E92 M3 ZCP vs Golf R 2018

[kangroay]

Hi guys,

I am in a deep dilemma of not being able to make a decision.

I have been crazily loving everything (design, appearance, engine, sound, etc.) of E92 M3 ZCP. However, with frustrations of not being able to find a right one, I kinda looked into few other options and I recently slightly fell in love with Golf R. I test drove a Golf R manual today and I really liked it. Also, the infotainment and technologies were quite amazing. However, the manual one is the only available option for now, I am hesitating to get it since I am living in LA where there's a lot a traffic and driving manual could be painful. DSG model will be available with 2019 Golf R which I have to wait quite a long time.

Another reason I am hesitating to choose M3 is that I heard a lot about the throttle body actuator and even extended warranty such as Maxcare from Carmax would not cover it(is this true?).

I really have to make a decision pretty soon but I am kinda lost now. Could you kindly share your opinion with me?

Thanks,

[thkfast]

I hear ya, it's tough to justify $30-40K for a 6-10 year old (previous generation) M3 when there are numerous current sporty cars out there for the same money. A friend of mine, who owns and races BMWs recently bought a Golf R for his daily. He loves it. VWs are tight, well balanced cars with nice interiors and perfect ergonomics. An E9X M3 is a wonderful car to own, I'm not worried about the TA or RBs. The only thing is, they aren't making any more of them...and getting your hands on a low mileage example may start to become cost prohibitive. Now is the time to buy the last of the V8 M3s. There will always be new modern mass produced sporty cars to buy after you've experienced The One.

[JackieChiles]

Originally Posted by kangroay

Hi guys,

I am in a deep dilemma of not being able to make a decision.

I have been crazily loving everything (design, appearance, engine, sound, etc.) of E92 M3 ZCP. However, with frustrations of not being able to find a right one, I kinda looked into few other options and I recently slightly fell in love with Golf R. I test drove a Golf R manual today and I really liked it. Also, the infotainment and technologies were quite amazing. However, the manual one is the only available option for now, I am hesitating to get it since I am living in LA where there's a lot a traffic and driving manual could be painful. DSG model will be available with 2019 Golf R which I have to wait quite a long time.

Another reason I am hesitating to choose M3 is that I heard a lot about the throttle body actuator and even extended warranty such as Maxcare from Carmax would not cover it(is this true?).

I really have to make a decision pretty soon but I am kinda lost now. Could you kindly share your opinion with me?

Thanks,

if i were looking for a daily that would be tough. i have an e92 but its a weekend car for me.

i think IF you can get a carmax warranty and IF you can deal with not having the car at times due to repairs the e9x may make sense.

that said, i LOVE the golf R. it handles great, and the chassis that those cars are built on is incredible. even the GTI is a great handling car. great balance between ride quality and handling.

that said, why not consider a slightly used golf R? unless the new infotainment is that important to you?

but i dont think you would be missing out a ton by getting a golf R specifically for daily use.

i loved the manual in the golf, extremely easy to drive. but im a manual guy. im sure the dsg is good as well.

good news is i dont think you can go wrong, but you need to drive both, ideally on the same day. then the answer will become more clear.

[Soden82]

I have driven both my friends Golf R and my other friends E92 ZCP M3. Both are incredible in different ways, I gained a lot of respect for Golf Rs. They're both different animals. I hear you on your dilemma; I'm looking for the right ZCP M3 currently and was debating going to feel out an R/S3.

Tuned the Golf R is very very quick; like no 4 cylinder should have that much power. The car is so light and pulls so hard to redline. As we know the E92 is also rightfully fast, but in such a different way. And the handling is still just a little bit better than the R even though the R handles tremendously well for a hatchback.

If I was you I'd look in the used market for an R/S3 unless it's a deal breaker that it's new. I only drove the DSG ones and they're very quick shifting like a dual clutch.

I'd also consider the market and realize that the e9x M3 is a more significant and special car than the Golf R will ever be and take that into consideration.

Happy hunting!

[bkfastwagon]

I owned a 2017 dsg Golf R before I got my m3 a year ago. I initially planned on keeping both but ended up selling Golf R as I just wasn't driving it. I sometimes miss it for its practicality and the torque ( i had apr stage 1). Overall one of the best fun usable cars currently on the market. M3 with the v8 feels much more special though. There are plenty of turbocharged four bangers out there.

