HPDE experiments, results and observations

[rhyary]

^ Thanks
I am learning a ton as well

[rhyary]

My 2021 Resolution

I was thinking , what can be a useful new year resolution?

Losing weight?
Experience more tracks?
Buying same tires for front and rear?

And I came to the conclusion that it would be thinking in 1/10th of a second.

Up until now I was focused on the end goal, I wanted to go below 60 sec at LRP, below 1:35 at NYST, below 1:50 at PMP. This year I am adding WGI, who knows what I can do on a big track.

For 2021, rather than thinking laps and seconds, I will be thinking segments and 1/10th of a second.

AiM's RS3 beta makes it easy and as they are moving closer to production the segment analysis will get better. it is already useful.

[dparm]

Originally Posted by rhyary

My 2021 Resolution

I was thinking , what can be a useful new year resolution?

Loosing weight?
Experience more tracks?
Buying same tires for front and rear?

And I came to the conclusion that it would be thinking in 1/10th of a second.

Up until now I was focused on the end goal, I wanted to go below 60 sec at LRP, below 1:35 at NYST, below 1:50 at PMP. This year I am adding WGI, who knows what I can do on a big track.

For 2021, rather than thinking laps and seconds, I will be thinking segments and 1/10th of a second.

AiM's RS3 beta makes it easy and as they are moving closer to production the segment analysis will get better. it is already useful.

Focus on consistency. I think I wrote it in another thread, but see if you can run an entire session with less than 0.25s deviation from lap to lap. You might not be able to drive at 10/10ths or even 9/10ths, but it will get you to focus on hitting your marks and being smooth.

Once you can do it within 0.25s, up the pace a bit.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by dparm

Focus on consistency. I think I wrote it in another thread, but see if you can run an entire session with less than 0.25s deviation from lap to lap. You might not be able to drive at 10/10ths or even 9/10ths, but it will get you to focus on hitting your marks and being smooth.

Once you can do it within 0.25s, up the pace a bit.

Focusing on a lap consistency is similar to focusing on lap and seconds.

The issue is less of what and more of how

Unfortunately, focusing on lap consistency does not make that happen. Not at speed.

I went back to my data and going to a track I know well. So I can find many consistent laps at 1:40. That is not a very fast pace. I can also find some consistency on 1:38 when I am on new tires.

This does not mean I can be consistent at 1:37. And just because I know how to be consistence going 1:39 does not mean I can be consistent at 1:37.

To make progress, I have to bring it down from a lap to a sector, and analyze carefully why on sector 3 I did 8.18 sec one lap and the next lap I did 7.9 sec.

[sbo76]

rhyary - One thought i had when going through this thread was the consistency of the car. You have progressively become a better driver and are getting very comfortable with your platform. If you just pick one tire or a small subset of tires will it make you more comfortable as a driver? One thing that saves me a lot is that i know exactly what my car will do in most situations. I know that when i pass on a bad line or go too deep into an apex the car will right itself if i let it. The fact that i trust the car has really helped fix errors i make when trying to shed time. I don't fear braking late to pass or putting my car off the ideal apex any longer. One other thing that helps me is having a better driver drive my car so i can see what it is capable of given the right inputs. Just a thought.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by sbo76

rhyary - One thought i had when going through this thread was the consistency of the car. You have progressively become a better driver and are getting very comfortable with your platform. If you just pick one tire or a small subset of tires will it make you more comfortable as a driver? One thing that saves me a lot is that i know exactly what my car will do in most situations. I know that when i pass on a bad line or go too deep into an apex the car will right itself if i let it. The fact that i trust the car has really helped fix errors i make when trying to shed time. I don't fear braking late to pass or putting my car off the ideal apex any longer. One other thing that helps me is having a better driver drive my car so i can see what it is capable of given the right inputs. Just a thought.

Funny you would say that.
i feel exactly that about my car.
because I tried so many tires, so many lines, so many suspension settings, I indeed feel I can trust the car on any line, any surface and I have have been passing people any time I am given a chance.

I continue to discover how little I know, but some how the lap times continue to drop and what used to be scary fast, now is routine.
LRP - 1:05 last year felt like will never be broken, this year 1:01 felt like no big deal, and lap after lap. Going below 60 sec is just matter of time.

PMP - I wanted badly to break 2:00 and was thrilled when I got 1:59. My last day there I did 1:50 and no drama.

NYST is my home track and when I did 1:37.2 I felt like Lewis Hamilton. Then I did 1:35.x and 1:37 on the right tires became routine


Here is one of my oops, and no big deal. Let go of the brakes and the car turn.

2020 11 20 SCDA Late Apex

[sbo76]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Funny you would say that.
i feel exactly that about my car.
because I tried so many tires, so many lines, so many suspension settings, I indeed feel I can trust the car on any line, any surface and I have have been passing people any time I am given a chance.

I continue to discover how little I know, but some how the lap times continue to drop and what used to be scary fast, now is routine.
LRP - 1:05 last year felt like will never be broken, this year 1:01 felt like no big deal, and lap after lap. Going below 60 sec is just matter of time.

PMP - I wanted badly to break 2:00 and was thrilled when I got 1:59. My last day there I did 1:50 and no drama.

NYST is my home track and when I did 1:37.2 I felt like Lewis Hamilton. Then I did 1:35.x and 1:37 on the right tires became routine


Here is one of my oops, and no big deal. Let go of the brakes and the car turn.

2020 11 20 SCDA Late Apex

Right on man! This is why I love this hobby! I am not a great driver but I can honestly fell when my car is shifting weight, I can tell when my body rolls into position, etc. It really is addictive! Keep up the data dumps i really find them to be very helpful!

