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      08-03-2019, 09:42 AM   #1
s4awd
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I drove my friendís Kia Optima on a road trip and it was surprisingly good

I have an M4 and a G63. Had to drive to Niagara Falls from NYC (9 hours) in my M4 and jumped into a Kia Optima to help out a friend who was tired.

MAN!!! that thing is NICE with the driver assist. Super smooth and solid. The days of getting out of a Hyundai/Kia and into a BMW and having your mind blown are over. It was the reverse for me as I was like, "Damn this is nice!". All car manufacturers are catching up.
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      08-03-2019, 01:10 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
You are easily impressed.

Go and live with that mind blowing Kia for a few years (If the car's engine doesn't burst on fire first) and see how great is to own one of these airport rental specials with their well known smarmy dealers, Walmart like service experience and service advisors specifically trained to deny legit warranty claims left and right. And that 10-year warranty? Is not even worth the proverbial piece of paper is written on.

Last, show me a 10-15 year old Hyundai/Kia products that still looks half decent and hasn't fallen apart or is not already dismantled over blocks at the self service parts graveyard.

Around me I can show you a 2004-2005 E46 325ix that still looks not a day over 3-4 years old.

You get what you pay for plain and simple.
How old are you? My kids and their friends don't care about cars AT ALL. they know my cars are "nice" but could care less as long as it gets them where they need to go and has Apple car play. They are the market which is what BMW is catering too Serious.
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      08-03-2019, 01:31 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
You are easily impressed.

Go and live with that mind blowing Kia for a few years (If the car's engine doesn't burst on fire first) and see how great is to own one of these airport rental specials with their well known smarmy dealers, Walmart like service experience and service advisors specifically trained to deny legit warranty claims left and right. And that 10-year warranty? Is not even worth the proverbial piece of paper is written on.

Last, show me a 10-15 year old Hyundai/Kia products that still looks half decent and hasn't fallen apart or is not already dismantled over blocks at the self service parts graveyard.

Around me I can show you a 2004-2005 E46 325ix that still looks not a day over 3-4 years old.

You get what you pay for plain and simple.
I LOVE a good hot take, but this one is pretty misguided. What if I told you that Albert Bierman (former head of BMW M) and Peter Schreyer (Audi designer) are both chiefs in engineering and design (respectively) at Hyundai/Kia right now? And thats just two people that I can think of off the top of my head. They've poached a literal ton of lower level engineers and designers from the German big-3. So HMG literally has many of the key people who developed the car you currently own. People who are now working on the cars you just dismissed as crap... A BMW badge doesn't magically make a car good, its the engineers and designers that do.
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      08-03-2019, 02:40 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
I don't care if Hyundai's are designed and put together by angels themselves.

Don't like the company and don't like the products simple as that.

The Koreans had to poach the evil ze Germans to design and build the cars for them. They lack the engineering and design skills/ originality to build competitive cars themselves. Just look at the crap they were churning out not that long ago.
Interesting. You mean that large international companies hire internationally? Shocker! No way!?!?!?

Personally that wouldn't have been the argument I would have made, but since you want to go there lets look at some key/notable BMW people of the past 2 decades then:

Karim Habib- Lebanese/Canadian
Chris Bangle- American
Adrian van Hooydonk- Dutch
Jozef Kabaň- Czech
Mihiar Ayoubi- Syrian
Anders Warming- Danish
Calvin Luk- Australian
Nader Faghihzadeh- Iranian/German

You are certainly entitled to your opinion, just as I am entitled to call you out for caring more about the badge on your car than your car itself.

Also in case you were wondering why I have Habib in bold, it's because he was the lead designer for your car.
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      08-03-2019, 02:40 PM   #5
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I've never owned a Korean car but there's little debate they have come a long way. I would put their products ahead of the domestics and lower tier Japanese brands such as Nissan and Mitsubishi. The latest Genesis sedan isn't perfect but really isn't that far off of a comparable Audi, BMW, MB, etc. They have come a long way and they did it the right way out of constantly improving their products and stealing design cues from successful automakers.
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      08-03-2019, 03:13 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
I've never owned a Korean car but there's little debate they have come a long way. I would put their products ahead of the domestics and lower tier Japanese brands such as Nissan and Mitsubishi. The latest Genesis sedan isn't perfect but really isn't that far off of a comparable Audi, BMW, MB, etc. They have come a long way and they did it the right way out of constantly improving their products and stealing design cues from successful automakers.
+1.

