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      08-26-2018, 11:22 PM   #1
sojirovs
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Daily drivable, a few track days per year

I attended roughly 10 track session with my s2000, then baby arrived 2 years ago. I sold my beloved s2000 and picked up '13 CPO (warranty remaining until June 2019), ZCP and DCT.
I would like to keep my m3 street drivable condition as it needs to carry my baby twice a week.
Since last month, my track buddies had been bugging me to go to a track session in October, so I have been searching forum what to prepare for.
The track I will go is familiar and vivid in my memory, so I am planning to install a few safety features as I may go hard in afternoon session if I feel comfortable pushing the car. I want to have a fun day and learn more.

My major dilemma is what type of brake pads I will be using. I am not in favor of swapping pads after each track events (I think I will go 4 times a year from now on). It seems to be PFC08 is the most favorite among members, but too squeaky on street use. Pagid RS29 seems to be a little bit better. Is there any other options that are street drivable but doesn't fade at track? I don't mind having some noise. My commute is 10 mins.

- Will be using Castrol SRF and SS line.
- Since I still have factory warranty, should I be worried about blown motor due to rod bearing issue?
- My least favorite part of M3 is the seat position. It is way too high for my taste. Would bucket seat make it much lower?
- MPSS, plenty of thread left.
- All other parts are OEM.
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      08-26-2018, 11:48 PM   #2
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Currently running Project Mu HC+ on my BBK. Should be good, minimal squeal on street. Haven't tracked them yet, but they should be a higher performing level than what I ran in the past.
http://www.project-mu.co.jp/en/products/pad_hcplus.html

Also heard good things about Ferodo DS2500 for mixed use
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      08-27-2018, 11:09 AM   #3
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Ferodo DS2500 is pretty much the pinnacle of hybrid pads. I can attest to this on multiple vehicles: my S4, my M3 (both on OEM brakes and a StopTech kit), and even my Corvette.

I would not run PFC08, RS29, etc. for a car that is only at the track a couple of times a year. You will chew up your rotors and they'll squeal non-stop. The good thing about the DS2500 is that if you later decide to swap track pads in, you can keep the DS2500 for street use.
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      08-27-2018, 01:26 PM   #4
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+1 on Ferodo DS2500
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      08-27-2018, 06:02 PM   #5
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I'm in a similar position. My 2012 comp package was 100% stock daily but wanted to also track it. So got the following and didnt change any of the daily drive character of the car:

-StopTech 380/365 BBK with street pads
-255/275 Cup2 tires on stock ZCP wheels
-Ground control camber plates and front tension strut monoball conversion - can change camber/alignment on the fly
-8,600 rpm tune and Euro MDM

Took the car to The Thermal Club and was only 7 seconds off my 991 GT3 on a 3 minute course.
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      08-27-2018, 06:23 PM   #6
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If you really want to avoid swapping pads, I would suggest that you:

1) Pick a pad whose torque curve doesn't fall off a cliff when it exceeds the max operating temp (nothing like going for your brakes and you have none)
2) Put temperature paint on your rotors so you can tell when you are getting fast enough that you are approaching the max temps so you can then decide to either bite the bullet and start swapping pads or find some other way to reduce your brake temps (less stickier tires, better cooling).
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      08-27-2018, 07:13 PM   #7
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+1 on Pmu HC+. Lasts long too, and kind to rotors.

DS2500 is not a track friendly pad.
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      08-28-2018, 07:13 AM   #8
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Thank you all for inputs!
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      08-28-2018, 09:07 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redd View Post
DS2500 is not a track friendly pad.
It absolutely is track-capable for all but the most advanced drivers on R-comps and running forced induction.

The torque is fairly linear and it does not fall off a cliff when it gets hot.
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      08-28-2018, 09:09 AM   #10
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I've faded DS2500 at track on several cars with less power and weight than my M3, on UHP tires only. Then again, Sepang is a high speed track with two long straights where you hard brake from around 200kph down to a 2nd gear hairpin.
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      08-30-2018, 01:25 PM   #11
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I know this is blasphemy, but my experience with DS2500 hasnt been amazing.

I have worked my way up to fade on the track repeatedly (not bad, but it meant I had to think about the brakes).

Having beat the crap out of the pads, they then sounded like a dumptruck on the street (though the bite was nice).

Now I use DSUno on the track and I have some random Ferodo street pads for my BBK on the street. With a BBK, swapping the front pads is only 15 minutes longer than the wheel swap.

DSUno is utterly faultless and consistent on the track and the street pads street on the street.
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      08-30-2018, 03:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redd View Post
+1 on Pmu HC+. Lasts long too, and kind to rotors.

DS2500 is not a track friendly pad.
+3 on Project Mu HC+. Great street/track hybrid pads and they will handle higher heat than DS2500 and Endless MX72. Both of those fade easily on track and leave terrible pad deposits once overheated.

I will say that I have gotten squeal from HC+ pads in street driving. The Project Mu HC-CS makes less noise on the street. I would recommend those over the HC+. The HC-CS has less initial bite when cold compared to the HC+ but on track it is fine.

