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12-12-2017, 08:50 PM | #89 | |
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12-12-2017, 09:52 PM | #90 |
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LOL! As above, I bought my first M3 in 1999 largely as a result of the tremendous press it garnered especially in C&D. It saddens me that the brand no longer holds onto its once vaunted position in the performance car continuum, although, I think there are still models which will hang with anybody.
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12-13-2017, 11:38 AM | #91 | |
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Merc changes their interior and exterior designs radically with every new generation. Their cars still look uniquely Mercedes, but offer a different take on the design language, much like what Bangle did with BMW exteriors and interiors. In these photos, the Merc's interior clearly has a more engaging design, better and more "exotic" material quality, and overall feels like a very special place to sit inside. On the flip side, unless you haven't sat in a BMW since the E46, the current 3er's interior is more of the same we've been seeing over the past 11+ years. |
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12-13-2017, 12:00 PM | #92 |
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Previously: 2014 i8; 2013 650i convertible; 2013 650i Gran Coupe; 2013 X1; 2010 550i GT; 2010 535 GT; 2010 Z4 3.5; 2008 535ixt; 2007 M6 convertible; 2006 650i convertible; 1996 Z3; 1980 633CSi; 1978 630CS; 1972 3.0CS; 1971 Bavaria. (1971; 1979-2005 & 2017 - ? -- the Mercedes years.)
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12-13-2017, 12:47 PM | #93 | |
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On the Car and Driver note, I don't really value what they say anymore. They rated the S6 over the M5 which to me states they simply do not push the car hard enough during their tests. I have seen a few of their recent tests and not much makes sense. They hated the comp package F80 while motor trend loved it. These are all based on opinions and shouldn't be taken too seriously. I trust Chris Harris' point of view more, he goes more in depth about how the car feels at the limit. |
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12-13-2017, 02:05 PM | #94 | |
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Chris Harris is great, but his reviews are geared toward the hardcore enthusiast -- something most of us are not. It's nice to hear that point of view because it represents a pinnacle of sorts that we all aspire to, but most of us simply don't live in that world regularly. In that respect, C&D's point of view -- that of a more casual enthusiast that many more people slot into -- is inherently more useful. That's by design. Any one of the phalanx of C&D staffers past or present would trade shoes with Chris Harris in a heartbeat because most are actual hardcore enthusiasts -- and we get to see glimpses of that in columns, anecdotes, and such. But they can't position their editorial that way because the majority of the readership can't relate. It's the classic conundrum of a critic: Do I talk about what I love in my language, or do I talk about what my readers love in their language? The correct answer is the latter for any critic worth their salt.
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12-13-2017, 02:28 PM | #95 | |
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My point is, they are complaining about an aspect of the car which they haven't even really tested out properly. I feel like they keep emphasizing that new BMWs lack in performance when in reality they are still fastest in almost all categories (M cars). Another funny article I saw recently was a E43 AMG beating a 540i in a comparison test (not sure if it was CD) and after taking a look at the pricing, I couldn't stop laughing. The E43 was around 96k, that is about 25k more expensive than the 540i that it competes with. A fully loaded M550i (which will destroy the E43 in every possible way) is cheaper than the E43. I feel like MB is really paying big bucks to some of these magazines. Also, GLC43 came in at 71k in another recent test.. this is a X3 M40i competitor, their prices are ridiculous. |
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12-13-2017, 03:00 PM | #96 |
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I think it all depends on what model is being tested. There are M drivers who buy the car because of its panache and its label.. But there are also M drivers who buy it because of its track cred. I cant speak for the rest of the BMW line, but BMW in the past, and to a limited degree in the present, has gone to great lengths to produce a great handling balanced machine which which exhibits its' stuff on the track near the limit.
To compare these models to Audi or MB at less than their limits is to totally disregard that which makes some M models what they are, and why they are appreciated as such.
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12-13-2017, 03:45 PM | #97 | |
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Track capability is an element of that for some of those customers, yes -- but the buyer will never actually put it to that use. It's that the car is capable of it that is appealing. This is part and parcel of why mags such as C&D pair certain cars together. It's the mag staff's read of what the casual enthusiast will consider competing vehicles. "Competing" can mean everything from track times, sticker price, and chassis/drivetrain to social panache and which car's likely to be parked at the front of the valet stand instead of the lot across the street.