Initial impressions when you sit in any of the GXX Genesis vehicles is that they are very very close to the Germans. Obviously long term is yet to be seen but Hyundai/Genesis did the right thing by renaming or creating a different branch to attract new customers - something I feel that KIA should have done. Not doing so has hurt them and why I think the Stinger has not been as successful as they might have wanted.
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      08-03-2019, 03:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 530iDriver View Post
I fail to see the originality in the exterior designs and interiors. Just copies/facsimiles of current MB, Audi and BMW trends.

The G70 is a perfect example of this: Front: Audi, sides: BMW, rear Mercedes Benz.

The interior is a mush of lines and different design cues taken from elsewhere sprinkled with plenty pieces from the Hyundai/Kia parts bin.

I guess a lot of people like that, not me.
If you're gonna steal might as well steal from the best. I actually really like the design of the G70 as a whole, although the front end could be improved, but otherwise I like the more class looks it gives while still having some sporting edge in the design.
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      08-03-2019, 04:10 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
If you're gonna steal might as well steal from the best. I actually really like the design of the G70 as a whole, although the front end could be improved, but otherwise I like the more class looks it gives while still having some sporting edge in the design.
Walking by a G70 could not help to think the car has also a decidedly Infiniti Q50 vibe particularly as you approach the car from a distance.

Again, not my cup of tea.
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      08-03-2019, 06:24 PM   #9
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Anyone who disparages current day Kia/Hyundai hasn't been paying attention for the past 5 years. They are pulling out all the stops with quality, reliability, warranty, and overall value. More than that, they are actually LISTENING to customer demands. Gone are the days of disposable cars that lasted 2 years. The rest of the industry has let them catch up out of pure complacency.
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      08-03-2019, 07:54 PM   #10
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Ya, badge snobs are funny, that's how/why 'premium' brands can OVERcharge for substandard products.
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      08-03-2019, 08:12 PM   #11
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whats holding you back from buying one then?
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      08-03-2019, 08:24 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tranquility View Post
Ya, badge snobs are funny, that's how/why 'premium' brands can OVERcharge for substandard products.
This. Badge snobs are the worst. People into driving and motoring transcend that stuff. I'd much rather drive an i30N than most BMWs on sale these days. Engineered by Mr. "M" himself, Mr. Biermann...can't ask for a better modern pedigree than that!
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      08-03-2019, 08:26 PM   #13
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my cousin bought the new sporty kia stinger... solid car for what it is but to compare interior finish and overall tech / feeling of that car to a 3 series is blasphemy... lets just say after 1 year that car will be gone
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      08-03-2019, 08:40 PM   #14
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I will agree with the original poster. I had a Sonata that was paid off, and was looking for a nice car. Got a great deal with my E88. I love both brands!
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      08-03-2019, 09:02 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s4awd View Post
All car manufacturers are catching up.
I don't disagree with you on the evening out of car quality.
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      08-04-2019, 10:45 AM   #16
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My DW bought a just-released Kia Niro BEV crossover in May. It has more features than my BMW i3, is on-par with the Tesla Model 3 in terms of price and battery range, and seats five adults comfortably. Did I mention that it's getting better miles/kWh than my i3 on the highway? She also test-drove the Hyundai Kona BEV, which allegedly uses the same battery pack and motor. The Kona felt cramped inside, mostly due to Hyundai putting this thing that can only be described as an ironing board with switches on it between the front seats.