I usually order them directly from Japan. RHDJapan comes to mind. I also order directly from Yahoo Japan and have it cross shipped (shipped to local Japanese address and then shipped to the USA). There are places in America that get them but it's special order and may take a long time. EAS got me a set... and it took 6 months to get brake pads. When I order from Japan it usually takes 2-3 weeks.
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Last edited by Z K; 08-30-2018 at 03:24 PM..
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      08-30-2018, 05:37 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
+3 on Project Mu HC+. Great street/track hybrid pads and they will handle higher heat than DS2500 and Endless MX72. Both of those fade easily on track and leave terrible pad deposits once overheated.

I will say that I have gotten squeal from HC+ pads in street driving. The Project Mu HC-CS makes less noise on the street. I would recommend those over the HC+. The HC-CS has less initial bite when cold compared to the HC+ but on track it is fine.

I usually order them directly from Japan. RHDJapan comes to mind. I also order directly from Yahoo Japan and have it cross shipped (shipped to local Japanese address and then shipped to the USA). There are places in America that get them but it's special order and may take a long time. EAS got me a set... and it took 6 months to get brake pads. When I order from Japan it usually takes 2-3 weeks.
I can order HC+ pads from EAS but couldn't find HC-CS. I hope the squeal isn't too crazy, I guess it's ok to have squeal but not at every red lights.
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      08-30-2018, 05:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kpewpew View Post
Currently running Project Mu HC+ on my BBK. Should be good, minimal squeal on street. Haven't tracked them yet, but they should be a higher performing level than what I ran in the past.
http://www.project-mu.co.jp/en/products/pad_hcplus.html

Also heard good things about Ferodo DS2500 for mixed use
Could you elaborate more on squeal? What do you mean by minimal squeal? Would I expect to hear occasionally? 1 out of 3 red lights? Only when it is cold?
Thanks!
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      08-30-2018, 05:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sojirovs View Post
Could you elaborate more on squeal? What do you mean by minimal squeal? Would I expect to hear occasionally? 1 out of 3 red lights? Only when it is cold?
Thanks!
Typically the squeal is right as you come to a stop (i.e. the last few feet). Sometimes re-bedding can fix that.
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      08-30-2018, 06:01 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dparm View Post
Typically the squeal is right as you come to a stop (i.e. the last few feet). Sometimes re-bedding can fix that.
I think I can live with that. Thank you!
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      08-30-2018, 06:18 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sojirovs View Post
Could you elaborate more on squeal? What do you mean by minimal squeal? Would I expect to hear occasionally? 1 out of 3 red lights? Only when it is cold?
Thanks!
I ran 2 sets of HC+ on M3 stock calipers and it's kind of on and off for street use. When completely cold, it will not make any noise when coming to a stop. After it gets some heat in it, it will squeal at almost every stop light/sign you come to. The squeal may not be very loud but you will hear it. After a track day, the squeal sometimes gets better (pads get re-bedded on track). I've run HC+ on my previous Evo X Brembo brakes and it was always silent. I think the M3's floating caliper design make it more prone to brake pad squeal.

HC-CS is a newer endurance version of the HC+, it has less bite but last longer on track and less squeal on the street. EAS should be able to get it for you.


The main thing is to ask them what they have in stock at the distributor. As I said, it took 6 months to get HC+ pads from Japan through EAS.
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      08-30-2018, 06:26 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
The main thing is to ask them what they have in stock at the distributor. As I said, it took 6 months to get HC+ pads from Japan through EAS.

This is another reason I recommend the DS2500 -- readily available. No shenanigans with overseas containers being filled by EAS.
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      08-30-2018, 06:34 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dparm View Post
This is another reason I recommend the DS2500 -- readily available. No shenanigans with overseas containers being filled by EAS.
I would say DS2500 is good for light track duty or daily street driving.

I've had bad experiences with DS2500 especially on heavy/powerful cars similar to the M3.
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      08-30-2018, 07:36 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sojirovs View Post
Could you elaborate more on squeal? What do you mean by minimal squeal? Would I expect to hear occasionally? 1 out of 3 red lights? Only when it is cold?
Thanks!
HC+ will squeal occasionally under light braking only. And it's not a bad squeal, very light. Under medium to hard braking there is no noise. I have Brembo GT, so stock calipers may differ a bit.
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      08-30-2018, 07:40 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
I ran 2 sets of HC+ on M3 stock calipers and it's kind of on and off for street use. When completely cold, it will not make any noise when coming to a stop. After it gets some heat in it, it will squeal at almost every stop light/sign you come to. The squeal may not be very loud but you will hear it. After a track day, the squeal sometimes gets better (pads get re-bedded on track). I've run HC+ on my previous Evo X Brembo brakes and it was always silent. I think the M3's floating caliper design make it more prone to brake pad squeal.

HC-CS is a newer endurance version of the HC+, it has less bite but last longer on track and less squeal on the street. EAS should be able to get it for you.


The main thing is to ask them what they have in stock at the distributor. As I said, it took 6 months to get HC+ pads from Japan through EAS.
Thanks for the heads up on HC-CS. One of the things I love about HC+ is the firm pedal feel. Pair it with Endless RF650 fluid and you get one of the most confidence inspiring brake pedals ever!
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