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      10-04-2016, 09:44 AM   #1
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Best brake ducting options?

I've searched and read most of the threads, but I'm still undecided. I'm leaning toward the Cantrell complete kit as I don't want to build this from scratch.

I have a StoptechTrophy ST-60/40 BBK, but I'm going through pads in 2 weekends/4 days. I've tried various pad materials including Pagid RS-29s, Stoptech SR34s, Carbotech XP-12s and now Cobalt Friction XR1s.

For those with the Cantrell kit, how's it working and holding up? Any other options that are relatively affordable?
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      10-04-2016, 09:54 AM   #2
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Have you used the special paint or stickers to see just how hot things are getting? Are you seeing the inside pad wear much faster?
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      10-04-2016, 10:12 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dparm View Post
Have you used the special paint or stickers to see just how hot things are getting? Are you seeing the inside pad wear much faster?
Where do you get the paint or stickers? I'll do this when I go back to TWS in a few weeks.

I had some uneven wear with the Stoptech SR34 pads, but the Carbotech XP-12s and the Cobalt Friction XR1s wore evenly. The Carbotechs wore so quickly that I went all the way through them and damaged the rotors at COTA. I replaced the rotors before my last event at TWS.

It took the first day to get used to the high torque of the Cobalt Friction, and they got ridiculously hot in the first few sessions as I got into the ABS several times. I really liked the bite once I adjusted my braking - they require a much lighter touch.
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      10-04-2016, 10:12 AM   #4
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I have the same BBK but have never used it without the Cantrell kit for cooling too. No issues of excess pad wear. Agree with getting some temperature strips to get some data and would also suggest giving Performance Friction pads a try. I use the 11s and have been very pleased with their durability. Zeckhausen can hook you up among other places and their customer support is very strong.
As for the Cantrell kit, the key ingredient is the backing plates. Once installed no issues. The hoses can wear out over time and I replaced mine after two seasons. The hose can be had for much less $ than buying the kit and is a simple swap when the time comes. They get worn if you turn your wheels to full lock (street car) and just normal wear and tear under a tracked car from debris, etc. They are also held in place by zip ties at various locations and they can pull through even the toughest silicone hoses.
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      10-04-2016, 10:59 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4M
I have the same BBK but have never used it without the Cantrell kit for cooling too. No issues of excess pad wear. Agree with getting some temperature strips to get some data and would also suggest giving Performance Friction pads a try. I use the 11s and have been very pleased with their durability. Zeckhausen can hook you up among other places and their customer support is very strong.
As for the Cantrell kit, the key ingredient is the backing plates. Once installed no issues. The hoses can wear out over time and I replaced mine after two seasons. The hose can be had for much less $ than buying the kit and is a simple swap when the time comes. They get worn if you turn your wheels to full lock (street car) and just normal wear and tear under a tracked car from debris, etc. They are also held in place by zip ties at various locations and they can pull through even the toughest silicone hoses.
How long do your PFC11s last?

Great feedback, thanks!
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      10-04-2016, 11:19 AM   #6
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I've also been thinking about a brake duct kit recently, will summarize my research so far.

First, I really like the air inlet configuration from this homemade kit that utilizes the factory undertray, LINK. If I went this route I would eventually plan to get one of the front splitters that has air duct inlets built in.

Then I would agree with 4M that the Cantrell kit backing plates would be nice. Check out ortho281's install here, LINK, see post #123.

Regarding rubbing, both jakob66 and ortho281 had rubbing of some sort and installed the Turner Motorsports steering limiters which remedied the issue, LINK, see post #230 and LINK, see post #128.

Last edited by ///Mobbin; 10-04-2016 at 11:25 AM..
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      10-04-2016, 11:30 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dparm View Post
Have you used the special paint or stickers to see just how hot things are getting? Are you seeing the inside pad wear much faster?
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
Where do you get the paint or stickers? I'll do this when I go back to TWS in a few weeks.
Interesting post from Vorshlag regarding the thermal paint that came on their PowerBrake BBK, LINK.

Then I'm pretty sure most folks use Tempilaq, it's pricey though:
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      10-04-2016, 11:37 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
Where do you get the paint or stickers? I'll do this when I go back to TWS in a few weeks.

I had some uneven wear with the Stoptech SR34 pads, but the Carbotech XP-12s and the Cobalt Friction XR1s wore evenly. The Carbotechs wore so quickly that I went all the way through them and damaged the rotors at COTA. I replaced the rotors before my last event at TWS.

It took the first day to get used to the high torque of the Cobalt Friction, and they got ridiculously hot in the first few sessions as I got into the ABS several times. I really liked the bite once I adjusted my braking - they require a much lighter touch.


Uneven wear is to be expected because the outer pads get more airflow. On my ST40 kit, the inside wore about 25% faster especially towards the end of the pad life. Some pads might not exhibit this as bad if their MOT is higher.

