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03-18-2024, 12:31 PM | #23 |
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Ohhhhh, okay okay. Ya, i definitely don’t have 359 wheels. I wish I did. Okay, so when changing the EDC on a “non-zcp” car it’s not as aggressive or noticeable as a “zcp” car, correct?
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03-18-2024, 12:34 PM | #24 | |
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"Competition Package (ZCP) The "Competition Package" (sometimes known as ZCP) version was released in 2010. The changes related to the suspension and electronic stability control and consisted of: Ride height lowered by 10 mm (0.4 in) Revised tuning of the adjustable dampers (Electronic Damping Control) An "M" mode for the electronic stability control 19-inch wheels"
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03-18-2024, 04:01 PM | #25 | |
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2008 328i e93- 3SIM, StageFP tune, magna flow #12148 muffler + vibrant resonator, BMS filters, Bilstein B8s, H&R sport springs, ECS sway bars, whiteline rear subframe bushings, rouge engineering trans mounts, custco front strut bar, M3 front lower control arms. Cosmis R1 18x8.5 245/40 front 18x9.5 255/35 rear.
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03-18-2024, 04:02 PM | #26 | |
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2008 328i e93- 3SIM, StageFP tune, magna flow #12148 muffler + vibrant resonator, BMS filters, Bilstein B8s, H&R sport springs, ECS sway bars, whiteline rear subframe bushings, rouge engineering trans mounts, custco front strut bar, M3 front lower control arms. Cosmis R1 18x8.5 245/40 front 18x9.5 255/35 rear.
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03-18-2024, 04:22 PM | #27 | |
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03-18-2024, 04:36 PM | #28 | |
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I don’t want anything over the top, but I don’t want to cheap out so somewhere good in the middle! I enjoy going on canyons and just casual/somewhat aggressive street driving. |
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03-18-2024, 05:12 PM | #30 | |
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On non-ZCP cars, comfort EDC is dynamic, sport is dynamic and sport plus, the dampers are static. On the ZCP cars, sport plus is also dynamic.
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03-18-2024, 05:15 PM | #31 |
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03-18-2024, 05:16 PM | #32 |
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03-18-2024, 06:08 PM | #33 | |
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I had Alex@alpine code the zcp EDC settings and euro mdm and honestly, beyond the 10 mm lowered springs, it's pretty much a zcp now with the addition of my flow forged wheels that are the same weight as the 359M OP, whoever posted that evolve video is a good place to start. That's why I was asking your budget. Spending 2-3k on coilovers is definitely nice but if you're not updating/upgrading your original bushings first then it's still gonna be a bit sloppy |
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03-18-2024, 06:22 PM | #34 | |
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03-18-2024, 06:40 PM | #35 | |
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Otherwise, you need a defeat module for the EDC system errors that non-edc coil-overs will surface. I think most indie shops will steer you this way as well since OEM replacements are $$$ and you only get a benefit from a coil over kit once you go high end like Ohlins/KW Clubsports/MCS for $4-$6k. |
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03-18-2024, 07:01 PM | #36 | |
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I've now owned my M3 for 8 yrs and in that time I've spent a lot of time and effort to get my M3 to handle like my old Megane. The good news is that it can be done, but it's a lot of work/money. The E9x M3 has a great chassis ruined by compromises made for comfort. The 'loose' tail end you're feeling is likely caused by the rubber rear subframe bushes. These bushes wear and allow up to 1 inch lateral deflection over uneven roads. It's not that your rear tires are slipping, it's the car body moving independently of the rear tires dues to the soft rubber bushes. Changing the rear subframe bushes to solid aluminum is the first thing I recommend you do and it totally transformed the M3 for me. I only started to gain confidence with the M3 after I put in solid subframe bushes. Best thing is there is no NVH penalty. The M3 is also very sensitive to alignment, especially rear toe. I'd get a good alignment done as well. Aside from that I've changed just about everything possible with my suspension without compromising its ability as a daily driven car. But I'd stray with the rear subframe bushes. |
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03-18-2024, 07:07 PM | #37 | |