[ayao]

I recently picked up a used Golf R and like it a lot. There are deals out there to be had if you are patient. However, comparing the R to a V8 M3 seems like apples and oranges since I imagine the driving experiences are so disparate.
Your decision will ultimately boil down to what you prioritize. 2dr vs 4dr, AWD vs RWD, NA V8 vs turbo 4 cyl ... etc etc etc. The thing that keeps me thinking about eventually getting an E9x M3 is that sound, RBs and TAs be damned. In contrast, the R will just never be an amazing-sounding car; it has taken me a while to finally get it to the point where I’m reasonably satisfied with the sound it makes.

[e90335e36m3]

The Golf-R will:
- Feel faster than the M3, because torque sensation
- Be faster than the M3, with very simple, cheap modifications
- May be as fun to drive, depending on what you value in your driving experience
- Be more technologically advanced then the M3
- Have a much more forgiving clutch than the M3
- be more reliable than the M3
- Will be cheaper to own than the M3

What the Golf will not be:
- As high performing as the M3, stock for stock (e.g. balance, stability, acceleration)
- As loud and sonorous as the M3
- As unique/distinguished/cool as the m3
- As stylish as the M3 (subjective)

First, performance wise these cars were not designed with the same consumer in mind. Stock for stock, the E92 M3 is a better performance car. Technological evolution is what is bringing the Golf-R closer to the M3, but it's not because Volkswagen has decided to attract the M3 consumer. The performance of F80 M3 tells you how far apart these cars are. However, the M3 is not exquisitely fast relative to the new cars coming out generally and its direct competitors.

To me personally, the styling and uniqueness of the M3 (relative to the Golf-R) is what tips the scales. The Golf-R just doesn't have the panache and pedigree of the M3. I feel like it falls into the same category that the SRT-4 fell in. "I drive an SRT-4. Sir, you drive a Neon." Volkswagen was created to be the "people's car" back in the 30s. Volkswagen is the equivalent of Honda or Toyota. You couldn't pay me to take a Toyota Scion R (if one existed) over an E92 M3, even if the performance leaps and bounds better. Over an E36 M3? Sure. But the E92 M3 is still relevant enough in terms of styling and uniqueness (relative to Golf-R) in my opinion. I feel like the M3 has earned its place as a standalone marque, the Golf-R is still just a souped up Golf.

Also, the Golf-R styling is just not aggressive enough, it's almost indistinguishable from the GTI. It also looks like an egg, which doesn't scream sports car to me. When my wife drives my M3 and I look in the rearview, it looks properly aggressive. Where the Golf-R wins out is gadgets and technology inside the cabin. What's that worth to you?

Seems to me that you also like the M3 more overall in terms of styling and performance. So the question is, are these factors worth the additional cost of ownership that will absolutely come with the M3? To me, yes.

[Montaver]

Golf R is a brilliant 'do everything' car. Would make the perfect daily driver, although if you don't need 4WD it would be worth looking at the GTi too. As a weekend car there are more exciting options. From a pure cost perspective a new Golf is going to be cheaper to run, although when you factor in depreciation probably not that much cheaper if you buy the right M3. Both have a great aftermarket, but there is a BMW tax on everything for the M3. Really you have to drive both and see which you like better, but if its just for commuting and your sat in LA traffic all day driving the M3 will get frustrating.

[JackieChiles]

Originally Posted by Montaver

Golf R is a brilliant 'do everything' car. Would make the perfect daily driver, although if you don't need 4WD it would be worth looking at the GTi too. As a weekend car there are more exciting options. From a pure cost perspective a new Golf is going to be cheaper to run, although when you factor in depreciation probably not that much cheaper if you buy the right M3. Both have a great aftermarket, but there is a BMW tax on everything for the M3. Really you have to drive both and see which you like better, but if its just for commuting and your sat in LA traffic all day driving the M3 will get frustrating.

For sure.

Though the golf r has historically also had very good resale.

At minimum, comparable to the m3.

[Timujin]

I was in the same boat, but the dealership wouldn't let me test drive a Golf R. Then I found my M3. When I am driving my M3 and see a Golf R I am happy I saved $10,000+. The Golf R is very modern, and even has engine noise pumped into the cabin! I also have a 3 year old and the M3 has more room and cushion in the event of a crash.

[Soden82]

Originally Posted by Timujin

I was in the same boat, but the dealership wouldn't let me test drive a Golf R. Then I found my M3. When I am driving my M3 and see a Golf R I am happy I saved $10,000+. The Golf R is very modern, and even has engine noise pumped into the cabin! I also have a 3 year old and the M3 has more room and cushion in the event of a crash.

That's funny you say that cause someone I know works at a VW dealership and they won't let people come off the street and test drive a Golf R. It's like they think that the Golf R is an exotic car. Don't they realize that you can go into an Audi dealership and drive an R8/RS7 or go to Mercedes and test drive a C63s/E63s.

