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05-28-2007, 05:55 PM | #23 | |
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yeah, there's lots of turbo cars in pro racing...... maybe the turbodiesel audi's in the ALMS but not much else. and planes pretty much use jet engines now bike engines are so much smaller than car engines, that's the main reason they can rev so much higher, redline is determined by the max speed of the piston, and when the stroke is shorter, you can rev higher. you can't compare bike engines to car engines unless your car displaces 1 liter or less (geo metro) |
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05-28-2007, 07:25 PM | #24 | |
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Since you apparently need a history lesson, here's a few links: http://www.f1express.com/70faq.shtml#r31 http://www.f1-grandprix.com/history5.html (turbos since banned because they are too powerful) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_956 (most succesful road racer of all time) |
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05-28-2007, 07:26 PM | #25 |
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05-28-2007, 07:30 PM | #26 |
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really you have no idea why a bike can redline at 16K while cars can only rev at half that (for the most part)
you should hit the books, maybe google something and learn why a bike motor can rev so much higher. (hint, I told you why above) one thing I do like though, bikes keep getting lighter and quicker, cars just keep getting heavier |
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05-28-2007, 07:32 PM | #27 |
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i havent read most of the posts... but to add...
realistically the majority of buyers buy the car because they like the car and don't see why they have to "improve" the aesethics, sound, or performance. looking at the stock#s... the M3>335i...--haha this totally reminds me of ward (not a bad thing) if i were to buy a M3... i don't think i'd add anything more than tint...
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05-28-2007, 07:36 PM | #28 | |
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did you drive your delorean to go track that stuff down? thing have changed a bit in the last 30 years who races with a turbo NOW? besides the diesel audi's... I'm not the biggest racing enthusiast, but I can't think of any major series that includes turbo cars, if you'd like to enlighten me I'll gladly listen, but turbo's in racing (real racing not track days) seem to be very uncommon to me edit: just though, drifting and rally racing may be places to see turbo's used in racing, and oh yeah, um tractor pulls and dragsters (the top fuel/funny cars) any others though? road racing anywhere? |
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05-28-2007, 07:46 PM | #29 | |
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I suppose the forged pistons and crankshafts and titanium valves and 1 piece blocks have nothing to do with their redlines. Nah... Now to make your argument for you, you could say but yeah they only last 15-25K miles due to the extremely tight tolerances and high reving stresses. But then again at <$10K per copy... |
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05-28-2007, 07:48 PM | #30 | |
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Take way the turbo ban and next year the grid is full of turbos, guaranteed. |
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05-28-2007, 07:55 PM | #31 | |
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the speed of the piston is a major factor in how high the motor can rev in an engine with a longer stroke the piston has to travel farther per revolution, so it's traveling faster than a motor with a shorter stroke turning the same speed. shorter stroke allows bike engines to rev higher than car engines gsxr-600 Bore Stroke: 67.0 x 42.5mm (stroke about 2") 335 Bore/stroke 3.31x3.53 inch that's a big part of why the bike can rev higher, it's not that they just put expensive high quality components in the bike and it magically was able to rev to 17,000 rpms |
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05-28-2007, 09:21 PM | #32 | |
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As the guy said most series have banned turbos because it is way too easy to make a ridiculous amount of power and too hard to apply rules that limit the power. When F1 cars were making 1500hp in qualifying trim on 1.6 litre motors they decided that was enough. Cart thought they had it figured out with a maximum boost pressure until they realized the teams were blowing the intake charge across the face of the boost sensor at high velocity. There fore decreasing the pressure the sensor read and in effect cheating the system. There also aren't many series that allow active suspension, traction control, or yaw control. So, are those bad too? |
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05-29-2007, 04:25 PM | #33 |
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Lots will be sold in Calagary
There will be tons sold in Calagary. The cash in this town is sick, Bently has opened a dealership and sold 3x there expected annual sales in the first month.
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05-29-2007, 06:53 PM | #34 |
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2 things.
1. Ward I agree that it sux that cars keep getting heavier, but all the safety and "luxury" components that people like...keep adding weight 2. The thread is supposed to be about the M3 and 335i. And I thank everyone who posted on topic, I would have gotten an M3 if they hadn't stopped making them when I needed to get a car. All things considered i think it worked out awesome for me anyway. Thanks for the comments, I think the first couple years will be telling for the E9x M3. It'll probably come down to price and the people who have the money and are willing to get one. |
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05-29-2007, 07:24 PM | #35 | |
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I just realized (based on this post) that maybe the reason BMW made the 335 so fast and comparable to the M3 is so that more people will lean toward it and not the M3. This in turn would make the M3 even more exclusive and BMW will be able to charge more for them. The keyword here is "exclusive". The higher the MSRP is for the M3 and the more 335s they sell, the more exclusive the M3 becomes. |
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05-29-2007, 07:33 PM | #36 |
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Yeah...here's a good board room discussion to have. Hey boss...lets give the 335 some more power so that we can raise the price on M3s. That way we sell more 335s and make more off of the people who buy M3s. APPROVED
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05-29-2007, 08:04 PM | #37 |
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I think it was more of a way to get the older M3 owners to convert over to the more expensive/exclusive new M3. BMW has made it known over the years that they want their clients to trade up with each new car purchase, not just stay in the same series.
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05-29-2007, 08:33 PM | #38 | |
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Remember when the E46 330i came out? The performance was right around the E36 M3's. Now the 335i is right on top of the E46 M3. M3 owners are the pawns of BMW.....sometimes, they are willing pawns.
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05-29-2007, 09:07 PM | #40 |
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05-29-2007, 10:14 PM | #41 | |
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??? E46 330i vs. E36 M3 http://www.dragtimes.com/compare2.ph...ame=Compare%21 Right on top of each other. I remember I was pretty annoyed when they put a 3 series right on top of the M3....I had to get the new E46 M3. The BMW Jedi mind trick has worked on me.
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Last edited by T Bone; 05-29-2007 at 10:34 PM.. |
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05-29-2007, 10:46 PM | #42 |
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"drag times" factor in things like driver skill.
I'd rather see mag claims, or factory claims as they take the driver skill out of the equation most 0-60 on E36 M3 range from 5.4-5.7 sec E46 330 6.1 sec E90 330 was at about 6 flat as well from my brief searches |
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05-29-2007, 10:51 PM | #43 |
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0.3 seconds means it is a drivers' "race"....0.3 seconds is about the accepted gap between the 335i and the E46 M3. Improve the breed yes but M3 owners are compelled to upgrade lest a woman with big hair and Paris Hilton sunglasses beats down an unsuspecting M3 owner.
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