Track forum general chit chat.

[redpriest]

Originally Posted by Jive

So what is the verdict on the F8X platform with regards to track use now that they've been out for a few years? Easier to handle or still a handful? Putting down a lot faster times? Overall a better platform for the track? How does the engine hold up in high heat? Is everyone ensuring their tire PSI is dialed in?

Here's my F82/E92 short version comparison:

2017 M4 with competition package, manual transmission. Stock suspension, only change is camber plates to allow -3.5 camber.

Pros:
* Cooling is way better than E92. I can push all day long and it never goes into limp mode. It never budges from the 1/3 position, which is ~ 210 F. Ever. I can do full session is 90+ deg weather no problem without it budging. The same thing can't be said of my E92.
* Suspension = money. I never drove pre-competition suspension, but I have zero complaints. Completely controllable. Car is fantastic chassis wise. Feels agile and smaller than it is compared to E92.
* Throttle feels linear, car is easy to control with just the throttle too. Just modulate as needed. As long as you don't do stupid things like mash the throttle in mid-corner it won't bite. I think they retuned the power/torque curve in the ZCP to make it less horrible at early RPMs.
* The power is fantastic compared to E92. This car is faster on the straights fully optioned (without carbon ceramics and manual transmission) than my stripped E92 M3 with 360 whp.

Cons:
* Stock iron brakes still suck. If you're any good, you will fade even with SRF + track pad. Ducting is a must at a minimum. If you're not feeling fade you haven't driven Laguna Seca with sticky tires. You will overwhelm the brakes quickly.
* Car has some body roll, dives and lifts when on throttle and braking. It's not too bad.
* Sound. It's an acquired taste. You get used to it, and can appreciate some of the noises it makes. I like the anti-lag noise when you lift off throttle at high RPMs.
* Car shimmies under braking. My E92 did this too until I replaced the front control arm bushings with monoballs.

Here are my PBs on tracks I've done both at with similar tires, and the same tire sizes (I like to run 275 square, or 265 if it's a wide tire):

F82 M4 with Hankook RS4 vs E92 M3 with lots of mods (see signature) with Bridgestone RE71R @ Laguna Seca
1:42.377 vs 1:42.55

M4 with BFGoodrich R1S vs E92 M3 with lots of mods + Nitto NT01 tires at Auto Club Speedway:
1:52.143 vs 1:52.96

[bigjae1976]

Originally Posted by redpriest

Here's my F82/E92 short version comparison:

2017 M4 with competition package, manual transmission. Stock suspension, only change is camber plates to allow -3.5 camber.

Pros:
* Cooling is way better than E92. I can push all day long and it never goes into limp mode. It never budges from the 1/3 position, which is ~ 210 F. Ever. I can do full session is 90+ deg weather no problem without it budging. The same thing can't be said of my E92.
* Suspension = money. I never drove pre-competition suspension, but I have zero complaints. Completely controllable. Car is fantastic chassis wise. Feels agile and smaller than it is compared to E92.
* Throttle feels linear, car is easy to control with just the throttle too. Just modulate as needed. As long as you don't do stupid things like mash the throttle in mid-corner it won't bite. I think they retuned the power/torque curve in the ZCP to make it less horrible at early RPMs.
* The power is fantastic compared to E92. This car is faster on the straights fully optioned (without carbon ceramics and manual transmission) than my stripped E92 M3 with 360 whp.

Cons:
* Stock iron brakes still suck. If you're any good, you will fade even with SRF + track pad. Ducting is a must at a minimum. If you're not feeling fade you haven't driven Laguna Seca with sticky tires. You will overwhelm the brakes quickly.
* Car has some body roll, dives and lifts when on throttle and braking. It's not too bad.
* Sound. It's an acquired taste. You get used to it, and can appreciate some of the noises it makes. I like the anti-lag noise when you lift off throttle at high RPMs.
* Car shimmies under braking. My E92 did this too until I replaced the front control arm bushings with monoballs.

Here are my PBs on tracks I've done both at with similar tires, and the same tire sizes (I like to run 275 square, or 265 if it's a wide tire):

F82 M4 with Hankook RS4 vs E92 M3 with lots of mods (see signature) with Bridgestone RE71R @ Laguna Seca
1:42.377 vs 1:42.55

M4 with BFGoodrich R1S vs E92 M3 with lots of mods + Nitto NT01 tires:
1:52.143 vs 1:52.96

Not a surprise. I think the F8X is a close but better cousin to the E9X whereas the E9X was a vast leap over the E46.

Which is why I'm not really interested in jumping up to the F80. The F80 is a better car but the V8 is so awesome!

[Jive]

Interesting. Thanks for the breakdown, priest and mantii.

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by Jive

So what is the verdict on the F8X platform with regards to track use now that they've been out for a few years? Easier to handle or still a handful? Putting down a lot faster times? Overall a better platform for the track? How does the engine hold up in high heat? Is everyone ensuring their tire PSI is dialed in?