The paint is available from a variety of race shops. There is also a sticker you can put on the caliper that does something similar. I'm just curious what kind of temps you're seeing.
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      10-04-2016, 01:10 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd
Quote:
Originally Posted by 4M
I have the same BBK but have never used it without the Cantrell kit for cooling too. No issues of excess pad wear. Agree with getting some temperature strips to get some data and would also suggest giving Performance Friction pads a try. I use the 11s and have been very pleased with their durability. Zeckhausen can hook you up among other places and their customer support is very strong.
As for the Cantrell kit, the key ingredient is the backing plates. Once installed no issues. The hoses can wear out over time and I replaced mine after two seasons. The hose can be had for much less $ than buying the kit and is a simple swap when the time comes. They get worn if you turn your wheels to full lock (street car) and just normal wear and tear under a tracked car from debris, etc. They are also held in place by zip ties at various locations and they can pull through even the toughest silicone hoses.
How long do your PFC11s last?

Great feedback, thanks!
So many variables go into this question it can become really subjective. I think driving style and the "technical" nature of the track are the two biggest factors - all other things being equal. If you're braking from 120 mph down to 40 repeatedly, that's going to take a different toll than 80 to 40.
That said, I've done seven full days this year, so figure roughly 18 hours of track time on three different tracks with these pads. I changed the fronts after the 6th event and I still have plenty of meat on the rears.
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      10-04-2016, 01:12 PM   #10
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You can get the caliper stickers from a number of race shops and even on Amazon I think.
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      10-04-2016, 01:43 PM   #11
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Hope this helps-

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showpos...0&postcount=43
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      10-04-2016, 02:07 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4M View Post
You can get the caliper stickers from a number of race shops and even on Amazon I think.
Searched several different ways on Amazon -- all I got back was ridiculous stickers with logos and fake caliper covers for Dodge Challengers.


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      10-04-2016, 05:22 PM   #13
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This should get you there on Amazon:

ALC-THS0080X285 Alcon Caliper Temp Indicator Strip Kit
$48.99
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      10-04-2016, 08:42 PM   #14
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essex sells paint and temp strips.
https://www.essexparts.com/temperatu...ction-products
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      10-04-2016, 10:02 PM   #15
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I will definitely try the temp strips, but I'm going to install additional cooling ducts with backing plates no matter what.
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      10-05-2016, 08:20 AM   #16
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HRP has temp strips too

http://www.hrpworld.com/store/defaul...strip-kit.html
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      10-05-2016, 08:43 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd
I will definitely try the temp strips, but I'm going to install additional cooling ducts with backing plates no matter what.
Turn off traction control, and your pads will wear less and stay cooler. LOL
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      10-05-2016, 09:12 AM   #18
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The temperature range of these strips seems more geared towards checking if you are boiling your brake fluid. If pad wear is the concern I would go the paint route and check rotor temps.
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      10-05-2016, 09:19 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by surlynkid View Post
Turn off traction control, and your pads will wear less and stay cooler. LOL
What does that M button do anyway?!

Funny, Scotty!

BTW, how and where did you source your GT4 brake cooling?
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      10-05-2016, 09:52 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd View Post
How long do your PFC11s last?

Great feedback, thanks!
My PFC12 front pads on the PFC BBK last between 56 and 68 hours on my E92 which works out to around 31-34 days

Bimmerworld tells me that is too fast and once I add suspension the rear will wear more and the front will wear less

Regardless, I'm pretty happy
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      10-05-2016, 09:53 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbyrd
Quote:
Originally Posted by surlynkid View Post
Turn off traction control, and your pads will wear less and stay cooler. LOL
What does that M button do anyway?!

Funny, Scotty!

BTW, how and where did you source your GT4 brake cooling?
M button directs NAV to your closest McDonalds on the way to the track.

BMW of Atlanta for the GT4 parts. The require some fab work to clear 380mm stop tech.

Found some of my mojo last weekend and got back into the 1:55's. Then broke a wheel stud and was done.
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      10-05-2016, 11:24 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Mobbin View Post
The temperature range of these strips seems more geared towards checking if you are boiling your brake fluid. If pad wear is the concern I would go the paint route and check rotor temps.
That's exactly right. I use the stickers on the calipers to check brake fluid temps. The paint is for actual rotor-pad temps, which is what you need to check to make sure your pads are in the heat range they are designed for, or if you need to add more cooling (ducts).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Mobbin View Post
Interesting post from Vorshlag regarding the thermal paint that came on their PowerBrake BBK, LINK.

Then I'm pretty sure most folks use Tempilaq, it's pricey though:
Yep, that is pretty much the industry standard. And not just for motorsports. It really is an industrial product. And it's what I use for rotor temps. You can buy individual bottles, or a kit with a range depending on what you want data on.
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