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      03-24-2008, 12:32 AM   #463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtPE View Post
first get a book on manners and common decency...why so hostile and angry?
has 'the man' got you down?

good luck on making the case in court....
you'll spend more than you save, and recovering legal fees in a case like this?
I've discussed this with my cousin, who is a lawyer, and he pulled up this thread and read it...

he said the only chance the OP has is a 'good will' offering from the dealer, the dealer has the law on his side, and has no obligation to sell the car...
the court will not 'force' him to sell the car, or pay damages, when none can be proven...

You are either misinterpreting what your lawyer cousin said, or he is a bad lawyer. I am a lawyer, and I can tell you, based on the facts - this is a fairly simple and very clear breach of contract. Damages are easily proven - they are the difference in the price contract and the market value of the car. It'd take a court about 5 minutes to come up with a number, somewhere around 8K.
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      03-24-2008, 12:33 AM   #464
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New to the forum so I'm causing the whole site to lag but I'm adding to the record number of vistors.

Couple of points that stick out. 1) BMW NA and/or the parent have a vested interest in how this all plays out. The dealership is dragging their good name through the mud. Sure their hands are tied due to State franchise laws, etc but they can still hit the dealer where it counts... limit what products they get. No more M-cars unless there CSI meets minimum requirements; 2) we start an online petition to boycott all BMWs; 3) the online community creates a fund to help with any legal fees (and when the buyer wins back court costs and lawyers fees) all collected amounts go to charity.

An enmasse internet boycott of their products will surely catch someones attention. Trust me, I have been boycotting Sony crap for years and it's hasn't hurt me one bit because there are plenty of other OEMs that appreciate my hard earned money. So the question to the buyer... with all the crap that's going on, do you really want to support BMW and their laisse faire attitude to someone willing to drop in excess of $60K (taxes and fees)? Surely their must be other cars that you like for that kind of money? A Lotus Exiege, Audi TT, Lexus LRF (when it comes out), Porsche (your choice of model), Land Rover, Mercedes (your choice of model), etc.

Btw, when you get the car you will always have this nagging feeling that they did something to sabotage the car in some hidden way. My personal opinion is look to another manufacturer who truly values your business. My 2 cents.

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      03-24-2008, 12:35 AM   #465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ9 View Post
we just gave this kid about 10K hits now.

http://dailyyeah.com/about/
haha

Thank you kind sir, I needed a good laugh.

(forget the haircut, he needs to learn to annunciate more clearly when he speaks)

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      03-24-2008, 12:40 AM   #466
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samifumi View Post
I am not a licensed attorney in the state of Nebraska, but I am in Texas. The Uniform Commercial Code has been adopted by every state in the United States (but for Louisiana), and this is simply a breach of contract, as most of you guys have noticed. An eBay contract is a legally enforceable contract, and the dealership should have delegated the authority and responsibility to list the M3 to an employee with knowledge and experience setting the terms. Salespeople, even those who do it online, have the vested authority to make sales, and thus the company that owns the dealership will be held responsible for the acts of their agents.

I wish I was in Nebraska. I would do it just for fun. I might even throw in a Deceptive Trade Practice claim, on which there would be treble damages and attorney's fees awarded. Throw in the words "Deceptive Trade" in your next conversation. Nebraska has a Uniform Deceptive Trade Practices Act.

87-302. (a) A person engages in a deceptive trade practice when, in the course of his or her business, vocation, or occupation, he or she:
(9) Advertises goods or services with intent not to sell them as advertised;