I see what you did there. Lolololol

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by redpriest

Here's my F82/E92 short version comparison:

2017 M4 with competition package, manual transmission. Stock suspension, only change is camber plates to allow -3.5 camber.

Pros:
* Cooling is way better than E92. I can push all day long and it never goes into limp mode. It never budges from the 1/3 position, which is ~ 210 F. Ever. I can do full session is 90+ deg weather no problem without it budging. The same thing can't be said of my E92.
* Suspension = money. I never drove pre-competition suspension, but I have zero complaints. Completely controllable. Car is fantastic chassis wise. Feels agile and smaller than it is compared to E92.
* Throttle feels linear, car is easy to control with just the throttle too. Just modulate as needed. As long as you don't do stupid things like mash the throttle in mid-corner it won't bite. I think they retuned the power/torque curve in the ZCP to make it less horrible at early RPMs.
* The power is fantastic compared to E92. This car is faster on the straights fully optioned (without carbon ceramics and manual transmission) than my stripped E92 M3 with 360 whp.

Cons:
* Stock iron brakes still suck. If you're any good, you will fade even with SRF + track pad. Ducting is a must at a minimum. If you're not feeling fade you haven't driven Laguna Seca with sticky tires. You will overwhelm the brakes quickly.
* Car has some body roll, dives and lifts when on throttle and braking. It's not too bad.
* Sound. It's an acquired taste. You get used to it, and can appreciate some of the noises it makes. I like the anti-lag noise when you lift off throttle at high RPMs.
* Car shimmies under braking. My E92 did this too until I replaced the front control arm bushings with monoballs.

Here are my PBs on tracks I've done both at with similar tires, and the same tire sizes (I like to run 275 square, or 265 if it's a wide tire):

F82 M4 with Hankook RS4 vs E92 M3 with lots of mods (see signature) with Bridgestone RE71R @ Laguna Seca
1:42.377 vs 1:42.55

M4 with BFGoodrich R1S vs E92 M3 with lots of mods + Nitto NT01 tires:
1:52.143 vs 1:52.96

#zentrose

[M3 Number 86]

New wheels!

[roastbeef]

Damn those look good! Did you get 10's or 10.5's?

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by roastbeef

Damn those look good! Did you get 10's or 10.5's?

Too scared for 10.5 and potential fitment problems with kw suspension lol

[CorruptCommie]

Can't wait to see them on the car. 265/645/18?

[roastbeef]

My next set of wheels for sure!

[NoCarrier]

Originally Posted by redpriest

* Car shimmies under braking. My E92 did this too until I replaced the front control arm bushings with monoballs.

Cool write up. Thanks for the comparison. On a side note, it's time for me to replace FCABs. Are the e9x monoballs a worthy upgrade for a daily driver, or are they pretty brutal? Which brand did you use?

Originally Posted by M3 Number 86

New wheels!

Welcome to the bronze club! Did you buy used race slicks, or get those new?

[lutfy]

Originally Posted by redpriest

Here's my F82/E92 short version comparison:

2017 M4 with competition package, manual transmission. Stock suspension, only change is camber plates to allow -3.5 camber.

Pros:
* Cooling is way better than E92. I can push all day long and it never goes into limp mode. It never budges from the 1/3 position, which is ~ 210 F. Ever. I can do full session is 90+ deg weather no problem without it budging. The same thing can't be said of my E92.
* Suspension = money. I never drove pre-competition suspension, but I have zero complaints. Completely controllable. Car is fantastic chassis wise. Feels agile and smaller than it is compared to E92.
* Throttle feels linear, car is easy to control with just the throttle too. Just modulate as needed. As long as you don't do stupid things like mash the throttle in mid-corner it won't bite. I think they retuned the power/torque curve in the ZCP to make it less horrible at early RPMs.
* The power is fantastic compared to E92. This car is faster on the straights fully optioned (without carbon ceramics and manual transmission) than my stripped E92 M3 with 360 whp.

Cons:
* Stock iron brakes still suck. If you're any good, you will fade even with SRF + track pad. Ducting is a must at a minimum. If you're not feeling fade you haven't driven Laguna Seca with sticky tires. You will overwhelm the brakes quickly.
* Car has some body roll, dives and lifts when on throttle and braking. It's not too bad.
* Sound. It's an acquired taste. You get used to it, and can appreciate some of the noises it makes. I like the anti-lag noise when you lift off throttle at high RPMs.
* Car shimmies under braking. My E92 did this too until I replaced the front control arm bushings with monoballs.

