Shadow, I'm curious about your thoughts if you ever get a chance to flash this one.

Last edited by chocstraw; 08-17-2019 at 06:12 PM..
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      08-18-2019, 03:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Shadow, I'm curious about your thoughts if you ever get a chance to flash this one.
I have a track weekend coming up and have to flash the DCT as it's back to stock after the blown engine. It's easy to try this one and the CRT one

Thank you for spelling it out here, really useful information
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      08-18-2019, 11:06 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
After posting in this thread, I went back and flashed the trans flash ending in 69, and I'm back to say that I've solidified it as my choice as best transmission tune. The GTS tunes are arguably faster, but there is no denying that the 69 flash (Euro flash?) is the best sounding and maybe the most organic feeling, without many sacrifices to performance.

- Again, sound has nice overrun, somehow more backfiring, and a nice pop -> power cut on upshifts. Can't stress enough how good it sounds, especially with my cutouts open.
- better at on-throttle downshifts
- Still decent comfort in bumper-to-bumper traffic
- faster to switch between reverse and drive
- Makes gear shifts feel like more of an event than the GTS / CRT tunes.

Performance gains of the GTS / CRT are pretty negligible, and I almost never use launch control. If you're thinking about getting a transmission tune done, my vote is for this one, having tried out all 4 recently.

Shadow, I'm curious about your thoughts if you ever get a chance to flash this one.
Thank you so much for this post and your earlier one comparing all 4. Iíve read the gts tunes are better than the standard US tune with regards to downshifting when coming to a stop and smoother all around at low speed, city driving, traffic, etc. Is the euro tune better when coming to a stop like the GTS?
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      08-19-2019, 05:13 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
After posting in this thread, I went back and flashed the trans flash ending in 69, and I'm back to say that I've solidified it as my choice as best transmission tune. The GTS tunes are arguably faster, but there is no denying that the 69 flash (Euro flash?) is the best sounding and maybe the most organic feeling, without many sacrifices to performance.

- Again, sound has nice overrun, somehow more backfiring, and a nice pop -> power cut on upshifts. Can't stress enough how good it sounds, especially with my cutouts open.
- better at on-throttle downshifts
- Still decent comfort in bumper-to-bumper traffic
- faster to switch between reverse and drive
- Makes gear shifts feel like more of an event than the GTS / CRT tunes.

Performance gains of the GTS / CRT are pretty negligible, and I almost never use launch control. If you're thinking about getting a transmission tune done, my vote is for this one, having tried out all 4 recently.

Shadow, I'm curious about your thoughts if you ever get a chance to flash this one.
Cheers Chocstraw. Curious on what you mean by "nice sound" at upshift, is that the "thump" at moderate throttle going 1-2-3 gear?
Is 7847869 confirmed to be the EU OEM tune or could this be something else?
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      08-23-2019, 07:59 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Shadow, I'm curious about your thoughts if you ever get a chance to flash this one.
I flashed the stroker to the updated Euro file (69) last night and drove it to work today

A big improvement over the US software which is just shit but I feel like it's still slower than the GTS/CRT software.

My car is insanely loud right now so if there's any added drama right now I am unable to detect it.

Will probably move to the CRT software over the weekend as this is a track car. If I had an E93 M car for sure I'd run the '69' software on it though!

Thank you for documenting this! There is SO little information out there on specifics of what they do!
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      08-23-2019, 09:00 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
I flashed the stroker to the updated Euro file (69) last night and drove it to work today

A big improvement over the US software which is just shit but I feel like it's still slower than the GTS/CRT software.

My car is insanely loud right now so if there's any added drama right now I am unable to detect it.

Will probably move to the CRT software over the weekend as this is a track car. If I had an E93 M car for sure I'd run the '69' software on it though!

Thank you for documenting this! There is SO little information out there on specifics of what they do!
Ahhhh thank you for your feedback. I agree, it is certainly slower than those two, I feel like for most applications it is negligible enough to take a pick between the two. A little clunkier coming to stops as well, but for me, the shifting sound is worth it. I tried to record it but a mic doesn't pick it up too well.

I just hope that I've thrown in enough searchable terms for someone else looking to flash their E90 E92 E93 E9x M3 DCT transmission. Getrag 7DCI600 trans flash faster shift speed smoother operation alpina B3.

Shadow, when flashing my transmission, I have enable UIF / VIN for the flashing, and my "you can still flash the module X more times" counter is continuing to get lower. I believe I'm at 7 right now. Do you know what happens when it hits zero?
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      08-23-2019, 09:56 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chocstraw View Post
Shadow, when flashing my transmission, I have enable UIF / VIN for the flashing, and my "you can still flash the module X more times" counter is continuing to get lower. I believe I'm at 7 right now. Do you know what happens when it hits zero?
My module shows 7 left... I asked people who know these things and apparently when we get to 0 we cannot flash anymore, if you want to continue the module has to be sent out to have a chip replaced.
This is like the E46M.

So, it CAN be flashed more times but we should be careful as it'll be a pain for sure


It's clear the GTS/CRT/Euro update files are way, way better than the US one. I've been driving the stroker with the US file and the DCT felt like a POS, very frustrating.
It's funny but I feel the GTS/CRT flash makes a incredibly large difference in the car's behavior.

Cheers and thanks for looking all this stuff up
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      08-23-2019, 10:07 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
My module shows 7 left... I asked people who know these things and apparently when we get to 0 we cannot flash anymore, if you want to continue the module has to be sent out to have a chip replaced.
This is like the E46M.

So, it CAN be flashed more times but we should be careful as it'll be a pain for sure


It's clear the GTS/CRT/Euro update files are way, way better than the US one. I've been driving the stroker with the US file and the DCT felt like a POS, very frustrating.
It's funny but I feel the GTS/CRT flash makes a incredibly large difference in the car's behavior.

Cheers and thanks for looking all this stuff up
What is the initial counter?
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      08-23-2019, 10:25 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xnfsx View Post
What is the initial counter?
I'm not sure. Could be 10, but I've flashed it more than 3 times in total. When I needed a new FSC the car lost its DCT programming, so maybe the FSC is what holds the info on # of flashes. Or perhaps it lost the GTS coding once the car had to be reprogrammed
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      08-24-2019, 07:52 AM   #22
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Just curious to whoever have tried all 4.

I have tried ZB 7845773, 7848442, 7847868 and 7847869. My car is an Australian Spec M3. I have not tried the US DCT tune as I am in Australia.

I have just tried 7847869 and I'm not 100% sure it is actually Euro DCT Tune because Australian Spec M3 comes with 7847868 (latest update) and it starts in D2 (similar to GTS & CRT DCT Tune) however 7847869 starts in S3 for some reasons.

I don't understand the noise difference as well between 7847869 and 7848442 as they sound the same to me (although some of you believe the noise from 7847869 is more mechanical and rewarding to hear).

I believe 7848442 is less clunky out of all the DCT Tune and rev match better.
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