M3 isn't that quick on the ring!!!

[Krueger///M3]

Originally Posted by footie

I have a Lotus and know just how amazing they are, but then again an Elise can't even compete with this time.



I promise you mate, I will do exactly that and hopefully with a little surprise as well.

I don't hate the M3, it's one hell of a machine. The only difference is I have driven many, many things which are much, much better, the thing is that very few of them come close to offering the same performance for the money and when they do they have other compromises that rule them out.

The thing is I see the M3 as one of a group of great drivers cars in this price bracket, not the only one.

Post pics of your lotus!

[DiscoZ]

Originally Posted by lucid

The regression analysis I did would indicate a time of 8:27 for those weight/power specs.

Mean reversion is a hypothesis; not necessarily a reality. Secondly, good idea on regressing hp/weight to lap times. Your R2 does indicate a good fit, however there are too many background variables; i.e. the tyre issue amongst others.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by DiscoZ

Mean reversion is a hypothesis; not necessarily a reality. Secondly, good idea on regressing hp/weight to lap times. Your R2 does indicate a good fit, however there are too many background variables; i.e. the tyre issue amongst others.

If you read that thread those are all discussed to death there. Yes, it's just a regression fit. It's just a way to put the deviations into context. Establishing cause and effect would be difficult. Others tried adding more variables and running multiple variable regressions but couldn't find anything that stuck.

[footie]

Originally Posted by lucid

Footie, what 4-seater RWD car is out there that exceeds the M3 in performance at the same price point with comparable build quality and warranty? I mean a real 4-seater, not 2+1/2, that you can drive to work everyday and on the track on the weekend?

That was my point when I posted the remarks you have replied to here. The M3 in it's sector is very, very, good but I don't see it that much better than either the C63 or the RS4. It's approach is different than those two, it's more touchy, feely and technical than either of them, but in the end each of them achieve the same results.

Originally Posted by Krueger///M3

Post pics of your lotus!

At the minute it's in storage waiting the time and extra cash to give the thing a total re-build that it deserves. The thing is over 41 yers old, for heavensake.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by footie

That was my point when I posted the remarks you have replied to here. The M3 in it's sector is very, very, good but I don't see it that much better than either the C63 or the RS4. It's approach is different than those two, it's more touchy, feely and technical than either of them, but in the end each of them achieve the same results.

Cool.

[footie]

I learned an interesting fact from the dealer today.

When he was sent to the Hockenheimring to drive the M3 for the first, all of the 20+ M3s sitting were fitted with the stock 18" alloys. He said he asked the question 'Why not 19" as these are the favoured rim when customers spec their car?', the reply back from the instructor was that the 18" are the better combination for both ride, handling and feel, that was why every M3 which was tested during development had 18" alloys and why the 19" were only tested near the end of development after the suspension was signed off.

I'm glad I made the right choice there then.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by footie

why every M3 which was tested during development had 18" alloys and why the 19" were only tested near the end of development after the suspension was signed off.

Larry Kock pretty said the same thing but did not mention the above.

[footie]

Originally Posted by lucid

Larry Kock pretty said the same thing but did not mention the above.

I don't know if it's true or not, it was just what he said to me on passing but then again he does know I picked the 18" anyway, though I know in my heart of hearts that the 18" are the better option is you are interested in purely the finer things instead of maybe making it look it's prettiest.

P.S.

Was it not Larry Kock who said the surge was engineered into the M-DCT. Oh, I shouldn't have said that or old swampie will be after my guts once again.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by footie

Was it not Larry Kock who said the surge was engineered into the M-DCT. Oh, I shouldn't have said that or old swampie will be after my guts once again.

He didn't mention anything about the surge, but he did say they engineered "something" into to. It can be many things.

[Voltigeur]

Originally Posted by footie

reply back from the instructor was that the 18" are the better combination for both ride, handling and feel, that was why every M3 which was tested during development had 18" alloys and why the 19" were only tested near the end of development after the suspension was signed off.

And why I would choose 18s: Chris Harris of Autocar said something on getting 18s for track and I think I recall Steved also commenting on the better characteristics of 18s.

Still be nice to have some after-market black 19s in due course - but keep 18s for fun bits.