With regard to the BBB, they are really just an Alternative Dispute Resolution mechanism. They'll mediate your dispute, but it's not necessarily binding on the dealership. The dealership will only jeopardize their membership with the BBB if it turns in your favor and they do not honor the resolution (I do not know how much that means to them). I would recommend, if you have a mediation, that you go in fully prepared.
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Originally Posted by The Peregrinus View Post
As another licensed TX attorney I mostly concur. . .with this caveat - don't even bother with BBB or AG or anything else that people have been mentioning. Just go down to the county courthouse and file a law suit - might cost you $100 or $200 - court fees that are recoverable as well. The law is well settled on this - you will win the difference between the contract price and the market value of the car - about 8K. If you were in Texas - I'd go ahead and throw in DTPA as leverage - but that's probably a loser (but they wouldn't want to risk losing because possibly subject to up to treble damages). Yeah, you can go to mediation and split the baby - but I'd say in this case - screw 'em, OPs case is rock solid.
Thank you both for offering your expert advice!!! OK, DailyYeah, does this perspective on the law from two actual attorney's give you any satisfaction?

btw - Ebay's rules clearly state that any auction not specifically designated as a reserve auction is, in fact, a no reserve auction.
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      03-24-2008, 12:42 AM   #467
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtPE View Post
it's NOT a legally binding agreement or contract between buyer-seller, each has a contract with ebay, and they say they can't enforce it...
the complexities are confounding: across state lines, without signatures, without actually knowing who each party is...
they can not mandate one, nor enforce one...they are not a court...

from ebay
3. eBay is not an Auctioneer.

3.1 Online Auctions. Although we are commonly referred to as an online auction web site, it is important to realise that we are not a traditional "auctioneer". Instead, our Site acts as a venue to allow members to offer, sell, and buy just about anything, at anytime, from anywhere, in a variety of formats, including a fixed price format and an auction-style format commonly referred to as an "online auction". We are not involved in the actual transaction between buyers and sellers. As a result, we have no control over the quality, safety or legality of the items or content posted by users on the Site, the truth or accuracy of the listings, the ability of sellers to sell items or the ability of buyers to buy items. We cannot ensure and do not guarantee that a buyer or seller will actually complete a transaction or act lawfully in using our Site.

in other words, you're on your own...
You spew and unbelievable amount of mis or disinformation. Tell you what - I won't pretend to know anything about engineering if you won't pretend to know anything about contract law (something that is quite apparent).
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      03-24-2008, 12:45 AM   #468
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New user just chiming in to say that people like Fil/Husker BMW is not indicative of the kinds of people living in NE. Scum like this hurt the reputation of any city they reside in. SEcondly, has anyone thought to go bid crazy on the other Husker BMW auctions using fake ebay accounts? Say bid $95k for a similar car, and when the auction ends, call them up and say it was a mistake? I believe that would be a small form of sweet justice. Additionally why the hell is some 16 year old asian kid trying to tell people what is and what isnt contractual law? Doesnt he have a honda civic to rice or some drifting to do? Well just wanted to say GL and I hope ELF decides to firebomb this dealership within the next week or so if they dont give you your car(it is yours).

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      03-24-2008, 12:51 AM   #469
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hey guys just an FYI on the reserve on ebay.

When an item has a reserve price and you dont meet it, it will say:
"You are currently the highest bidder but the reserve has not been meet" and will give you the option to bid again to met the reserve.

when the reserve has not been met you will get a message that says,
ITEM NOT WON,RESERVE NOT MET. you will recieve an email and will list it on the auction site saying ACTION ENDED RESERVE NOT MET plus the list of past bid will be available.

I checked the site and it says Doomas won.

sorry but the reserve price discussion has been repeated for the last 22 post with he same thing about the reserve. Unfortunately for them(dealer) there was no reserve,otherwise the ebay auction sytem would have already told Doomas he didnt won the car with the reserve not met message.
Before i go to sleep i have to say this: please dont harass and threaten the people of lincoln BMW.Im not saying that they deserve it. Lets be people above of these shady practices
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      03-24-2008, 12:52 AM   #470
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
Thank you both for offering your expert advice!!! OK, DailyYeah, does this perspective on the law from two actual attorney's give you any satisfaction?

btw - Ebay's rules clearly state that any auction not specifically designated as a reserve auction is, in fact, a no reserve auction.
I don't think you're gonna be hearing from him again, looks like he realized the BobLoblawLawBlog didn't have an answer for everything He probably realized that his only argument that had any legs was only valid during the auction period.
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      03-24-2008, 12:57 AM   #471
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laszlo View Post
I think when it comes to the eBay world, Art and many others are just pointing out that eBay’s “it’s-your-problem-in-the-end policies” are correct that there isn't much they can do but cancel the dealership's account.

