Apple CarPlay/Android Auto Retrofit

[brettcp]

Originally Posted by drwankel

Are there any kits out there that arent using aux in for the audio connection? Seems crazy to take such a big loss in audio quality.

Ideally I'd like something that gets audio natively to the amp, uses the factory mic, bluetooth fully works. Nothing like that exists?

drwankel Ideally there would be a carplay box that connects directly to the MOST bus (without converting to AUX). There are aftermarket AUX in adapters that connect directly to the MOST bus (and emulate the factory BMW CD changer on the BMW side), so this is possible, but I haven't seen any carplay boxes with this yet. If somebody were to develop this, I'd have to ditch my V2 box in favor of it

It is possible to get the AUX quality very close to BT audio quality by adjusting the EQ settings (both on the carplay EQ side, and on the BMW factory audio settings side).

[smass]

Originally Posted by brettcp

drwankel Ideally there would be a carplay box that connects directly to the MOST bus (without converting to AUX). There are aftermarket AUX in adapters that connect directly to the MOST bus (and emulate the factory BMW CD changer on the BMW side), so this is possible, but I haven't seen any carplay boxes with this yet. If somebody were to develop this, I'd have to ditch my V2 box in favor of it

It is possible to get the AUX quality very close to BT audio quality by adjusting the EQ settings (both on the carplay EQ side, and on the BMW factory audio settings side).

I like the MOST idea, but I would prefer a Carplay system that was video only. Let my iPhone manage all the audio over BT. Apple music can do this now. The screen displays the song info but the music plays over a direct connection between the phone and combox. Native iPhone audio controls allow the combox to be selected rather than carplay. If carplay's audio connection did not exist, other apps would default to combox.

[kms]

Originally Posted by drwankel

Are there any kits out there that arent using aux in for the audio connection? Seems crazy to take such a big loss in audio quality.

Ideally I'd like something that gets audio natively to the amp, uses the factory mic, bluetooth fully works. Nothing like that exists?

The use of BMW Aux input is not a bad choice. If you conect a smartphone directly to the BMW AUX input the sound quality is very good. It is far better than using BT connection.

The problem is that the Smartphone uses a headphone driver on the 3.,5 mm Aux outputy. Most of the carplay interface boxes / android screens do use a line driver to output the audio. This is a HW design error which leads to such bad sound quality. Using the audio settings you can compensate a little bit the problem but you are still far away from a good sound. So you would need to solder a little bit. I explained the problem and the solution for the JoyeAuto Carplay interface in post #614 of this thread.

I also was in contact with the manufacturer/suppier of my interface, but they just ignored my hints. My conclusion: All smartphone manufacturers can do good headphone audio drivers, but the chinese manufacturers of these android screens and carplay interfaces can not and are commiting fatal hardware design errors. The outputs are not designed to drive the low impedance input of the BMW Aux input.

[brettcp]

Originally Posted by smass

I like the MOST idea, but I would prefer a Carplay system that was video only. Let my iPhone manage all the audio over BT. Apple music can do this now. The screen displays the song info but the music plays over a direct connection between the phone and combox. Native iPhone audio controls allow the combox to be selected rather than carplay. If carplay's audio connection did not exist, other apps would default to combox.

This is how the V2 box works via full BT Combox (when not using AUX, just combox). The carplay interface is basically just the video display for the BT Audio combox connection (you can switch over to the BMW interface and see your BT audio track info just as usual).

The issue with this was the switching of the audio path - Any time carplay wants to play a sound, or listen to a mic, Carplay wants its own dedicated audio path and microphone to do so. You can watch the kremersino unit attempt to auto-switch from the "Carplay" source on your iphone over to the BMW BT combox connection.. I say "attempt" because it rarely worked - carplay would quickly force the connection away from the BT combox connection and back to the "Carplay" source. They never got this working reliably, which I believe is why they now suggest using AUX in, and created a new wiring harness that taps into the BMW factory mic. Now the "Carplay" mic source is hard wired to the factory BMW mic and works as expected. The carplay audio source is now hard wired to AUX, so its no longer fighting to switch to/from Carplay/BT Combox.

If they could get this switching override worked out, everything would be great and we wouldn't need AUX.