Here are my PBs on tracks I've done both at with similar tires, and the same tire sizes (I like to run 275 square, or 265 if it's a wide tire):

F82 M4 with Hankook RS4 vs E92 M3 with lots of mods (see signature) with Bridgestone RE71R @ Laguna Seca
1:42.377 vs 1:42.55

M4 with BFGoodrich R1S vs E92 M3 with lots of mods + Nitto NT01 tires:
1:52.143 vs 1:52.96

Excellent observation! I had to modify my car a fair bit (E90 M with full open exhaust, pulleys, Epic tune, camber, Bilstein/Spec R springs, HR bar, R comps) to get it down to 2:06 at VIR whereas the F8X stock power with RE71R in stock size (and stock camber) was an easy 2:06. Nutshell, the F8X is a better chassis but after the choice, I ended up with E9X because of the V8 sound and steering feel.

F80 manages head MUCH better than our cars. Altough truth be told, the brakes were not terribly bad on the F80 (Pagid yellow with SRF) on stock rotors. Whereas E9X with stock rotors, same pads and fluid will be done after 20 mins on track. Could be the longer straights at VIR I guess.

Lutfy

[roastbeef]

Someone told me a while back that running catless or race cats can cause the engine to run a little warmer. Has anyone had that experience?
My car has been a littler warmer both on the track and with normal driving. However, I'm not sure if it is because I switched to shell helix ultra 10/60 or the race cats...

[macdude357]

Originally Posted by lutfy

F80 manages head

Wow, the F80's can give you head? Sign me up

[macdude357]

Originally Posted by roastbeef

Someone told me a while back that running catless or race cats can cause the engine to run a little warmer. Has anyone had that experience?
My car has been a littler warmer both on the track and with normal driving. However, I'm not sure if it is because I switched to shell helix ultra 10/60 or the race cats...

Makes sense. You are making more power. More power = more heat, right?

[roastbeef]

Originally Posted by macdude357

Makes sense. You are making more power. More power = more heat, right?

Yea, i guess you're right. Maybe it gets to the higher rpm's faster?
I thought the high flow cats wouldn't hold onto as much heat or something- or have no effect on engine temp.

[M3 Number 86]

Z4m in the pic for more oohs. Lolol

I like these wheels.

Did a private event and BMW Na was there testing the day before. Was pretty cool to meet ze Germans complete with accents and talking cars. Maybe we'll end up on bmw.de with the pics they took of us lol. Trying to gather some photos and make a separate thread.

From what I could see at the time was m2 CS new m5 and maybe performance i8.

[evilspiritM3]

Originally Posted by M3 Number 86

Z4m in the pic for more oohs. Lolol

I like these wheels.

Did a private event and BMW Na was there testing the day before. Was pretty cool to meet ze Germans complete with accents and talking cars. Maybe we'll end up on bmw.de with the pics they took of us lol. Trying to gather some photos and make a separate thread.

From what I could see at the time was m2 CS new m5 and maybe performance i8.

How were those Pirelli's?

[elim11]

Originally Posted by M3 Number 86

Z4m in the pic for more oohs. Lolol

I like these wheels.

Did a private event and BMW Na was there testing the day before. Was pretty cool to meet ze Germans complete with accents and talking cars. Maybe we'll end up on bmw.de with the pics they took of us lol. Trying to gather some photos and make a separate thread.

From what I could see at the time was m2 CS new m5 and maybe performance i8.

Nice! which track did you go?

[Datka]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

Not a surprise. I think the F8X is a close but better cousin to the E9X whereas the E9X was a vast leap over the E46.

Which is why I'm not really interested in jumping up to the F80. The F80 is a better car but the V8 is so awesome!

I couldn't have said it better myself. Agree with this 100%.
After supercharging my e92m3 recently, I cant imagine getting anything as good or better for the money. What a beast.

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by elim11

Nice! which track did you go?

Button

[M3 Number 86]

Originally Posted by evilspiritM3

How were those Pirelli's?

I should've taken some pics of my tires but it was about 104F at the track.

They had pretty good grip levels even in that heat but hard to compare to when I had r1s in cooler temps. I was two seconds faster on r1s in cooler temps.

These tires had much stiffer sidewalls but I didn't play with my suspension settings much. I rarely do but always regret it when I get home lol

I did go into the day thinking I'll only have them for this one event so I tried to break it loose on sweeper by throwing the car in and mashing the gas but it didn't give. On second thought I couldve driven them a lot more aggressive but was trying to keep it clean so prob lost some time for that for sure. Some of the guys I went with pb'd easily.

A question for all of you on here. My front left tires (when going sticky) are getting massive wear on clockwise tracks (and the opposite on counter clockwise). I feel like I have too stiff compression so the tires are pushing.

Should I be lowering compression in the front to counter this and potentially get more cornering grip? I'm going to try this next time. I should have done this while there.

I drove a few of my buddies' cars and my car is so much harder to drive and takes way more effort. Granted weight is a contributing factor but it can't be this much of a difference.