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11-23-2009, 10:03 AM | #89 |
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11-23-2009, 10:11 AM | #90 | |
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
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11-23-2009, 10:13 AM | #91 |
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That will be the perfect car for my wife who does not understand what the 3rd pedal is for and complains about the lack of power in traffic in most of the cars she had including her old SLK32
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11-23-2009, 10:21 AM | #92 | |
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P.S. Couldn't agree more about the normal DSG. |
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11-23-2009, 10:24 AM | #93 |
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IF you seriously don't understand where we are coming from on this subject then probably you shouldn't be reading this thread because it will annoy you more than our opinion of the M3's lack of torque.
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11-23-2009, 10:26 AM | #94 |
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Porsche will also be going the PDK route for future performance models, whether they will include a manual is up for debate, I reckon it will for the foreseeable future but not for as long as you might think.
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11-23-2009, 10:34 AM | #95 | |
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11-23-2009, 10:35 AM | #96 |
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Well I guess I am showing my age then as I want a true manual with a clutch,but I would settle for a full sequential dog box and I would not even complain about the noise on this forum
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11-23-2009, 12:47 PM | #97 | |
4th down; 4th quarter? Renegade.
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Maybe if you are coming from a bigger V8, or a high-output turbo engine, AND you expect the same feel from the M3, you will notice a difference. But to suggest that you will be annoyed is purely how YOU feel. It is not the status quo, just like "It's funny how people opinions have changed with so many now in agreement" is pure fantasy. |
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11-23-2009, 12:50 PM | #98 | |
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I rev the heck out of the car in daily driving and maximum attack mode shouldn't always be needed. Look at the GT3, it makes more torque, has less displacement and weighs less. BMW should have removed more weight, or added displacement like they did with the GTS. If the 4.0 was capable of the power and torque the GTS is putting down, why would they bother making a 4.4? I'm sure the engineers couldn't get the 4.0 to make the power and torque the 4.4 is making reliable while getting a decent MPG.
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11-23-2009, 12:55 PM | #99 |
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My Final word in this thread is: I test drove the M3 E90 M-DCT with EDC a month or so ago, it was the latest of the M3's sept 2009, I found it a delight to drive and found NO issues with the torque or the DCT box, all ran smoothly, a real pleasure to drive, after the manual RS4B7 I sold I much prefer this car.
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11-23-2009, 01:16 PM | #100 | |
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And, I don't see the point of the TT-RS comparison. That's not competition; it's a tiny 2-seater that weighs 400 lbs less. Of course, it will post the type of acceleration figures you presented. The cars are in different classes. You can say so is the 335 (despite the fact that it is a 4 seater and weighs about the same), but people keep on bringing it up. RS4 is probably the best basis for comparison. I still maintain that most of the complaints around the "lack of low end torque" is an artifact of people's unwillingness to use the throttle pedal. I can see why people migth be hesitant; WOT is much louder. It does get in the way as it attract too much attention during daily driving. Or they might be comparing the part-throttle response to a turbo car. Use the pedal, and the more torque that you'd know what to do with on the street is there. |
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11-23-2009, 01:18 PM | #101 | |
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Even the man, the legend Walter Rohrl himself said that the only reason why he would pick the Turbo over the GT3 would be for normal city driving or highway passing because of the low end torque does not require any downshifts and AWD because he lives in a very snowy area. GT3 for just about everything else.
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- Lamborghini on turbocharging Last edited by 330CIZHP; 11-23-2009 at 01:34 PM.. |
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11-23-2009, 01:31 PM | #102 |
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I simply included the TT-RS because we already have the data that shows the M3 can still out accelerate it yet in the typical daily driving that most people do it's the TT that was superior.
I agree that in comparison the two cars aren't direct rivals but the example is still a good one and shows that a turbo unit in the next M3 will be a better option for 95% of M3 owners. BTW the RS4 isn't a better example, like the M3 it's also a high revving N/A with limited torque. Also look at a number of owners on here that have modified their M3s, yourself included, clearly none of you were 100% happy with BMW's own efforts. |
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11-23-2009, 01:39 PM | #103 |
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Footie, my drivetrain is bone stock except the exhaust, which is for sound really. I don't see the point of spending money and risking my warranty to get another 40hp out of a car that already has 414hp. The car does not have any torque issue as far as I am concerned. That is in people's heads. If you start thinking that way, even 400 ft lbs will not be "enough".
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11-23-2009, 01:39 PM | #104 | |
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11-23-2009, 01:41 PM | #105 | ||
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Personally, I find that the M3 has plenty of torque to deliver satisfying "on the road entertainment." Since when does torque equal entertainment, anyway? IMO, the M3 is more fun than any other car you list for other reasons such as its RWD layout with LSD, chassis neutrality (as opposed to too much oversteer ala C63 or too much understeer), sharp throttle response, and incredible sound/smoothness at high revs. Every time I drive it, I think "Holy sh*t this car is fast!" Quote:
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11-23-2009, 01:59 PM | #106 |
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6MT Here and no issues keeping the RPM high enough to make good power! More torque all across would be nice, but no issue with lack down low. Just gotta keep it in the right gear. I suppose a simple fix if you want more down low is a rear diff swap.
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11-23-2009, 02:15 PM | #107 | |
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I would also like to add my own ridiculous comparison to the mix. My dad keeps a 1999 Chevy pickup around to haul crap in. It has a 5.0l V8 that makes 285 ft/lbs of torque at 2800 rpms and has a towing capacity of around 15000 pounds. I'm just sayin'. |
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11-23-2009, 02:28 PM | #108 | |
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BMW did right in the way of HP, but they did wrong with 295lb ft of TQ for your every day STREET driven average M3 buyer/owner
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11-23-2009, 02:30 PM | #109 | |
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What I am am talking about is normal driving around town not using full throttle.The S65 is much quicker if you use all its capabilities and much more fun to drive.The N54 is a lazy drivers fast engine just like the new V8 turbo's from BMW are.fast yes,but not much fun! |
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11-23-2009, 02:31 PM | #110 | |
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