[derbo]

Originally Posted by brettcp

This is how the V2 box works via full BT Combox (when not using AUX, just combox). The carplay interface is basically just the video display for the BT Audio combox connection (you can switch over to the BMW interface and see your BT audio track info just as usual).

The issue with this was the switching of the audio path - Any time carplay wants to play a sound, or listen to a mic, Carplay wants its own dedicated audio path and microphone to do so. You can watch the kremersino unit attempt to auto-switch from the "Carplay" source on your iphone over to the BMW BT combox connection.. I say "attempt" because it rarely worked - carplay would quickly force the connection away from the BT combox connection and back to the "Carplay" source. They never got this working reliably, which I believe is why they now suggest using AUX in, and created a new wiring harness that taps into the BMW factory mic. Now the "Carplay" mic source is hard wired to the factory BMW mic and works as expected. The carplay audio source is now hard wired to AUX, so its no longer fighting to switch to/from Carplay/BT Combox.

If they could get this switching override worked out, everything would be great and we wouldn't need AUX.

I do believe this is a limitation on Apple's side as Carplay that is native on cars will utilize that carplay audio source instead of BT. The v2 module is trying to override it but the default behavior from Apple is to natively use Carplay Audio. There also is another issue where the BT Audio and BT Phone Audio are two separate sources and the 2-way phone audio only appears when Siri/navigation speaks making it even harder for them to figure out when to switch over.

I do not have very high hopes for this one being solved and think that @kms is correct with the line out issue.

[LT2424E90M3]

not luck with rear view camera with kremersino box, ive tried following the video from Michael online, ive tried two different cameras, ive tried installing a relay for solid 12v power, nothing worked..

i actually bought this unit because of the rear view camera and am sorely disappointed, everything else works on the unit and the sound quality is honestly not that bad for me...

i really wanted that camera though....

[///M3Fresh]

I am thinking of pulling the trigger on V2. I do have a couple questions:

In terms of audio quality, are they both the same? Or is one version better than the other?

Additionally, is there any known reverse cameras that work for V2? It looks like the OEM integration (mic tap) of the mic is appealing to me. But it seems people are having issues with all the cameras not working? Seems odd that V1 has a working camera but V2 doesnt?

[Cyberdemon]

Been reading through this thread a lot, and trying to make a decision if it's a useful time to buy, or theres going to be a "new thing" around the corner in the next few months.

My priorities sound like they may be a bit skewed compared to most. I'm half deaf, so even though I have the individual sound option, it's kind of irrelevant - I'm normally completely content with Sirius XM since that's all I've been listening to for the past several years, but at the moment since my car doesn't have it coded, I'd rather get carplay and listen through the app.

Since audio quality isn't as big of a deal heres my bigger priorties:

-As close to OEM integration as possible (Hate the extra USB cables dangling, but don't know if theres a good way out of this without major drilling. Though I wouldn't mind buying a spare plastic trim piece if there was a way to do this cleanly)
-Good call quality
-Good GPS signal (will any of these systems be able to use anything other than the phone GPS? If so, is wireless carplay even worth it when the phone will still need to be plugged in to charge most of the time?)
-Good rear camera support.
-Preferrably not having to dick around with it constantly (IE installing updates, ripping panels out over and over to mess with cables)

I'm almost wondering if the NBT retrofit would be worth the additional cash to keep it closer to OEM.

Anyone have any thoughts what the best upgrade would be (Regardless of cost) for the cleanest install if audio quality isn't the biggest deal?

[brettcp]

Originally Posted by Cyberdemon

Been reading through this thread a lot, and trying to make a decision if it's a useful time to buy, or theres going to be a "new thing" around the corner in the next few months.

My priorities sound like they may be a bit skewed compared to most. I'm half deaf, so even though I have the individual sound option, it's kind of irrelevant - I'm normally completely content with Sirius XM since that's all I've been listening to for the past several years, but at the moment since my car doesn't have it coded, I'd rather get carplay and listen through the app.

