Tire Talk Megathread

[tsk94]

The goal of this thread will be to centralize all track tire related discussions. Whether it’s a street tire, 200tw tires, r-compounds, or slicks, this is the place to talk tires that will see track time.
Questions, reviews, comparisons, deals & discounts – it all goes.

We’ll see if this takes off, the idea was to consolidate tire discussions to 1 main thread, rather then being split between the general chit chat thread and numerous new threads that get posted every now and then. If it takes off, great! If not, this thread can die and we can go back to discussing this primarily in the chit chat thread as we do now, so we’ll see what happens

[tsk94]

Great resource for track tire comparisons: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...-buyers-guide/

[b4hand]

Love this. I am on 275 RS4's now and they have been great. Not as much grip as NT01's though but they're talkative and handle heat well (can still get overheated). I plan to throw a set of ECFs on your old wheels I bought from OG Shark later this year but plan to push these rs4's and learn as much as I can about driving on the limit.

[rhyary]

I will be testing the V720 305/30/19 on the rear.
I had the V720 275/35/19 on the rear and liked it.
Front is RE-71R 265/35/19 and I already know I like it.

The V720 is discontinued, but the current V730 looks very similar.

[DrFerry]

Ultimate track tire guide | 200tw, 100tw, street-legal track and R-comps

Great idea for a thread. Let's see where this goes.. Grassroots Motorsports pledged to keep their source of test data updated as new products become available.
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https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...-buyers-guide/
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Sub'd.. Figured I'd leave this Reference table information below at the start of the this thread. The Grassroots article at the link above is actually a pretty decent read. The main article contains embedded links to individual tire test articles and results data for each of the tires shown and compared in the table.
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[Gossypiboma]

I run NT01's as a track day only tire so I don't care about how loud they are or how terrible in the rain they can be. They seem to last 6-7 days, very consistent with good grip. They don't talk to you at all, but you should be able to drive by feel as well.

There seems to be a lot of NT01 haters and I don't get it. If you look at the above chart there aren't many better options if your looking for a track only tire.

Ide really like to hear feedback about the Eagle F1 3R's. I may try those next or the ECF.

[tsk94]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

Ultimate track tire guide | 200tw, 100tw, street-legal track and R-comps

Great idea for a thread. Let's see where this goes.. Grassroots Motorsports pledged to keep their source of test data updated as new products become available.
.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...-buyers-guide/
.
Sub'd.. Figured I'd leave this Reference table information below at the start of the this thread. The Grassroots article at the link above is actually a pretty decent read. The main article contains embedded links to individual tire test articles and results data for each of the tires shown and compared in the table.
.

Thanks for posting that. I have a physical copy of that sitting around, but it's a very good quick reference guide and excellent for this thread!

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by rhyary

I will be testing the V720 305/30/19 on the rear.
I had the V720 275/35/19 on the rear and liked it.
Front is RE-71R 265/35/19 and I already know I like it.

The V720 is discontinued, but the current V730 looks very similar.

V730 is more of the ACR compound.

but RE71RS are now on pre-order at tirerack...

275/35/18 for $350... per tire lmao so ECF and RE71RS will be neck and neck.

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by omgzirra_exe

V730 is more of the ACR compound.

but RE71RS are now on pre-order at tirerack...

275/35/18 for $350... per tire lmao so ECF and RE71RS will be neck and neck.

Crazy prices.
Do people really pay $350/tire? :-)

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Crazy prices.
Do people really pay $350/tire? :-)

That's cheap by some measures....
.

[omgzirra_exe]

Originally Posted by rhyary

Crazy prices.
Do people really pay $350/tire? :-)

its not bad in relative to what we have now, its slighter cheaper than A052, its supposedly slightly faster, but if it ends up being slower pace but longer then idk.

thats the real question.

[PrimeBMW]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

That's cheap by some measures....
.

I typically get about eight days out of a R7 and could probably get close to that with the A7. The limiting factor is the correct camber and it's different for each tire.

[b4hand]

Originally Posted by PrimeBMW

I typically get about eight days out of a R7 and could probably get close to that with the A7. The limiting factor is the correct camber and it's different for each tire.

What is a "day" for you?

[DrFerry]

Originally Posted by PrimeBMW

I typically get about eight days out of a R7 and could probably get close to that with the A7. The limiting factor is the correct camber and it's different for each tire.