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12-13-2017, 03:54 PM | #98 | |
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Motor Trend did the same thing with its Cadillac boner. Hey, let's keep saying they are the greatest cars in the world because the pro-America crowd will love to hear it. It doesn't matter that save for steering/chassis tuning, all their sedans suck in every other facet and their non-existent sales reflect that. |
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12-13-2017, 04:13 PM | #99 | |
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Your explanation of what comprises 'competing' is also right on, and might explain why you could potentially see an unexpected comparo between a GT350 and a Quadrofoglio.
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12-13-2017, 04:31 PM | #100 |
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I can truthfully say that I have never purchased any of my vehicles based on a magazine review. It all came down to shopping around and driving what was available at the time that fit my needs, lifestyle, and sometimes connected with me on an emotional level. Whatever was the best car based on this, I then bought.
That said, I have had only one regret which was a '01 Dodge Durango that aged way quicker than it should have and basically was ready to wholesale out before it reached 80K miles. Many Toyotas have been parked in my driveway over the years as I found them to deliver the best overall package per dollar even if they weren't always the best "drivers" cars. The landscape has changed and that isn't necessarily the case any more. Being open minded is the best approach. My three favorite cars which I have owned > 1978 SAAB EMS 1984 Toyota Supra 1987 BMW 535is And hopefully 2017 BMW M2, but still too early to tell. Last edited by M2Nebula; 12-13-2017 at 04:44 PM.. |
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12-13-2017, 04:39 PM | #101 | |
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If they can address the reliability and put in a proper manual transmission, it'd be high on my list of M3 successor cars.
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12-13-2017, 05:15 PM | #102 | |
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12-13-2017, 05:28 PM | #103 | |
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12-13-2017, 05:48 PM | #104 | |
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On the M3’s note, the Quad is the only other car I would consider and it would be a fight between those two. C63 is heavier, slower and more of a luxury item compared to the M3 and Quad. The ATS V doesn’t do anything for me either. |
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12-13-2017, 05:59 PM | #105 |
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Has any one her driven a Camry? Any Camry? My GF has a new one, it's good reliable transportation but a performance car it is not. Nice car though for 30k on the XSE.
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12-13-2017, 06:10 PM | #106 | ||
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The car lives up the hype. It was seriously impressive. During the whole drive, I was thinking to myself, this is the car BMW needs to make. It's pure fun, I was having a great time behind the wheel. Driving normally, it feels like a sedan. When you drive fast on twisty roads, it feels like you're driving a gokart - it darts and feels light on its feet, then when you feed the throttle, the big power comes on with a roar that changes to a scream as the RPM goes up and you're aware 500hp is under your foot. Lift throttle and it sounds like firecrackers popping on the overrun. No M3 from the last decade drives like that! I'm just wary of the reliability. There's a lot of reports of cars breaking down and other issues. I do have a video of me starting the car, but I haven't uploaded it.
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12-13-2017, 07:00 PM | #108 |
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Modern BMWs just suck relative to the competition. The brand threw away their USP, good steering feel, adept handling, stout engines, in the marketplace and went for chasing the everyman and the cash.
If driving dynamics are what you desire, you have to go domestic. A new Mustang, Camaro or Corvette obliterates a comparable M4 in ability and driving pleasure. As sad as this is, even the ancient 370Z offers superior driving dynamics, provided the brakes haven't caught fire yet. Before you ask: Yes, I have driven all of them. BMW has lost their mojo.
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12-13-2017, 07:12 PM | #109 | |
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As an ex owner of many cars the Alfa is the single one that put me in a tremendous distress. There were weeks when the car was seeing the shop every two days. In my family there was a Maserati with a similar reliability and boy what a lesson that was. I rather own a horse than any Italian car doesn't matter which one. Secondly, have a look at Alfa's interior and be patient, the crickets will show up soon... it is not If is When... maybe I am in minority here but boy, that Alfa is really ugly to me. And BTW, I will take a 240M over Alfa anytime. |
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12-13-2017, 08:03 PM | #110 |
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I've owned a 2014 650ix for 3 months and can't believe how overrated this car is. Always some little thing going wrong. Burning a qt every 500 miles and I'm told this is NORMAL. For 100K it's a joke. Give me a good jap car anyday. Beat em all day, never brake, handle great and hold there value. Ultimate Driving Machine = Fake news. Would sell it if I could get close to what I paid. Offered 10K less from Carmax. Never again.
Booie May want to look into this. http://www.bmwoilconsumptionlawsuit.com/ |
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