Since audio quality isn't as big of a deal heres my bigger priorties:

-As close to OEM integration as possible (Hate the extra USB cables dangling, but don't know if theres a good way out of this without major drilling. Though I wouldn't mind buying a spare plastic trim piece if there was a way to do this cleanly)
-Good call quality
-Good GPS signal (will any of these systems be able to use anything other than the phone GPS? If so, is wireless carplay even worth it when the phone will still need to be plugged in to charge most of the time?)
-Good rear camera support.
-Preferrably not having to dick around with it constantly (IE installing updates, ripping panels out over and over to mess with cables)

I'm almost wondering if the NBT retrofit would be worth the additional cash to keep it closer to OEM.

Anyone have any thoughts what the best upgrade would be (Regardless of cost) for the cleanest install if audio quality isn't the biggest deal?

- The USB ends can just be put in the glovebox, no drilling required.
- No difference in call quality with the carplay unit installed
- GPS signal for waze, google maps, etc all comes from your cell phone
- Shouldn't have to mess around with it much once its installed. Put the USB plug in the glovebox so that if and when there is a firmware update, its easy to apply.

NBT retrofit would be preferable, but at 8-10x the cost of a carplay box it may be hard for some to justify. I think the last time I looked (which was over a year ago I believe), an NBT EVO retrofit was around $3k.

[derbo]

Originally Posted by brettcp

- The USB ends can just be put in the glovebox, no drilling required.
- No difference in call quality with the carplay unit installed
- GPS signal for waze, google maps, etc all comes from your cell phone
- Shouldn't have to mess around with it much once its installed. Put the USB plug in the glovebox so that if and when there is a firmware update, its easy to apply.

NBT retrofit would be preferable, but at 8-10x the cost of a carplay box it may be hard for some to justify. I think the last time I looked (which was over a year ago I believe), an NBT EVO retrofit was around $3k.

still is $3k and still a very intrusive retrofit. And the car on the menu will be your donor not an e9x.

[Robinn]

Anyone with Kremersino box that could answer my questions? Seems like Michael himself doesn’t when I asked him.

Tried connect a rear camera:
- As in kremersinos guide, to ”CCD AV IN” and power to Camera from ”CAM Power” (pink).
And in settings: ”Back up - Protocol”.

Seems like it doesn’t sense that I put in rev. gear, nothing happens When I shift to reverse.


So does anyone know what the other cables do?
RED - ”ACC” - ?
PINK - ”CAM Power” - ?
BROWN - ”BACK CAR” - ?


I asked about taking signal from reverse lights to activate carplay to shift to reverse camera.
But he said I should connect it to CAM Power (pink)... I think I should connect +12v to the brown wire, as that seems more logical to be the detector cable?

[Roland2727]

Hello, I'm facing now the same problem with the rearview cam, I give it power and everything, but nothing happens in the box ...

[LT2424E90M3]

i am in the same boat with the camera issue, no reverse camera, i think i've tried all the possible options to make this thing work....nothing has worked so far...the only thing being discussed is that we have the wrong type of format camera...i'm going to email him about sending a camera that has been tested on his end and works before sending it out to me....

[washere]

I have spent a lot of time on the camera (v2), I gave up and bought an emulator on ebay and plugged it in ahead of the ACP box. It works, but I would love to get rid of it. Bottom line, it doesn't work, and as best as I can tell never will.

[brettcp]

Last week I commented about selling my Kremersino V2 (which I had a few PM's about within hours, sold it to a fellow member here) as we were looking to get another BMW. Wife and I picked up a '17 440i gran coupe yesterday, tons of space in the back.. anyway, it has factory carplay which is great, but it only uses 2/3rds of the screen. Looks like there are some hacks to get it full-screen, will have to dig into that a bit.

Still haven't decided if we're selling the E93 M3 as its such a different car and serves a different purpose.. Compared to the F36, the E9x's tech feels so outdated without having carplay - kind of missing it already!

[coniman]

Hello guys, I’m planning to upgrade my early 2013 F30 screen. Since my car has HU_ENTRY I also have to upgrade headunit to a HU NBT. Discarding that because it’s a very expensive upgrade, I’m looking options to only upgrade the screen. Also I want to keep Wireless CarPlay. I currently have the Kremersino v2 unit (the one that uses old PCB with great sound and WiFi) with some modifications I’ve made (external WiFi antena connector and a higher quality AUX cable).

