Why do people WANT kids?

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

You work 3-4hrs a week?

Maybe even less than that. Usually 30mins a day of emails and short follow ups with phone calls and call it a day. I also take a solid month off during Chinese New Years and another month off in the summer to go back to Vancouver for the golf and the weather. Good thing is, I can pretty much do my work as long as I have internet. I'm not an office kind of guy.

Edit: I forgot to mention the kush in Vancouver

[KingOfJericho]

Did you inherit a bunch of money or something? What kind of work can you do for 3-4 hrs a week and maintain a livable income?

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

Did you inherit a bunch of money or something? What kind of work can you do for 3-4 hrs a week and maintain a livable income?

Who in their right mind would even work 3-4hrs a week if they inherited a bunch of dough? The only thing I got from my dad was debt lol. I run a manufacturing plant in China and a trading company in HK. My motto is to hire the right people to do your job and you will never have to work. Empowerment goes a long way. Some people work to live, some people live to work. Those who live to work really love their work and get extremely motivated to accumulating more and more "things". I just prefer to live and have enough. And after having my son, I feel like I have everything that I'd ever need and want.

[NemesisX]

Originally Posted by Nkc

Who in their right mind would even work 3-4hrs a week if they inherited a bunch of dough? The only thing I got from my dad was debt lol. I run a manufacturing plant in China and a trading company in HK. My motto is to hire the right people to do your job and you will never have to work. Empowerment goes a long way. Some people work to live, some people live to work. Those who live to work really love their work and get extremely motivated to accumulating more and more "things". I just prefer to live and have enough. And after having my son, I feel like I have everything that I'd ever need and want.

Several months ago you strongly implied that anyone born into money has a moral obligation to donate it all away (to starving children, for example).

[bing240sx]

Originally Posted by Bear From Jax

Shitty diapers... No thanks.

this changes.

when your baby boy/girl is constipated for 3 days and you see the kind of discomfort they are in you will consider sucking it out of their butt just to make them feel better... okay maybe that is an exaggeration but when they finally are able to poop after 3 days, even if it happens all over your shirt, it will be a great day. better than you can even imagine.

Originally Posted by Sara504

Im considering just being at SAHM

there are few greater status symbols for a man than a SAHM/wife. After having a few kids and the stresses involved imho a women should be under no pressure to do anything but what she feels in her heart; which at this point is probably tending to her home and kids full time.

my wife hasnt worked in 6 years... as mentioned earlier sure we sacrificed a lot of earnings but so what. I just have to work harder.

[Trijicon]

Originally Posted by ddk632

Working from home makes a huge difference. Not everyone has that opportunity, unfortunately. But it is awesome.

This. When my first son was born (three years ago) my commute to work was 2 to 3hrs a day depending on traffic. Not much of a burden on me because I rode the company bus, but it sucked for my wife and quality time with my son. I fortunately found an opportunity to work from home and it changed my work/life balance completely. I took a $10K/yr pay cut but its all worth it. Before, I would only see my son 1.5 hours a day (I get home, we eat, then he sleeps). Now I drop him off to daycare around 8:30-9:00am and pick him up around 3:30 to 4:00pm. Wife gets home from work (around 5:00) and we have our whole evening together. Pretty awesome. Giving up $10k/yr is a bargain, time with family to me is priceless.

We now have a 3 month old and work-from-home benefits just doubled.

[carve]

Originally Posted by 128Convertibleguy

The best advice I can give to you is great, provided your spouse is fine with it, and that you have the flexibility to change your mind if it doesn't work for you.

There's been some people saying it's a bad thing. Here's the flip side. My Mom went back to work when I was quite young because it was financially required. Not "desirable" to maintain a lifestyle, flat out required. My sister and I were raised by a succession of housekeepers, which were very cheap back then in our city.

I attribute the fact that neither of us has chosen to have children largely to that. Just not enough quality family time for us to see the joys of a parent - child household. And certainly a distaste for two working parents, and being raised by hired help. They were nice enough, but the connection just wasn't there.

That's an interesting way to put it, and maybe part of my concern was being in a similar situation. My parents weren't bad...but I guess it did seem like a chore to them

My mom often worked late, often getting home just before bed and sometimes working weekends. My dad worked long hours...4 days a week so he could have Fridays off :/ I was always the last kid to get picked up from daycare, and was also dropped off there in the morning to catch the bus.

