[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by ScottAndrew

There are no MINI electrics or even hybrids at this point.

There is the Countryman Cooper S E All4 which is a PHEV. It is true that there is no MINI EV until next year when the Hardtop 2 Door Electric goes on sale.

And you should read some of the commentary about the UKL platform on other parts of this forum... They don't fit too well in the track car/drift/RWD/4WD/lightweight/luxury/EV that consumers are asking for.

But as he pointed out earlier (and with which I agree), the extreme sentiments you read on this forum are not reflective of the average premium vehicle buyer. We are talking about a vocal few amongst an already vocal minority of on online enthusiasts.

That being said, excitement still matters. Can it be done with global product? Yes. Both Audi and Mercedes are selling small FWD/AWD sedans in the US with a relatively high degree of success. And again these are global vehicles built on global platforms. You will even see praise for these vehicles here on BimmerPost (you will naturally see some blind hate too, yes). So it’s true that, despite the shift in US (and to a lesser degree, global) consumer tastes toward SUVs, in the premium segments, sedan sales have remained strong, including enthusiast targeted variants.

Where is BMW? They clearly dropped the ball in this regard (they will attempt to fix this next year, perhaps too little too late). They’ve also failed to develop any high performance powertrain and chassis for their small vehicle platform, which has left them woefully behind Audi and Mercedes for enthusiast mindshare. They’re now attempting to fix this too (M35i), but again too little too late with the 400hp RS3, TT RS, and the RS Q3 next up in a hot minute, making headlines. And Mercedes’ second generation AMG *45 lineup is incoming as well (mild hybrid, BTW) not to mention the *35 lineup.

So, to the extent that these particular segments and consumers still matter (and clearly there is still some value) BMW doesn’t need US specific products, they just need to not be asleep at the wheel.

Originally Posted by ScottAndrew

The Big Three do quite well making US-specific vehicles that don't really sell outside of North America (Australia and the Middle East being two other notable export markets, but where they play second fiddle to the Japanese). I am reflecting on the commentary on this forum, and the harsh reality of plummeting sales of BMW's traditional product, when I say that global products don't really work any more.

Premium is its own animal. BMW, nor any of its competitors are building a Silverado or F150 (though, yes, Tesla famously claims they will), nor an Explorer (still an “everyman” SUV, despite high trim levels) or Yukon, nor a Malibu (Fusion dead), nor for that matter Camaro or Mustang (everyone’s sports coupe).

The big three may not have much success globally in the premium segments, no, but look at the local sales. Turns out they can’t compete on their home turf either. Why? Uncompetitive products are uncompetitive. And even when you build good ones (Cadillac is trying very hard) decades of neglect are tough to reverse.

BMW on the other hand has as good a product as their counterparts. They’ve just botched the delivery. That, and, as mentioned prior, a significant portion of their target in the US is now moving to early adoption of the Next Big Thing. They have been zigging while the market zags.

Whether this strategy is through a sub-brand (a la Lexus, which was designed for the US) or separate chassis/unibody specs (a la NMS Passat) I don't know. But what I do see is BMW about to fall off the charts, and something has to give. You raise some interesting other points though, thanks.

NMS Passat will move to MQB very soon, while the Jetta already has. These are good points, but they are outliers. And they are, strictly speaking, not premium. VW is the no-frills German car, Audi is VAG's premium brand. And they are a global brand with no US specific product. US product or branding isn’t the answer. Getting it right everywhere, and then bringing that to the US is.

And Tesla’s Asia/European sales? I suspect quality woes and confidence in the company play a big role in the lack of convincing performance so far. Time will tell if that can be overcome. But if not, it won’t be country specific product that beats them. It will be the right product - something that can actually match features - from a global automaker.