Track forum general chit chat.

[bipp]

Originally Posted by omgzirra_exe

You know, I started this habit about 6 years ago when my boss sent me an email and I was like, 'WTF is —?' Now I use it all the time because it looks cool… LOL. Sometimes I get lazy, but I have it set up as a macro shortcut since the normal way is Alt+0151 (—).

I've also been trying to work on my writing more, and I find it more appropriate to practice on forums rather than Discord—where I mostly just meme and abbreviate everything.

sheesh - well, if I thought you were throwing your messages into chatgpt before sending, that's gotta say something about your writing efforts working out then haha

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by bipp

sheesh - well, if I thought you were throwing your messages into chatgpt before sending, that's gotta say something about your writing efforts working out then haha

To be honest, I do use ChatGPT sometimes when I don’t understand why certain punctuation is used or why something works the way it does.

It’s a great learning tool. But yeah, for me personally, writing’s always been my weakest skillset. Especially after my wife's professor proof read my resume and said my writing sucks

[amg6975]

Originally Posted by tsk94

This doesn't warrant it's own thread, so I'll ask the question here to get peoples opinions:

I'm about to install the do88 cooler package on my M3 track car. I'd call it a clubsport 'build' (full interior w/ race seats, half cage, rear seat delete) for reference.
I'm strongly debating deleting AC while I'm in there. For myself, it serves almost no use - the car only gets driven to and from the track and the climate up here is livable without AC for those drives. Deleting it saves some weight, a few HP, and better air flow to the coolers with the condenser gone.
However, I don't know how long of term I plan on keeping the car. So doing mods that are re-sale friendly to potential future owners of a track car is a consideration.

Thoughts?
1. Remove AC, cause track car
2. Keep AC, cause cool boi

I removed the AC and kind of regret it. There is no HP penalty when it's not on, the clutch disengages and spins freely. The weight savings is there but not significant on it's own. Cooling is probably the biggest advantage.

[tsk94]

Originally Posted by amg6975

I removed the AC and kind of regret it. There is no HP penalty when it's not on, the clutch disengages and spins freely. The weight savings is there but not significant on it's own. Cooling is probably the biggest advantage.

Agreed with cooling being the biggest benefit.
I did it on my last car, but it was a stripped out race car. For this application it almost seems to make more sense to keep it...

[amg6975]

If you're ever going to drive it on the street, keep the AC. The first event after I deleted it, it was super hot and raining on the drive home and I could not keep the windshield clear without blasting the heat when it was already 90+ out.

Now I trailer it most places, but when sitting in grid or something it sure would be nice to have A/C.

All the factory races cars, and most real actual race cars have AC these days for driver cooling...

[former 240 s14]

Keep the A/C newer units are lighter than what we are used to from the 90's and if its not on its not hurting you (like many others have said.)

Excited for my race this week, AER Pitt Race 2025. Its going to be wet but our E36 and E46 are going to be more level with other cars in our class with the rain. Rain, it's the ultimate equalizer!

[RalliartRsX]

So a few things
1). For folks who have removed HVAC, what module did you access to tune out the fan being constantly on??

Also separate tire question

Successful race weekend. Went with Alibaba brake cooling ducts (way too small lol) and had amg6975 get me a set of r12 front and rear. Haven't had a chance to remove yet, but will check later



Wanted opinion; 275 35 vs 285 30 (rt660). This weekend I finally killed my set of v730 for the first MARRS event of the year. Tire height for the rear would make a gearing spread reduction for a bump in accel. However the stretched v730 with a 275/35 has great pointed feel and gave plenty on feedback at the edge of grip and communicates wonderfully. And fast until the edges delaminated for the last race of the weekend The 285 on the rt660 runs really wide. Thread width on a 10" wheel for the 285 rt660 is 10.6. Thread width on a 10" wheel for the 275 rt660 is is 10.1. Thread width on a 9.5" wheel for the v730 is 9.4 (all from tire rack). The key here is balancing heat tolerance vs feel on my heavy car

Question : should I stick with a 275 on rt660 with a wider thread width than the v730 or go for the 285 and allow more tire for heat management but probably not as stretched/sidewall stability and proper feel of the 275? Even if I go with the 275 rt660, it's still 0.5 inches wider thread width that the equivalent 275 v730.

Tire rack and Andy say go with slightly smaller stretched..but at 3400lbs. Heat management is a thing for our 15 or so min sprint races

[tsk94]

285/30 is too short for these cars, imo. I don't think I'd even use 295/30 anymore, which I used to lots. I think the 275/35 on a wider wheel, which you can stretch more with more sidewall, actually performs better. YMMV

[former 240 s14]

Originally Posted by RalliartRsX

So a few things
1). For folks who have removed HVAC, what module did you access to tune out the fan being constantly on??