I remember getting totally ripped off buying an Omega watch on eBay from a Powerseller watch dealer and after weeks and weeks of dealing with eBay’s cyber dispute and the seller I just threw in the towel and called it a month.

I guess what I'm saying is that eBay can't do much and hasn't done much for a lot of people who got shammed on through this auction service.
Yes, but that being said, there is still a legally binding contract between the buyer and seller, it's just that eBay is not a court of law that can enforce said contract. Like you said, the most they can really do is cancel the sellers account.

The OP should send a check or paypal them the money still. If they cash it or accept payment, he has further solidified his position.

*incidentally, I'm not a lawyer either.
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      03-24-2008, 12:57 AM   #472
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laszlo View Post
I would take this back if I was you.

I said this and got my ass handed to me and almost left this site for good.

I think eBay blows anyway. Too many horror stories to add up and eBay should get off their cyber asses and help the OP out and also the dealership and just seal the deal.
now was that an admission of being wrong,or were you simply trying to save him the typing of a futile argument,btw welcome back lazlo
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      03-24-2008, 12:59 AM   #473
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Checking in from www.cosrtoc.net and www.sotsyndicate.com to show support. Can't wait till tomorrow for updates.
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      03-24-2008, 01:00 AM   #474
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I forgot to add that reading this whole thread and reading about the $30K DMA confirms my decision to look at other OEMs. The Cadillac CTS-V is starting to look very good right about now.

Note: the above is purely my opinion and is not meant to cause a debate over which car is superior.
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      03-24-2008, 01:07 AM   #475
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LilRedGXP View Post
I forgot to add that reading this whole thread and reading about the $30K DMA confirms my decision to look at other OEMs. The Cadillac CTS-V is starting to look very good right about now.

Note: the above is purely my opinion and is not meant to cause a debate over which car is superior.
Ignore dealer markups on the new M3. Just find another dealership. The cars are available all across the country at MSRP. Lots and lots of new owners here and no one has paid over MSRP to my knowledge.
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      03-24-2008, 01:08 AM   #476
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ9 View Post
we just gave this kid about 10K hits now.

http://dailyyeah.com/about/
More confirmation of my theory that people should not be allowed to speak in public until at least the age of 30.
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      03-24-2008, 01:10 AM   #477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Educated View Post
New user just chiming in to say that people like Fil/Husker BMW is not indicative of the kinds of people living in NE. Scum like this hurt the reputation of any city they reside in. SEcondly, has anyone thought to go bid crazy on the other Husker BMW auctions using fake ebay accounts? Say bid $95k for a similar car, and when the auction ends, call them up and say it was a mistake? I believe that would be a small form of sweet justice. Additionally why the hell is some 16 year old asian kid trying to tell people what is and what isnt contractual law? Doesnt he have a honda civic to rice or some drifting to do? Well just wanted to say GL and I hope ELF decides to firebomb this dealership within the next week or so if they dont give you your car(it is yours).


Couldnt agree more. I am also a Nebraska local who is very angered by this, definately is not a sign of how most people around here operate.

Im pulling for you, i hope you win this battle.
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      03-24-2008, 01:11 AM   #478
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To the OP:
This reminds me of a similar situation that took place on the VWVortex forums a bit ago. I can't remember the dealership (I think it was in Atlanta), but they had screwed him on some repairs or lemonlaw IIRC. He did the same thing, posting his experiences on the VW forums and brewing up a storm. In his case VW-NA was able to help if my memory serves me right.