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BC may actually make your car handle worse, not better. They’ll be very harsh compared to something like the R&T. BC are for the stance group that want to lower their car so low to the point you can’t drive it on the street. Their custom Swift spring upgrade is a gimmick. Swift springs do not make a damper run better/smoother just because you’re using Swift springs. I have no experience with ST XTA dampers but they’re basically KW V1/V2/V3 dampers in a non-SS damper body to reduce cost. I’d look at ISC dampers if they’re available for the e9x M3. I believe they offer two packages - street valving or track valving + two or three spring rate options.. Price is ~$1200. As for Evolve/Bilstein B6 Damptronic or Bilstein B6 Damptronic, I’d wait to hear reviews from people who’ve actually installed the dampers. The Evolve/Bilstein B6 have been a mixed bag on the f8x. One common thing is people find them to be too harsh. The B6 is a monotube damper with a pretty high nitrogen gas pressure which makes the damper harsh over certain types of bumpy roads - rides over them, not absorbing them. |
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03-18-2024, 07:13 PM | #38 | |
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03-18-2024, 07:30 PM | #39 | |
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03-18-2024, 08:03 PM | #40 |
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Ok. Doesn’t change anything that I’ve stated. The various derivatives of Bilstein B6 Damptronic dampers are based on a high gas pressure monotube damper. The gas lifting force in the B6 is significant (actually any Bilstein monotube damper) and it acts like an undamped preloaded spring in parallel to the main spring. The piston rod doesn’t start to move and compress into the damper body until there’s an applied compressive force that exceeds the gas lifting force. This increases the harshness of a damper and makes it ride on, rather than absorb, bumps. If the goal is to improve ride quality and performance over stock, the B6 Damptronic is not what I’d recommend. The Evolve/Bilstein version with its claimed improvements in comfort and sport+ edc settings, hasn’t been a great success on the f8x so be careful if you’re considering it for your e9x M3.
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03-18-2024, 08:23 PM | #41 | |
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How much do you think that rear bushing job all around would cost? I’d have someone do it because I know getting bushings out of subfram is a PAIN! |
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03-18-2024, 11:41 PM | #42 |
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Saw it with my own eyes, granted on a E92 335i and not an M3. I was in my M3 following my friend's 335i. I knew of a bridge joint coming up in the road ahead and bridge joints cause the most lateral movement. So I watched as his rear wheel went over the bridge joint and I saw his rear bumper move sideways about an inch, give or take. Now imagine you're in another car, following close but not dangerously so. For you to be able to see this movement, then the movement must be significant. We weren't even driving fast, normal city speeds maybe 60-70 kph. Personally it surprised me how much lateral movement there was.
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03-19-2024, 12:13 AM | #43 | ||
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I wouldn't trust that Evolve Bilsteins necessarily are a great solution that solves the problems the original Bilstein B6s did. I would be cautious of a vendor that: claims to know the best bearings for our car by holding them in their hand: Quote:
also switched out the cats in their x-pipe without notice and then claimed to "not use a cheap cat" when they very literally switched to a cheaper cat - https://www.m3post.com/forums/showpo...20&postcount=9 This isn't to say Bilstein B6s aren't better than stock, but rather building off your notes on those and more of a commentary of whether you should trust Evolve in this situation. Last edited by bipp; 03-19-2024 at 12:42 AM.. |
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03-19-2024, 12:54 AM | #44 | |
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Then they followed it up with but we will still continue to use oem RBs because there’s nothing wrong with using oem RBs…so is Mahle the best or is oem still the best option? Can’t piss off the people you just talked into using oem RBs. For the f8x, they didn’t know why the ride height of cars would increase by at least 1/3” after installing the Evolve/Bilstein B6 dampers. If they don’t understand that, how much damper tuning experience do they have? My guess is they told Bilstein to make comfort more comfortable and sport+ more sporty. That’s part of the problem with EDC. EDC is trying to find the optimal damping rate to eliminate disturbances as quickly as possible and this is built into the edc closed-loop controller, not a specific damping curve/rate. You may limit the peak damping force in comfort by limiting peak voltage but edc is still trying to damp out oscillations as quickly as possible. |
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