Also separate tire question

Successful race weekend. Went with Alibaba brake cooling ducts (way too small lol) and had amg6975 get me a set of r12 front and rear. Haven't had a chance to remove yet, but will check later



Wanted opinion; 275 35 vs 285 30 (rt660). This weekend I finally killed my set of v730 for the first MARRS event of the year. Tire height for the rear would make a gearing spread reduction for a bump in accel. However the stretched v730 with a 275/35 has great pointed feel and gave plenty on feedback at the edge of grip and communicates wonderfully. And fast until the edges delaminated for the last race of the weekend The 285 on the rt660 runs really wide. Thread width on a 10" wheel for the 285 rt660 is 10.6. Thread width on a 10" wheel for the 275 rt660 is is 10.1. Thread width on a 9.5" wheel for the v730 is 9.4 (all from tire rack). The key here is balancing heat tolerance vs feel on my heavy car

Question : should I stick with a 275 on rt660 with a wider thread width than the v730 or go for the 285 and allow more tire for heat management but probably not as stretched/sidewall stability and proper feel of the 275? Even if I go with the 275 rt660, it's still 0.5 inches wider thread width that the equivalent 275 v730.

Tire rack and Andy say go with slightly smaller stretched..but at 3400lbs. Heat management is a thing for our 15 or so min sprint races

I am not a Tire expert but agree in experience that the 30 series is TOO low. I would stick with a smaller diameter and taller height.

Rubin

[e92BMW///M3]

I run the 285/30 RT660 with a 6MT and find the gearing a bit short for my liking. And yes, the 660s do run wide in my experience compared to the RE71RS.

I know its unpopular around here but I am considering a 295/35 rear with a 295/30 front. I've seen some have used it but very little feedback provided other than the obvious that you lose the ability to rotate tires as evenly.

[roastbeef]

If you’re going to sell the car, keep the ac. It’s easy to take out, hard to put back.

[jmeenach]

Originally Posted by e92BMW///M3

I know its unpopular around here but I am considering a 295/35 rear with a 295/30 front. I've seen some have used it but very little feedback provided other than the obvious that you lose the ability to rotate tires as evenly.

I think Berns ran 30/35 staggered setup at one point. I think another issue is the additional rake it introduces to the equation, so balance of the car is impacted. But I haven't run that configuration myself, so I'm more so going off what I've heard from others.

[kolosy]

long shot, but does anyone know the size of the bolt that the bottom mount of the dash support uses? it's the one that's from the engine bay side just above the steering column. i seem to have lost it and for the life of me can't find the part on realoem.

[bipp]

Originally Posted by tsk94

285/30 is too short for these cars, imo. I don't think I'd even use 295/30 anymore, which I used to lots. I think the 275/35 on a wider wheel, which you can stretch more with more sidewall, actually performs better. YMMV

What's your take on 295/30 for DCT cars which don't run into the gearing consequence (or less so) that MT cars do?

I might still (or rather, am planning to) run it at least once on 10.5 wide just to see if I like it (and to get a bit shorter FD) but always good to hear experience from someone who tried it and went back to 275. Feels like 295/30 ECF square seems like a good tradeoff to get a bit more grip than the 275 (or minimize tradeoff of running ECF vs super 200) but still be a long lasting tire with the benefit of a equivalent shorter FD.

I like 275/35 on a 18x10.5 but if 295 provides some sort of benefit (or tradeoff, rather)...

maybe it makes sense to run a 3.45 with 275/35 rear but I think that would put me into "I don't want to do highway trips at 4000rpm" territory, so 3.15 with 295/30 might be the sweet spot for me.

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by bipp

What's your take on 295/30 for DCT cars which don't run into the gearing consequence (or less so) that MT cars do?

I might still (or rather, am planning to) run it at least once on 10.5 wide just to see if I like it (and to get a bit shorter FD) but always good to hear experience from someone who tried it and went back to 275. Feels like 295/30 ECF square seems like a good tradeoff to get a bit more grip than the 275 (or minimize tradeoff of running ECF vs super 200) but still be a long lasting tire with the benefit of a equivalent shorter FD.

I like 275/35 on a 18x10.5 but if 295 provides some sort of benefit (or tradeoff, rather)...

maybe it makes sense to run a 3.45 with 275/35 rear but I think that would put me into "I don't want to do highway trips at 4000rpm" territory, so 3.15 with 295/30 might be the sweet spot for me.

Based on rough calculations and my own experience, I'd say you're pretty much spot on. You can get similar benefits with a 3.15 FD running 295/30s.

3.15 FD + 275/35/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.3K RPM

3.15 FD + 295/30/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.4K RPM

3.62 FD + 275/35/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.8K RPM (give or take)

3.62 FD + 295/30/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.9K RPM

So yeah, 3.15 with 295/30s = shorter gearing feel without the horrendous high rpm cruising speed. For a DCT car, it’s a pretty reasonable

IMO though, stock 3.15 w/ 285/30s is GOATED. it's a bit shorter, but not enough to punish your drivability.

Especially if you live somewhere with average speeds around 55–65 MPH COUGH Irvine, CA. And by "streetable," I mean you’re not stuck with sluggish acceleration from sitting too low in the revs.