[Timujin]

Originally Posted by Soden82

That's funny you say that cause someone I know works at a VW dealership and they won't let people come off the street and test drive a Golf R. It's like they think that the Golf R is an exotic car. Don't they realize that you can go into an Audi dealership and drive an R8/RS7 or go to Mercedes and test drive a C63s/E63s.

Originally Posted by Soden82

That's funny you say that cause someone I know works at a VW dealership and they won't let people come off the street and test drive a Golf R. It's like they think that the Golf R is an exotic car. Don't they realize that you can go into an Audi dealership and drive an R8/RS7 or go to Mercedes and test drive a C63s/E63s.

Very true. I have gone to a BMW dealership, tossed keys to a new BMW and told come back when you are done. Solo test drive!

VW be like meh meh meh oh no you can't test drive the R. R unsold it is.

[roastbeef]

I'm only reminded if this because you mentioned the tech in the golf R... I have a friend that has one and liked the tech, but he said it's quite buggy and the system often crashes and has to reboot. I think he mentioned there was a dealer fix for this though.
He digs his car though.

[TTony]

Initial cost may be similar for both cars but look at total cost of ownership. In 1-2 years, the value of the E9x will still be similar. The value of the Golf R will be much less.

[JackieChiles]

Originally Posted by TTony

Initial cost may be similar for both cars but look at total cost of ownership. In 1-2 years, the value of the E9x will still be similar. The value of the Golf R will be much less.

Not accurate

Golf r resale is pretty good if purchased used, just like the e9x.

[kangroay]

Originally Posted by thkfast

I hear ya, it's tough to justify $30-40K for a 6-10 year old (previous generation) M3 when there are numerous current sporty cars out there for the same money. A friend of mine, who owns and races BMWs recently bought a Golf R for his daily. He loves it. VWs are tight, well balanced cars with nice interiors and perfect ergonomics. An E9X M3 is a wonderful car to own, I'm not worried about the TA or RBs. The only thing is, they aren't making any more of them...and getting your hands on a low mileage example may start to become cost prohibitive. Now is the time to buy the last of the V8 M3s. There will always be new modern mass produced sporty cars to buy after you've experienced The One.

I have to keep persuading myself as what you said haha. Thanks for the advice!

[kangroay]

Thanks guys. I really appreciate all your thoughtful advice. I recently went to see a Lime Rock edition being sold by a private seller and it was fantastic and in an impeccable condition. Fully loaded but has 58k miles on it for $40k. Do you guys think it's worth it? I am still scared of the rod bearings and the throttle actuators but I just loved it... frankly the moment I was next to the M3, I couldn't even think of Golf R. I am not sure when I can really finalize this decision.

[roastbeef]

did you drive the m3 yet? be sure to take it up to 8,300 rpm when you do. thats when the angels sing.
the m3 and golf R are very different cars. figure out which one really speaks to you.

[Transfer]

If you live in LA, don't get a front biased AWD car when you can still get a RWD V8 M3 in good condition! I bought through Carmax with warranty and I personally think it's the way to go. I don't know why they wouldn't cover TAs as they aren't wear items even though they all die out eventually. I had my DCT leak (which is common) fixed under warranty to the tune of $2k.

[ayao]

The Golf does everything remarkably well but does these them with relatively little fanfare and as a result can seem a bit lacking in soul. On top of that, it’s a car with proletariat roots and because of this can putter around virtually unnoticed. This will definitely not be the case with the Lime Rock you describe above.

[spazzyfry123]

Originally Posted by kangroay

Thanks guys. I really appreciate all your thoughtful advice. I recently went to see a Lime Rock edition being sold by a private seller and it was fantastic and in an impeccable condition. Fully loaded but has 58k miles on it for $40k. Do you guys think it's worth it? I am still scared of the rod bearings and the throttle actuators but I just loved it... frankly the moment I was next to the M3, I couldn't even think of Golf R. I am not sure when I can really finalize this decision.

If you're looking to spend that kind of scratch, why not get a GTI (or F56 Mini Cooper S like I did) AND an E92 M3? You reached out to the more expensive end of the E9x pricing spectrum whereas you could get a pretty decent E92 for a lot less than that.

[jv92red]

Originally Posted by kangroay

However, the manual one is the only available option for now, I am hesitating to get it since I am living in LA where there's a lot a traffic and driving manual could be painful. DSG model will be available with 2019 Golf R which I have to wait quite a long time.

I daily my 6MT 5 days a week in SoCal traffic and wouldn't have it any other way. At 48 years old, I'm no spring chicken so I have the same body aches as any other person my age but never have I thought to put the word "Painful" in the same sentence with driving a manual unless you're nurturing a torn left ACL.