[T Bone]

Originally Posted by footie

I don't know if it's true or not, it was just what he said to me on passing but then again he does know I picked the 18" anyway, though I know in my heart of hearts that the 18" are the better option is you are interested in purely the finer things instead of maybe making it look it's prettiest.

P.S.

Was it not Larry Kock who said the surge was engineered into the M-DCT. Oh, I shouldn't have said that or old swampie will be after my guts once again.

I think you met Larry Cock Footie.

Smaller wheels are almost always better than larger wheels so long as the the tires have stiff sidewalls to have a good turn-in.

Having taller sidewalls also enhances the contact patch since taller sidewalls absorb more road imperfections.

I just wished BMW and others made the 18"s as pretty as the 19".



The best wheels ever for me....

15" Volk Racing for my Integra Type R
16" Porsche Turbo Cup wheels - magnesium baby

[BMW-videos.com]

Yeah it's a little odd the m3 posts so low, what's the R8's time I believe it has similar power.

[M3WC]

Originally Posted by footie

I know I harp on about too many on this site and others disregarding anything that isn't rwd but when a machine with only 227hp is quicker than something with 500hp and BMW's ideal weight balance and rwd chassis you have to question who's setup is right and who's is wrong. I personally know which one is the more entertaining but I am not so sure it's the one which happes to be quickest.

Yes it has 227hp, but it also weighs over 1,000 lbs less than a M3.

So the time is not surprising at all.

The freakin new Camero just did 8:20.

[SteelTorque]

Footie, you have proven once again your ignorance when it comes to cars and tracks.

Keep up the good work, buddy!

[mixja]

2006 JDM-spec Subaru STI Spec C did 7:59 around Nurburgring - officially they are a 280PS (more like 310PS as has been dyno proven on many occasions) and 430NM torque car, weighing around 1350kg, so I can believe the R26-R time...

And I'm sure the RS4 did sub 8 minutes with better tires...

:Edit: the RS4 did sub 8 minutes with Pirellis P Zero Corsa tires and ceramic brakes - ceramic brakes are the business on the track, I had them on my old RS4...

[footie]

Originally Posted by SteelTorque

Footie, you have proven once again your ignorance when it comes to cars and tracks.

Keep up the good work, buddy!

Please explain because I am all ears.

[brava09]

Footie is protected because posts a lot and stirs the pot with his audi bias; the result of these is lots of threads and debates which attracts traffic and is usually good for a forum.

I believe it would be a very boring forum when all members agree on the "awesomeness" of the M3


Later edit: I have just noticed the post I was refferingto is deleted....good job...I believe Footie is some sort of moderator...so please Footie, delete this one as well, cause it doesn't make any sense now.

[BMW-driver]

lol. Can't wait for the Porsche Spyder: 1.275kg and 320 bhp + Porsche's sports suspension and cheramic brakes.

Originally Posted by footie

If you have read the latest AUTOCAR mag you will already know what I am talking about, namely the Renault Megane R26R.

This little French Hothatch with only fwd and 227hp to power it's 1220Kgs frame has only gone and lapped the ring is a staggering 8mins and 12seconds.

Yeah that's right

8:12 from only a 227hp fwd Hothatch.

[Gearhead999s]

Thats nothing I did a 7.43 and did 207 mph on the straight when I went there in a Audi(you know the real fast one)

[ChinoOrtega]

that's not any hatchback you're talking about, that's a limited edition track oriented car, design for racetracks not daily driver, and it also broke the time barrier for ALL FWD cars, it would compare to the M3 limited edition track oriented car, the GTS, if it were apples to apples, besides it's a really cool car, wouldn't mind having it as a track car and my M3 as DD

[MJC///M3]

Originally Posted by footie

If you have read the latest AUTOCAR mag you will already know what I am talking about, namely the Renault Megane R26R.

This little French Hothatch with only fwd and 227hp to power it's 1220Kgs frame has only gone and lapped the ring is a staggering 8mins and 12seconds.

Yeah that's right

8:12 from only a 227hp fwd Hothatch.

wow!

I'll stick with my "slow" M3....thanks.

[ChasenM3]

I apologize if I miss-read but the Renault did it with R compounds?

That right there is a flagged time to me. It goes back to the Porsche/GTR scandal..

Tires are make or break.