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01-06-2014, 02:16 PM | #67 | |
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01-06-2014, 02:21 PM | #68 | |
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01-06-2014, 02:24 PM | #69 |
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I completely agree, but at the end of the day you can only advice the customer on what do to. What he ends up doing is entirely up to him.
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01-06-2014, 02:28 PM | #70 |
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not even guna lie, ess always told me to never add boost past what they say, whenever ive approached them about modding my VT@ they've always told me not to, and ive always listened to their advice, the car is and has run perfectly since day one, OP i really feel for you BUT, you didn't listen to clear advice, sadly this has cost you, big props to ESS for helping you out further!
do kinda think it wouldn't have hurt to add the gauges in for OP BUT.... you made it clear you wouldn't install them and fair enough, its not like ess changed their mind, they always said, install gauges in russia......
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01-06-2014, 02:43 PM | #71 | |
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Makes perfect sense... |
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01-06-2014, 02:49 PM | #72 |
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We do not sell or support gauges at all, period. We recommend the EAS setup which can be sourced directly from them if the customer has no preference. The VT3 is not a "kit" or a complete solution from us. It is a prototype "À la carte" menu that is not supported or warrantied in any way. You want to buy a low compression, built motor for race use and a 14PSI pulley/fuel delivery system? We can supply it. What you do with it is entirely your own risk. Again this is not and never will be a "kit" with our approval and guarantee for normal use. It is far to complex and problem prone for that. It is specialized components for high-end racers that know what they are doing and understand the risks involved.
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01-06-2014, 03:16 PM | #73 |
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I done understand referencing ESS's negligence for Gauge install and responsibility for this guy's VT3 built motor. He picked it up before finishing, blew the motor due to no gauges. FURTHERMORE, I BET if he had gauges he would have blown the motor regardless in the process of self diagnosing and self doctoring it.
Reading comprehension and literacy get thrown by the wayside on the internet and it makes threads like these a burden to decent companies like ESS. Look at the happy SC customer to unhappy SC customer ratio. Its probably >95:1. Last edited by 325rider; 01-06-2014 at 03:44 PM.. |
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01-06-2014, 04:13 PM | #75 |
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01-06-2014, 04:22 PM | #76 | |
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You did a bunch of dyno runs without issues, op takes delivery of his car and experiences problems on his way home. I mean it seems like you'll do just about anything...from getting a used engine, to upgrading the fuel system, rebuilding the engine etc. For a customer. But installing the gauges that you think are required, that you wont do. I'm not saying ESS is liable but in good conscience if you are going to build a prototype for a long time customer please make sure you include everything you deem important for the safe operation of the engine. |
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01-06-2014, 04:33 PM | #78 |
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01-06-2014, 04:34 PM | #79 | ||
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Seems weird that critical monitoring device(s) wasn't part of the build, regardless of the excuse that the gauges aren't "supported". It could have saved the OP from damaging a 3rd motor. And who would want the bad publicity from that if all it takes is requiring proper monitoring equipment in place as part of the package? I don't get it, why agree to put together a package like this if it's technically incomplete in your eyes, especially for a repeat customer that has spent big money with you? Not hating, just a legitimate question in my mind. |
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01-06-2014, 04:38 PM | #80 | |
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Bad situation for all parties involved. |
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01-06-2014, 04:51 PM | #81 |
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Nothing against ESS, but I am surprised that they would retail the VT3 and not warranty it out (so long as the motor was built & appropriately tuned under their watchful eyes). I completely understand that the jump from bolt-on VT2 to built motor/aftermarket fueling system VT3 is a serious leap, but there will obviously be people who want to go faster (Izzy, Drew, this Russian Bro & Zim all are running VT3 setups). BUT I can complete understand & agree with ESS that it'd be very difficult to put their name on a product if someone has a non-ESS approved motor builder do the work or they crank the boost up beyond what ESS recommends with their tune.
I'm not sure how Gintani handles their low-compression/Stage 3 builds (assuming they're all built/tuned in-house), AND this isn't to start a brand war, but it's just "something to chew" on since E9x M3 prices are starting to go sub-$40k, that the people who'll be buying these cars are looking to aggressively modify them. |
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01-06-2014, 04:54 PM | #82 |
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01-06-2014, 04:55 PM | #83 |
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Side Note -- I 100% agree with whoever said that if you're adding a supercharger onto a very high-revving, aggressive motor that was never designed for FI, that you should probably have a standard set of gauges monitoring AFR (or Lambda), Fuel Pressure & Oil Pressure. Boost is a cool gauge to have, but on a centri-blower it should remain constant since psi is predetermined by pulley size.
Must be nice to have money to carelessly burn through three S65's. |
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01-06-2014, 04:59 PM | #84 |
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01-06-2014, 05:10 PM | #85 | |
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01-06-2014, 05:18 PM | #86 |
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I think gauges are a personal choice. What if the OP doesn't want the EAS gauge? I wouldn't want the EAS gauge. Nothing against that gauge because it looks like one bad ass set up. But my needs are different and I require different gauges for my set up.
I need gauges with data logging capabilities like the PLX gauges that I can download and graph later. I want them all hooked together into a unified soft gauge (just like the AWRON from EAS). But I also want a 0-5V output that can be fed into an analog A&D converter, then converted to CAN bus messages, and data logged with a Video VBox or VBox Pro. I think my needs are more demanding than what's being discussed in this thread. So $30k build or not, I don't want a vendor to tell me which gauges to use because my needs are different and more demanding. And with those increased demands come increased complexity -- another reason to go this by yourself. |
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01-06-2014, 05:20 PM | #87 | |
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01-06-2014, 05:30 PM | #88 | ||
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His 1st 2 engines experienced failures b/c dude was running more boost than the kits were designed for, plain and simple. Stop trying to surreptitiously insinuate that ESS was responsible for those failures. Last edited by whats77inaname; 01-06-2014 at 05:35 PM.. |
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