I was a kinda nerdy kid and wasn't interested in the things my dad wanted me to be interested in like fishing or sports (except skiing and later mountain biking), so he seemed frustrated with me a lot. He also enjoys teasing kids...getting them to do/believe cute/stupid stuff, so I never really trusted him. Mom was focused on material things (for me as well as her), had a nervous breakdown when I was 10, they divorced, and she married my step dad a couple years later. He was kinda a dick, and seeing the work an infant takes at age 14 on made an impression.

I guess you could say I never really saw the joy of being a parent or a child for that matter, but being me right now kicks ass and that affects my motivation now. I turned out pretty good nevertheless so they must've done something right...but I guess my experience makes me ask "why would I trade my current level of fun and happiness for that?". My girl grew up with a crazy brother and spent as much time as possible at her grandparents and friends places, and he's still taking a toll on her parents, so I suppose she's coming from a similar place. Her parents are still together though and her mom is awesome

That's another thing...her brother had tons of time and resources poured into him and is a total fuckup. She had much less attention and turned out absolutely amazing. You never know what shuffle of genes will come out

All that said, my parents were better than their own parents, and I know ton of people who had it way worse than me who still want kids

[grimlock]

^
Carve, man, here's what I believe.
That you're asking this question means you probably want to, BUT it's hard to shake off past experience.
Not that the book is relevent, but I am reminded by the title of Alfred Adler's "What life could mean to you".
As I am sure you know, changing our beliefs is hard because our past experience is the only thing we have to go by - we know no different.
I found after I watched a really family family Taiwanese sitcom I want to have kids a little more, the same after I spent some time with my niece.
If you could SEE how else things could be, how other people do things, then you have something else to go on other than your own experience which you are trying not to repeat.

In the TV show, a woman is asked why she's so interested in women who are mothers - she says it's because her's was less than optimum (), so she wanted to see all the other mothers of the world, so one day she could be a good mom herself.

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by grimlock

^
Carve, man, here's what I believe.
That you're asking this question means you probably want to, BUT it's hard to shake off past experience.
Not that the book is relevent, but I am reminded by the title of Alfred Adler's "What life could mean to you".
As I am sure you know, changing our beliefs is hard because our past experience is the only thing we have to go by - we know no different.
I found after I watched a really family family Taiwanese sitcom I want to have kids a little more, the same after I spent some time with my niece.
If you could SEE how else things could be, how other people do things, then you have something else to go on other than your own experience which you are trying not to repeat.

In the TV show, a woman is asked why she's so interested in women who are mothers - she says it's because her's was less than optimum (), so she wanted to see all the other mothers of the world, so one day she could be a good mom herself.

This is good some good insight. As I've said before, you're not going to hear people who have had happy lives in their 20s and 30s tell you that having kids ruined their lives. That should be pretty telling.

Is changing diapers fun? No. But those moments are so short and the remarkable moments are so plentiful that it's really a cop out to point to something like that as justification. Is getting gas fun? Is buying tires fun? No, but those parts of car ownership are easily overlooked in much the same way as a dirty diaper.

Being a parent for these nine months thus far has been a remarkably rewarding and enriching experience. I think it has made me a better person in more ways than I could have imagined.

Owning a Ferrari sounds like a nightmare in many ways but people still buy them every day because they love that feeling. Kids are similar. There are times when they make you want to pull your hair out but you know why you have them and your connection with them is the real reward.

[ddk632]

The best of both worlds is having the kids AND the Ferrari.



Disclaimer: not yet my personal experience, but I plan to one day report on the truth of this statement... So far, I am just missing the Ferrari part of the equation.

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by NemesisX

Several months ago you strongly implied that anyone born into money has a moral obligation to donate it all away (to starving children, for example).

No son, I was referring to students with zero income that spends $3k a month eating out should donate to people in need. I'm sure we both know who I'm talking about.

[NemesisX]

Originally Posted by Nkc

No son, I was referring to students with zero income that spends $3k a month eating out should donate to people in need. I'm sure we both know who I'm talking about.

But if someone inherits money one would be out of his or her "right mind" to work more than 3 hours a week (if at all), according to you.

What's special about inheritance? For that matter what's special about $3k? Presumably you've conceived of some arbitrary threshold for eating out beyond which I should be donating money to starving children instead ($1000? $500? $50? $0? something else?).

