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      06-24-2018, 06:24 PM   #1
triggz82
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Balancing Problem - Any input?

I recently had my rims refinished (slight rash repair and powdercoating) and while I was there I installed four new PS4S - same size (255/275) as the worn out PSS.

After getting it on the highway I noticed a very mild vibration in the steering wheel and seat at speed (~120kmh). I attributed this to either needing an alignment or poor balancing job. I was swapping to coilovers soon so held off.

I recently did the alignment and a roadforce balance. Alignment had no issues, but they could not roadforce balance any of the wheels. Each wheel was showing at least 40lbs of roadforce (should be well below 20lbs). The alignment shop I went to said the tires could be defective and try to warranty them through Michelin. I'm completely stumped.

-The rims before refinishing were fine. No vibrations w/ Mich PSS. Is it possible that during the refinishing process the rims may have warped in the oven? That is the best idea I could come up with as only 2 of them had mild rash that needed to be repaired. The rims and tires balanced fine, just not w/ roadforce.
-Is it possible four tires could all be defective? Being that they are PS4S which are a brand new tire?
-Is it possible the shop's Roadforce balancer need to be re-calibrated? 40lbs+ of roadforce seems excessive, however I only have a very mild vibration from ~110-120kmh.
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      06-24-2018, 09:10 PM   #2
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How is it even possible that 4 tires would be defective? Take it elsewhere and try to get it road force balanced again.
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      06-24-2018, 09:24 PM   #3
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Can they flip the tires around to reduce the road force?
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      06-24-2018, 09:44 PM   #4
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This doesn't make sense...not a single rim and tire could be balanced? If so, there is really only one option in my mind, or I can say at least what I would do. I would take the car back to the alignment shop or wherever you bought the tires, have them remove all four tires from the rim, put the rim on the balancer minus the tire and have them spin it. Watch carefully for any wobble in the wheel to rule out the rims did not get some sort of damage. If you cannot notice a wobble they should be round.

If they cannot confirm its your suspension or they cannot road force balance the tire within spec. Then demand new tires, how many km's did you put on them? I have found Michelin to be pretty good with stuff like this.

I had a similar issue on my previous M3 on a set of HRE, I could not get the right front passenger rim and tire to balance out right. It did turn out to be the tire and it was a PSS. The tire shop replaced the tire after I put about 700 km's on it. One tire is not 4 though...wish I could be more helpful but I think you have to rule it out one variation at a time.
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      06-25-2018, 12:28 PM   #5
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Powder coating at too high of a temperature will weaken the wheel. Often they powder coat at a safe temperature but overheat the wheel to remove the existing paint. It's possible that's what happened. I doubt all 4 tires are defective but powder coating itself wouldn't cause an imbalance. It would be something that would happen after use.
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      06-25-2018, 05:24 PM   #6
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Update - Will bring it back to wheel shop to re-balance. Turns out they have a roadforce machine as well and offered to force match, etc for free. Highly doubt all 4 michelins could be defective... If they balance there, I'm going back to the alignment shop for a refund...
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      06-25-2018, 08:41 PM   #7
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I had the EXACT same issue with brand new rims + brand new PS4S. Turns out the installer did not put enough tire mounting lube and the bead did not fully seat properly resulting in poor road balance weight.

I took it to another shop that knew what they were doing and they got it down from 40-50lbs to managable 18, 11, 13, 8


here is my post in my journal:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=87
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      06-25-2018, 11:28 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derbo View Post
I had the EXACT same issue with brand new rims + brand new PS4S. Turns out the installer did not put enough tire mounting lube and the bead did not fully seat properly resulting in poor road balance weight.

I took it to another shop that knew what they were doing and they got it down from 40-50lbs to managable 18, 11, 13, 8


here is my post in my journal:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...3&postcount=87
Incredibly useful. Thank you! I'm going to mention this when back at the shop later this week.
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      06-26-2018, 01:27 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by derbo View Post
I had the EXACT same issue with brand new rims + brand new PS4S. Turns out the installer did not put enough tire mounting lube and the bead did not fully seat properly resulting in poor road balance weight.

I took it to another shop that knew what they were doing and they got it down from 40-50lbs to managable 18, 11, 13, 8


here is my post in my journal:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...8;postcount=87
Good call. That has happened to me as well (with Cup2's).
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      06-29-2018, 07:03 PM   #10
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For anyone interested, I went back to try to force balance them again and was able to get two tires below 30lbs and one ended up showing a ridiculous 90lbs+. We spun the rims as well and they were perfectly straight. I was told two of the tires had random flat/dead spots almost as if the car had been sitting unmoved for months. I'm going back to the tire distributor to do an inspection and begin the warranty process w/ Michelin for all 4 tires. Really surprised to see this happening to higher end Michelin tires... but I guess it's just bad luck for me.
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      06-30-2018, 01:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triggz82 View Post
For anyone interested, I went back to try to force balance them again and was able to get two tires below 30lbs and one ended up showing a ridiculous 90lbs+. We spun the rims as well and they were perfectly straight. I was told two of the tires had random flat/dead spots almost as if the car had been sitting unmoved for months. I'm going back to the tire distributor to do an inspection and begin the warranty process w/ Michelin for all 4 tires. Really surprised to see this happening to higher end Michelin tires... but I guess it's just bad luck for me.
That's a bummer. I was unable to get one shop to fix it with multiple rebalances. The second shop I went to fixed the issue. I think you need to bring it to another shop to confirm.
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      06-30-2018, 01:49 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by triggz82 View Post
For anyone interested, I went back to try to force balance them again and was able to get two tires below 30lbs and one ended up showing a ridiculous 90lbs+. We spun the rims as well and they were perfectly straight. I was told two of the tires had random flat/dead spots almost as if the car had been sitting unmoved for months. I'm going back to the tire distributor to do an inspection and begin the warranty process w/ Michelin for all 4 tires. Really surprised to see this happening to higher end Michelin tires... but I guess it's just bad luck for me.
It's bad luck, or the shop you bought it from tried to pull a fast one.
Having 4 tires to be so out of balance sounds strange.
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