We have never owned or even considered a Korean car before, and were still under the old stereotype that they were cheap crap based on their first offerings in North America. The thing seems to be solid after 4,000+ miles, and I can't pry the key fob out of her hands. Best of all, her commuting energy costs have dropped from $400/month to about $75/month...and will be significantly less than that going forward since a business next to where she works just installed two free chargers for public use.....
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      08-05-2019, 06:00 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
My DW bought a just-released Kia Niro BEV crossover in May. It has more features than my BMW i3, is on-par with the Tesla Model 3 in terms of price and battery range, and seats five adults comfortably. Did I mention that it's getting better miles/kWh than my i3 on the highway? She also test-drove the Hyundai Kona BEV, which allegedly uses the same battery pack and motor. The Kona felt cramped inside, mostly due to Hyundai putting this thing that can only be described as an ironing board with switches on it between the front seats.

We have never owned or even considered a Korean car before, and were still under the old stereotype that they were cheap crap based on their first offerings in North America. The thing seems to be solid after 4,000+ miles, and I can't pry the key fob out of her hands. Best of all, her commuting energy costs have dropped from $400/month to about $75/month...and will be significantly less than that going forward since a business next to where she works just installed two free chargers for public use.....
What sold you on the Kia over the Hyundai? The lease on my Bolt EV just ended, and am looking for another EV. I'd get another Bolt (it's been flawless) but I was told the tax credit is not as much as with Hyunday/Kia, not sure if that's true. I really like both of the Korean offerings, but haven't had a chance to test drive them yet. Tesla is out of consideration (horrible quality, service, parts availability, unreliable tech, not to mention they're overpriced).
Thanks,
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      08-05-2019, 08:09 PM   #18
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When my DW started looking for an EV, the Hyundai Kona BEV was her choice. My car-guy brother owns a gas Kona, and raves about it as a daily commuter car. The test drive was impressive, but the cabin seemed cramped by that stupid ironing board with switches between the two front seats:





Besides the cramped front seats, the rear seats were tight on leg room. The ceiling also seemed low in the front seats, but this may have been because it had a sunroof.

When I was talking to my brother about it, he suggested looking at the Kia Niro BEV because it allegedly uses the same exact motor and batteries but is a bit larger and was getting even better reviews online. Our local Kia dealership only had a gas Niro in stock, which DW sat in (without driving) and decided that it had the proper interior room that she wanted. Ordered the BEV version sight unseen on the spot, and all of the dealer's sales/service staff were hovering around it when we arrived for pickup the next week since it was the first one they ever saw.

It doesn't have the sunroof, and the ceiling seems higher. The front seats aren't cramped, and the rear seats had acceptable leg room. Everything seems one size larger, and as I said I can't pry the key fob out of DW's hands for coming up on three months of ownership now. She shows it off and explains the EV lifestyle wherever she goes, and it surprises a lot of people.

They both have the same "paddle shifter" setup to vary regenerative braking force, and drive the same minus a bit of performance/range lost in the Kia due to being slightly larger.

The one benefit that the Hyundai had over the Kia was a better battery warranty. Hyundai was offering a "lifetime" battery warranty, with no spelled out parameters for degradation or age. It would have been fun to see how it played out in court if a claim needed to be made with the lack of fine print in the printed sales materials.....
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      08-06-2019, 12:04 AM   #19
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Thanks vreihen16 for taking the time to answer, much appreciated. My local Kia dealer doesn't have the EV in stock yet. I'll wait to test drive it first.
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      08-06-2019, 12:30 AM   #20
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lol why dont people just drive what they want. fuck what anyone else says lmao
Funniest dude on this forum period...
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      08-06-2019, 08:50 AM   #21
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What the hell they were driving before...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
...Best of all, her commuting energy costs have dropped from $400/month to about $75/month...
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      08-06-2019, 12:44 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by Sedoy View Post
What the hell they were driving before...?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vreihen16 View Post
...Best of all, her commuting energy costs have dropped from $400/month to about $75/month...
[QUOTE=Sedoy;25110624]What the hell they were driving before...?

A six cylinder pickup truck with manual transmission, since she needed it for her former job. The thing drank $20+ of gas per day on her new long commute, compared with $3.70/day of electricity for the Kia BEV.

My shorter 21 mile commute used to cost me $3.10/day in diesel if I took my pickup, or $3.75/day in super unleaded if I took the 1.8T. The i3 uses about $0.52/day.

Energy savings of 75% are common when switching from dinosaur juice to electrons. If she uses the free charger next to her office building, the cost could be zero.....
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