[rhyary]

2021 looks whiny but solid...

[DRLane]

Originally Posted by rhyary

2021 looks whiny but solid...

You're going to love it. Further complete your track build and the sound is great!

[rhyary]

By now you all know I like data.
Since I have a whole year worth of data, I wanted to make use of it.

No matter how hard I tried, I could not get all the formulas and profiles to show me what the car was doing.

After watching the last AiM seminar, I knew it was time to contact a professional.

Ray Phillips strikes me as a professional for my liking. I will be working with him to create math channels to show understeer, oversteer, corner radius, potentiometers readings (mm/sec and movement in mm) and all kind of graphs to show what the car is doing.

This data will be helpful to ACM if I need to change settings.

I am also be working with Racers360 to analyze my driving and work on specific technics. We came to an arrangement that we will be working together the whole 2021 season rather then buying one session at a time.

To paraphrase the song 1921 from Tommy's rock opera:

Got a feeling '21
Is going to be a good year
Especially if data and me
See it in together

So you think '21
Is going to be a good year?
It could be good for me and the bimmer
I had no reason to be over-optimistic
But somehow, when you graph data
I could brave bad weather

[Kelse92]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I am also be working with Racers360 to analyze my driving and work on specific technics. We came to an arrangement that we will be working together the whole 2021 season rather then buying one session at a time.

That's cool they gave you a value for the full season, are they limiting it to a certain number of sessions or a discount? Seems like a really interesting program.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Kelse92

That's cool they gave you a value for the full season, are they limiting it to a certain number of sessions or a discount? Seems like a really interesting program.

They have.
I am happy with the value.

[derbo]

Originally Posted by dparm

Focus on consistency. I think I wrote it in another thread, but see if you can run an entire session with less than 0.25s deviation from lap to lap. You might not be able to drive at 10/10ths or even 9/10ths, but it will get you to focus on hitting your marks and being smooth.

Once you can do it within 0.25s, up the pace a bit.

Probably I mentioned that somewhere on this forum. That was my goal to keep consistent. Don't have to be the fastest the car can do, but at least consistent.

[rhyary]

Frequent dilemma, where is the limit.

Here is a good example how Josef Newgarden is constantly finding the limit and correcting the oversteer.

I am guessing that it was not a quick lap, but when he is done with that lap, he knows what is possible.

It is also cloudy so perhaps a bit wet.

I am pretty sure he does not need the tires to be the same front and back, and he does not care if these mismatch tires are from eBay or Tire Rack, he will find the existing limit and be as quick as he can be.

[derbo]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Frequent dilemma, were is the limit.

Here is a good example how Josef Newgarden is constantly finding the limit and correcting the oversteer.

I am guessing that it was not a quick lap, but when he is done with that lap, he knows what is possible.

It is also cloudy so perhaps a bit wet.

I am pretty sure he does not need the tires to be the same front and back, and he does not care if these mismatch tires are from eBay or Tire Rack, he will find the existing limit and be as quick as he can be.

As you know tires can only provide 100% and is divided between decel, accel, lateral grip in various combinations in what is usually referred as the friction circle.

What fast drivers can do, is go beyond the 100% and come back like second nature. They are able to constantly stay around the 100% and if they go over, they recover very quickly. I think this is what you are referring to for Newgarden?


For myself, I aim to learn this at the street tire level (200TW and up) as the limits are significantly lower than slicks and the response times needed are drastically lower than INDY/F1 cars. wet track days are PERFECT for honing this skill.

[Bartledoo]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I am pretty sure he does not need the tires to be the same front and back, and he does not care if these mismatch tires are from eBay or Tire Rack, he will find the existing limit and be as quick as he can bE.

He is also a very high level professional driver with commensurate feel and understanding of the physics, and can drive any car at the absolute limit constantly without worrying about paying for the wrecked car haha.

[rhyary]

I had a very good data session with Ray Phillips.
I bought from him the 20 Profile package.

Ray created many math channels and delivered the profiles to use those math channels to provide clear and concise way to see oversteer, understeer, coasting, brake pressure map and many other super useful views.

This is just an excellent way to review what you and the car actually did on a trackday.

While Racers360 will be working on what I have to do, Ray's profiles will tell me how well I implemented.

In addition, Ray also created math channels and profiles to so I can see what my suspension is doing using my potentiometers. Very happy about that.

After Ray created the profiles, I imported them, and the math channels into my AiM. We then had a zoom session and Ray explained each profile and what it means.

For the price of one front tire, if you have an AiM device connected to the CAN bus, I highly recommend working with Ray.

I can't believe I waited this long.....

[Ximian]

Originally Posted by rhyary

For the price of one front tire

Is the front tire a Ecsta PS91 that's been patched and purchased from eBay or a Cup2 from the dealership?

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by Ximian

Is the front tire a Ecsta PS91 that's been patched and purchased from eBay or a Cup2 from the dealership?

PS91 285/30/19 brand new from TR, mounted and balanced and ready to go :-)

[admranger]

Originally Posted by rhyary

PS91 285/30/19 brand new from TR, mounted and balanced and ready to go :-)

so no heat cycling then. hmmmm...

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by admranger

so no heat cycling then. hmmmm...

not max performance. not available. :-(

[rhyary]

Example of the Brake Profile.

Clearly on one lap I brake harder and lift off sooner, and the other I brake not as hard but trail brake longer:

The point is that Ray's profile makes it visual and on the LRP track map, vs, as he calls it, squiggly lines
.