[ddk632]

Guys there's no need to argue. I think we can all agree that donating to ddk632's Ferrari fund is for a good cause. I take PayPal.

[NemesisX]

Originally Posted by ddk632

Guys there's no need to argue. I think we can all agree that donating to ddk632's Ferrari fund is for a good cause. I take PayPal.

Yeah my apologies for the momentary thread jack. I'll refrain from discussing it further.

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by NemesisX

Yeah my apologies for the momentary thread jack. I'll refrain from discussing it further.

We'll argue again when you actually gain some life experiences, until then let's focus on finishing your studies and getting a job.

[NemesisX]

Originally Posted by Nkc

We'll argue again when you actually gain some life experiences, until then let's focus on finishing your studies and getting a job.

Sure thing boss. I'm tempted to say that I aspire to one day spend 3 hours a week writing emails for a living but it's not exactly pertinent to my field.

[Nkc]

Originally Posted by NemesisX

Sure thing boss. I'm tempted to say that I aspire to one day spend 3 hours a week writing emails for a living but it's not exactly pertinent to my field.

If that's your goal then no one can stop you from achieving it. Just gotta change how the world (your field) works a little bit to make it fit your needs.

[Vic311]

Well this thread has certainly de-evolved as expected.

[ShopVac]

I'll try to track this back on course...

Watching kids grow up to mature adults is definitely worth it. Sure, I can have the bags of cash like my brother (DINKS)...but you don't get any sense of accomplishment?

Here's a recent example with me.

On January 4th this year - while playing hockey, a check incurred a simple fracture of both radius and ulna in my son's arm, creating a 45 painful minute trip to the emergency room. He played for 10 seconds while is arm was hanging down, to ensure the other team did not score while he was on the ice.


Another 1/8" would have pushed the radius through his wrist.



After re-breaking his arm at the orthopedic surgeon's - they still were not able to straighten it, so 4 hours of surgery to pin things back together.



Followed by 4 weeks in a full arm cast.



And then - the day he looked forward to. Getting the pins out, which should give him a 1/2 cast, allowing him to skate.

Of course, it didn't work out as planned, and he needed another full cast for 3 weeks. Followed by a short cast for another 2. Eventually though, he did get the cast off



Intense physical therapy to get back into shape - eventually was able to get back work with his team, just in time for the playoffs, making and helping his team win the championship game this past Wednesday.



Personally, wouldn't have mattered if we won. Seeing him go through all the ups and downs - from start to end was amazing. I've never seen someone push himself in a way to get back into the game like this...and as a parent, surely gives a sense of accomplishment.

To each their own though.

[Joekerr]

Good on you Shop Vac - good personal experience to get the thread back on track - and kudos to your son, that's perseverance and probably because the apple rarely falls far from the tree. Great post.

Carve - keep asking questions, but keep in mind that at the end of the day this is not a decision that can be made simply weighing the pros and cons; mainly because while the cons can be probably perceived through observation of other parents (but probably not to the full extent), the intangible pros definitely cannot be observed, categorized, and understood. Not fully...not until its your kid.

I think you are on the right track though, but really invest time in communicating with each other...what do each of you honestly truly want. Be open about your fears and also your desires. Its not for everyone, and there's no shame in that IMO, but you both have to be on board with the decision.

Good luck!

[AtlantaDude]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Good on you Shop Vac - good personal experience to get the thread back on track - and kudos to your son, that's perseverance and probably because the apple rarely falls far from the tree. Great post.

Carve - keep asking questions, but keep in mind that at the end of the day this is not a decision that can be made simply weighing the pros and cons; mainly because while the cons can be probably perceived through observation of other parents (but probably not to the full extent), the intangible pros definitely cannot be observed, categorized, and understood. Not fully...not until its your kid.

I think you are on the right track though, but really invest time in communicating with each other...what do each of you honestly truly want. Be open about your fears and also your desires. Its not for everyone, and there's no shame in that IMO, but you both have to be on board with the decision.

Good luck!

+150% Couldn't say it better

[Litos]

my wife would killer herself if she was a SAHM....

she has 3 degrees - she ain't gonna let that go to waste sitting at home ironing my clothes....

**even though she irons my shirts every morning before I go to work, she would NEVER stay at home all day***