Agreed. The R7/A7 twins use different compounds *BUT* neither is really a true radial tire in the sense of radial design. Both use a bias body ply carcass angle on the order of 45 degrees - at least they did last time I dissected one. This is sometimes referred to as a 'semi-bias' carcass design. For this reason the R7/A7 twins love more camber and operate at larger slip angles. Think; easy to drift and slide but with the added sidewall stiffness that bias ply design inherently brings. Sure it's old tech, but if your set up can dial in enough negative camber (and caster) you'll reap the rewards of fast and easy to drive with these two solutions. Keep in mind that adding as much caster as possible is desirable up to a certain point because the suspension and tire will gain camber when turning.

Now steel-belted, semi-bias ply tire wear life (worse) is a totally different topic partially because of the larger slip angle operating regime than seen with ninety degree radial carcass designs. In the old days when bias tires were king, even the F1 champs slid and drifted around while still going quickly (see image below).

In a relatively low downforce car (no ground effects), if the car isn't almost on the verge of being partially out of control all the time, then lap time is being left on the table by the driver (regardless of bias ply or radial solutions). One way to tell (for relatively low downforce cars) which drivers are going slow (other than the stopwatch) is if the tires are not "talking" in every corner then that driver is driving the tires below the limit and not on the peak of available grip (on the limit).

If the tires are screaming at you then that's too far over the limit, but being able to hear them "talk to you" - even with a helmet on - is one way to know for sure you're not leaving lap time on the table. Example: 1/10th of a second lost in every corner on a 13 corner track (say Road ATL) is 1.3 seconds lost per lap. Multiply that by 30 laps and you get 39 secs!
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[tsk94]

Originally Posted by DrFerry

That's cheap by some measures....
.

I was paying $2500/set up here for A7's.. I wish I was paying $350/tire rhyary

[derbo]

What is considered operating temperature?

1 heat cycle as I understand it is cool > operating temperature > cool.



Based on that understanding:

1 heat cycle = 1 session track day, 1 session cool.

1 heat cycle = back to back 2 sessions in trackday.


Is that correct to think this way?

[rhyary]

Originally Posted by tsk94

I was paying $2500/set up here for A7's.. I wish I was paying $350/tire rhyary

Will see if this work this season.
.

[tsk94]

I would consider a heat cycle essentially on a per session basis. Where you bring the tire up to operating temp and it cools down (not necessarily down to ambient temp).
1 session = 1 heat cycle

The only time it wouldn't apply I suppose is when you go out for a session and almost immediately go back out for another.

[e36clubracer]

My source tells me Hoosier A7s are good for 4 fast heat cycles before they start falling off. The R7s are good for 8 heat cycles before they start falling off.

A7s are good for cooler weather and ~ 20 minute or so sprints while the R7s are more durable and can go warmer weather with longer stints.

We're starting with the R7s on our e36.

[Redd]

Great thread! Here's a tough one for everyone here - I'm looking for a 200tw tire that I can take to the occasional trackday and also daily in wet weather.

I'm currently using Yokohama Advan AD08R but it's an old compound and I'd like a tire which can give me a bit more grip on track. The problem I've had with finding a replacement is that the AD08R is one of those great at nothing, but good at everything tires. Good grip, good steering feel, handles heat cycles well, wears well, usable down to the wear markers, decently low noise levels, usable in the wet and hydroplanes straight.

Know any other tires that fit that description? I don't need it to set hero laps, just need it to survive the occasional trackday without turning into a brick after some heat. I was considering the Dunlop Direzza Z3 but they don't have the sizes I need in my country.

Hankook RS4 is popular here but having driven RS2 in the past, they were super noisy and had sharp grip drop-off after 50%. Is the RS4 better in that respect?

Any suggestions will be welcome.

[Gossypiboma]

Originally Posted by Redd

Great thread! Here's a tough one for everyone here - I'm looking for a 200tw tire that I can take to the occasional trackday and also daily in wet weather.

I'm currently using Yokohama Advan AD08R but it's an old compound and I'd like a tire which can give me a bit more grip on track. The problem I've had with finding a replacement is that the AD08R is one of those great at nothing, but good at everything tires. Good grip, good steering feel, handles heat cycles well, wears well, usable down to the wear markers, decently low noise levels, usable in the wet and hydroplanes straight.

Know any other tires that fit that description? I don't need it to set hero laps, just need it to survive the occasional trackday without turning into a brick after some heat. I was considering the Dunlop Direzza Z3 but they don't have the sizes I need in my country.

Hankook RS4 is popular here but having driven RS2 in the past, they were super noisy and had sharp grip drop-off after 50%. Is the RS4 better in that respect?

Any suggestions will be welcome.

The continental ECF might be a good option to try.

[Redd]

Yeah waiting for ECF to arrive here.