The one thing I want to add is that you should be careful with what you say, make sure you keep this fiasco under control. In the VW case, the dealer sued the customer for slander/libel (can't remember which is right, biz-law was a long time ago!) as a result of all the negative publicity they received. In the end the customer won, and did not pay court/lawyer fees, but it was a long and painful process that could have been avoided. Fil's email regarding threats from others reminded me of the VWVortex case and had me a bit scared. Just be careful.

Finally, I think some of the posters bringing up legal loopholes (credible or not) to get the dealer out of trouble are missing the big picture. At the end of the day the dealer will be out ~8k if they sell the car to OP. If they DON'T sell the car, how many local enthusiasts do you think will skip Husker when they buy their M3/5/6? I see Husker having three options:
1- Fight the OP, gain bad publicity, and lose sales. I think it's safe to say they will lose at least 1 sale if they choose this path, there goes their 8K, and they lose even more with every other sale they lose as this story snowballs.
2- Admit they were wrong, sell the car at 60K. They lose 8K, but this thing goes away and they salvage most of their reputation. Next M3 they sell they've broken even, no big deal.
3- Probably the wise business decision- admit they're in the wrong and sweeten the deal. Sell the car at 60K, but give the OP a choice of color, include some free extras, hell Fil could spare some free hair gel. Something to show they realize they were wrong, in this case I think they could even benefit from the publicity. If I owned Husker, I'd be on the phone with Dooma first thing monday, promising a Silver (as he wanted) M3 in Cali with a free fleece for $60K if he could just post the positive outcome on this board and autoblog. I would lose something on this sale, but I might convince a few people to come my way down the line and use this fiasco to garner some good publicity.
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      03-24-2008, 01:12 AM   #479
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One more little tid bit in the OP's favor - I just checked to see when he made his bid; more than two and a half hours before the end of the auction. So Husker had more than two and a half hours to cancel his bid if they had wanted to.
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      03-24-2008, 01:12 AM   #480
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Educated View Post
New user just chiming in to say that people like Fil/Husker BMW is not indicative of the kinds of people living in NE. Scum like this hurt the reputation of any city they reside in. SEcondly, has anyone thought to go bid crazy on the other Husker BMW auctions using fake ebay accounts? Say bid $95k for a similar car, and when the auction ends, call them up and say it was a mistake? I believe that would be a small form of sweet justice. Additionally why the hell is some 16 year old asian kid trying to tell people what is and what isnt contractual law? Doesnt he have a honda civic to rice or some drifting to do? Well just wanted to say GL and I hope ELF decides to firebomb this dealership within the next week or so if they dont give you your car(it is yours).

Will Ferrell ELF???
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      03-24-2008, 01:13 AM   #481
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Originally Posted by tRas View Post
Couldnt agree more. I am also a Nebraska local who is very angered by this, definately is not a sign of how most people around here operate.

Im pulling for you, i hope you win this battle.

I don't think anyone is assuming that's how people from nebraska operate.
I think it's more indicative of the way car salesmen operate, regardless of where they are located.
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      03-24-2008, 01:15 AM   #482
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Originally Posted by tturedraider View Post
More confirmation of my theory that people should not be allowed to speak in public until at least the age of 30.
LOL, he had the right intent, and was quoting all my B-Law books, but his logic was rather illogical..had to check on his street credit

I was just waiting for the My Cousin Vinny quote to appear...."The Two Yutes"
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      03-24-2008, 01:22 AM   #483
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laszlo View Post
He's just a kid trying to build his resume for a good career...

Amazing that these kids today can "brand" themselve online before they even make it to the real market.
You missed my "The Two Yutes" quote from My Cousin Vinny...heheh

I know I know, he'd be a good intern.
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      03-24-2008, 01:28 AM   #484
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ9 View Post
You missed my "The Two Yutes" quote from My Cousin Vinny...heheh

I know I know, he'd be a good intern.
TWO WHAT? lol im only 22,but i dont advertise my ignorance of the world around me by getting into a flaming match with older and wiser people, i just sit back and learn,he should have shut up a long time ago and definetly(i think thats right) should not have given us a way to access any imformation of his personal life,as that video alone could keep a good flamer goin for a week.
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