I’ve seen this screen with integrated Wireless CarPlay and Android Auto.
https://www.android-car-dvd.de/colle...34409733062789

Has anyone here tried this type of displays?

If it works ok I will be selling my modified Kremersino unit, if anyone it’s interested PM me.

[derbo]

Originally Posted by brettcp

Last week I commented about selling my Kremersino V2 (which I had a few PM's about within hours, sold it to a fellow member here) as we were looking to get another BMW. Wife and I picked up a '17 440i gran coupe yesterday, tons of space in the back.. anyway, it has factory carplay which is great, but it only uses 2/3rds of the screen. Looks like there are some hacks to get it full-screen, will have to dig into that a bit.

Still haven't decided if we're selling the E93 M3 as its such a different car and serves a different purpose.. Compared to the F36, the E9x's tech feels so outdated without having carplay - kind of missing it already!

You will hack the ini file to make this change but you will lose split screen access for the entire system. I figured its not the end of the world to have a split screen anyways so my wife's F87 is like that.

[Robinn]

I can answer my question by myself
BROWN - BACK CAR = Detection for reverse/camera (on +12v applied to it).

Took +12v straight from reverse light, didn’t work. Caused Black screen.
Because reverse lights are powered with PWM.
Tried to put a LC-filter between, worked but picture flickered.

Finally ended up with a relay between.

Now rev. Camera is working, but trajectory doesn’t work.

Originally Posted by Robinn

Anyone with Kremersino box that could answer my questions? Seems like Michael himself doesn’t when I asked him.

Tried connect a rear camera:
- As in kremersinos guide, to ”CCD AV IN” and power to Camera from ”CAM Power” (pink).
And in settings: ”Back up - Protocol”.

Seems like it doesn’t sense that I put in rev. gear, nothing happens When I shift to reverse.


So does anyone know what the other cables do?
RED - ”ACC” - ?
PINK - ”CAM Power” - ?
BROWN - ”BACK CAR” - ?


I asked about taking signal from reverse lights to activate carplay to shift to reverse camera.
But he said I should connect it to CAM Power (pink)... I think I should connect +12v to the brown wire, as that seems more logical to be the detector cable?

[gottsman]

Originally Posted by brettcp

I experimented quite a bit with the EQ settings between BT and AUX. I just setup shortcuts to switch between BT and AUX, would play the same track and switch back and forth, making minor adjustments along the way until I got to the point where the difference between the two was minimal. I'm happy with it at this point.

Here are my EQ settings on my '12 E93 M3 with S752 (Individual Audio). I primarily listen to electronic music. Note that I'm using the carplay EQ settings which Beemr posted a couple of pages back.

If anybody has any suggestions for improvements, please post them!

Do you find that there is too much treble? I tried your 3 screen shots and ended up dialing it back.

BTW, I am using the new BimmerTech model MMI for CIC... Works great in my E92 M3.

[LT2424E90M3]

Originally Posted by Robinn

I can answer my question by myself
BROWN - BACK CAR = Detection for reverse/camera (on +12v applied to it).

Took +12v straight from reverse light, didn’t work. Caused Black screen.
Because reverse lights are powered with PWM.
Tried to put a LC-filter between, worked but picture flickered.

Finally ended up with a relay between.

Now rev. Camera is working, but trajectory doesn’t work.

how did you wire up your relay?

i tried all sorts of wiring ways, but couldn't get it to fire up!!!

[brettcp]

Originally Posted by gottsman

Do you find that there is too much treble? I tried your 3 screen shots and ended up dialing it back.

BTW, I am using the new BimmerTech model MMI for CIC... Works great in my E92 M3.

I know it seems like that treble setting is very high, but in my case that was what sounded the best when combined with the EQ settings from the carplay unit. Your Bimmertech model may be different with its EQ than the kremersino v2 that I was using.

[Robinn]

Originally Posted by LT2424E90M3

how did you wire up your relay?

i tried all sorts of wiring ways, but couldn't get it to fire up!!!

I made a quick drawing for you.
https://pasteboard.co/Jn2zrYR.jpg

Try with +12VDC direct from battery first, to brown cable (BACK-CAR) and camera without a relay to test if it works that way.