[RalliartRsX]

This is a full caged sprint race car

Comfortable highway cruising isn't a requirement

P.s it's a DCT car with a 3.15, hence why the 285 looked appealing without going 295 on a 10.5 (which in rt660 flavor, is much too wide as the section width is 11.1 or there about. Rule of thumb; match up thread width with wheel width or a wheel width slightly wider for most effective setup)

[Redd]

How are y'all running 285/295 fronts without rubbing the hell out of the fender liners?

[bipp]

Originally Posted by omgzirra_exe

Based on rough calculations and my own experience, I'd say you're pretty much spot on. You can get similar benefits with a 3.15 FD running 295/30s.

3.15 FD + 275/35/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.3K RPM

3.15 FD + 295/30/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.4K RPM

3.62 FD + 275/35/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.8K RPM (give or take)

3.62 FD + 295/30/18 @ 80 MPH in 7th = ~3.9K RPM

So yeah, 3.15 with 295/30s = shorter gearing feel without the horrendous high rpm cruising speed. For a DCT car, it’s a pretty reasonable

IMO though, stock 3.15 w/ 285/30s is GOATED. it's a bit shorter, but not enough to punish your drivability.

Especially if you live somewhere with average speeds around 55–65 MPH COUGH Irvine, CA. And by "streetable," I mean you’re not stuck with sluggish acceleration from sitting too low in the revs.

IIRC assuming stock tire size of 265/35/19, 295/30/18 would be equivalent to moving to a 3.3 FD - which should be fun to try out. I don't know if down the line, if/when I get an upgraded diff, I would swap the FD... depends on if I have a dedicated street car by then. 3.3-3.4 at 80 GPS (indicated 87 lmao...) seems about right for 3.15 and 275/35/18. Do you know off the top of your head what your RPM is for a GPS speed of 80 or so with your current 3.45 and 285/30 setup? (I think you have a 3.45, right?)

I think +200 more rpm might be liveable and worth it for track use at the risk of making the drive to THill or any long hauls down the 5 suck a bit more lol

Originally Posted by Redd

How are y'all running 285/295 fronts without rubbing the hell out of the fender liners?

I rub at 275, I just get used to it. It's worse with some tires (ECF with fat section width and narrow tread width) than some other tires (CRS with narrower section width and fatter tread width). Not sure if going to a shorter but wider tire would make it worse. Might just live with it, and whenever I next have the front shock out and can get the rear part of the fender liner relatively easily, hammer the seam and heatgun the fender liner back.

Remember that fender liners being torn to shreds is just nature's way of giving your car roastbeef holes.

[roastbeef]

Originally Posted by kolosy

long shot, but does anyone know the size of the bolt that the bottom mount of the dash support uses? it's the one that's from the engine bay side just above the steering column. i seem to have lost it and for the life of me can't find the part on realoem.

give me a day and i'll get it for you.

[tsk94]

Originally Posted by Redd

How are y'all running 285/295 fronts without rubbing the hell out of the fender liners?

I'm pretty sure the diameter plays more of a role then width for rubbing the fender liners. I know I rubbed worse with 275/35 then I did with 295/30. Assuming we're talking about rubbing in the same spot - the back lower corner of the fender liner along the frame? I took a hammer to that spot eventually...

Originally Posted by bipp

What's your take on 295/30 for DCT cars which don't run into the gearing consequence (or less so) that MT cars do?

I might still (or rather, am planning to) run it at least once on 10.5 wide just to see if I like it (and to get a bit shorter FD) but always good to hear experience from someone who tried it and went back to 275. Feels like 295/30 ECF square seems like a good tradeoff to get a bit more grip than the 275 (or minimize tradeoff of running ECF vs super 200) but still be a long lasting tire with the benefit of a equivalent shorter FD.

I like 275/35 on a 18x10.5 but if 295 provides some sort of benefit (or tradeoff, rather)...

maybe it makes sense to run a 3.45 with 275/35 rear but I think that would put me into "I don't want to do highway trips at 4000rpm" territory, so 3.15 with 295/30 might be the sweet spot for me.

I should note that my previous experience was with a manual car, with 4.10 FD. My current car I'm building is now a DCT, but haven't tracked it yet so I don't have a direct comparison.
I do agree the to a certain extent the DCT cars are likely not as affected, but I haven't compared it first hand myself like on the manual car.

I'll be testing 275 on 11" this season. I've used it plenty on a 10" before, but I expect a pretty big improvement on the 11's.

Would you really be a 4k w/ the 275/35 and 3.46? I haven't run the numbers, so I'll take your word for it.

I have a spare 3.85 FD from my manual car. Sorta tempted to throw it in the DCT Then I really couldn't go shorter on the tires!

[kolosy]

Originally Posted by roastbeef

give me a day and i'll get it for you.

The missing bolt gods smiled on me, I found it somehow. For posterity it’s an M8x40ish, and looks like this

[mikentosh]

Originally Posted by roastbeef

ok guys, hear me out- an overnight event at buttonwillow where we smoke up some brisket or pulled pork and baked beans. after the track day we all just drink whiskey and eat bbq around a bonfire and then have another track day the next day.

Count me in, if you want to get something arranged. I can also try helping with arrangements.

Most of my track schedule these days is at Thunderhill, so would be nice to switch things up.