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      11-18-2007, 06:31 PM   #1
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E92 M3 US curb weight 3506lb?

Has anyone seen this piece of information in R&T?

"The new 4-door body style adds about 25 lb., bringing curb weight to 3531 lb. and a tenth of a second to the coupe's 0–60-mph acceleration of 4.6 seconds."

Does this mean the curb weight for the coupe is 3506lb?

It also says the M3 will be priced over $60k.

Where are they getting all this info from? I can understand estimating the price, but they surely cannot be estimating weight given the number of significant digits on that one.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=6190
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      11-18-2007, 06:37 PM   #2
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I think they are estimating price, weight and everything like everyone else.
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      11-18-2007, 06:40 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K3N R3D View Post
I think they are estimating price, weight and everything like everyone else.
I am sure the price is an estimate given how rounded the number is. But the weight numbers are pretty specific unless they are doing a direct conversion from the Euro specs/measurements. I am wondering if they got the weight info from BMW. Were there weight specs in LA?
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      11-18-2007, 06:52 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
I am sure the price is an estimate given how rounded the number is. But the weight numbers are pretty specific unless they are doing a direct conversion from the Euro specs/measurements. I am wondering if they got the weight info from BMW. Were there weight specs in LA?
I don't know maybe someone who was there can answer for us cause I'd also like to know if this is an official weight. Anyone???
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      11-18-2007, 06:56 PM   #5
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Coupe weight

Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Has anyone seen this piece of information in R&T?

"The new 4-door body style adds about 25 lb., bringing curb weight to 3531 lb. and a tenth of a second to the coupe's 0–60-mph acceleration of 4.6 seconds."

Does this mean the curb weight for the coupe is 3506lb?

It also says the M3 will be priced over $60k.

Where are they getting all this info from? I can understand estimating the price, but they surely cannot be estimating weight given the number of significant digits on that one.
Good question--sounds optimistic, but not like a number pulled out of the air. Nearly empty of fuel it might be possible, given the following:

C&D weighed their test car @ 3,571 lb.; if the tank was half full that's about 50 lbs. of fuel. http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/d...comparo_ts.pdf

Autobild said 3,558 lb here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93409

Motor trend said, "3,500 lb. mfr's. est." here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93186.
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      11-18-2007, 07:05 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Good question--sounds optimistic, but not like a number pulled out of the air. Nearly empty of fuel it might be pssible, given the following:

C&D weighed their test car @ 3,571 lb: http://www.caranddriver.com/assets/d...comparo_ts.pdf

Autobild said 3,558 lb here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93409

Motor trend said, "3,500 lb. mfr's. est." here: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=93186.
Don't you have a standing bet on this one?
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      11-18-2007, 07:23 PM   #7
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Don't you have a standing bet on this one?
Yep, $100 over at Bimmerfest back in mid-June that it's 3,541 or under, as posted on BMWUSA.com.
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      11-18-2007, 07:39 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Yep, $100 over at Bimmerfest back in mid-June that it's 3,541 or under, as posted on BMWUSA.com.
I'd bet that you'll win the bet.
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      11-18-2007, 08:11 PM   #9
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3506lbs would cause some detractors to re-think their earlier claims.
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      11-18-2007, 08:23 PM   #10
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3506lbs would cause some detractors to re-think their earlier claims.
Spin the weight numbers anyway you would like. The E92 M3 is simply too heavy for a sports car.
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      11-18-2007, 08:26 PM   #11
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Spin the weight numbers anyway you would like. The car is simply too heavy for a sports car.
Case closed.

Furthermore, you do realize that there are sports cars out there that are heavier than 3500lbs? I assume you don't because you made that massively incorrect statement.
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      11-18-2007, 08:29 PM   #12
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The GT-R weights ~3800lb.
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      11-18-2007, 08:34 PM   #13
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Quote:
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Spin the weight numbers anyway you would like. The E92 M3 is simply too heavy for a sports car.

I am trying not to be sarcastic but the new GTR weighs well over 3500 pounds and the 997TT is about 3500 pounds....

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      11-18-2007, 08:45 PM   #14
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I am trying not to be sarcastic but the new GTR weighs well over 3500 pounds and the 997TT is about 3500 pounds....

Jason
Good point. The GTR is also too heavy but it is considerably faster than the M3. I believe the lighter variant of the GTR will also be sold in the states unlike the CSL. Hopefully I am wrong about the CSL. Do you think the E92 is too heavy?

Last edited by ruff; 11-18-2007 at 09:45 PM.
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      11-18-2007, 09:23 PM   #15
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Its heavy but with things like standard dual front and side airbags along with more safety features built into the frame, sports car made for daily use are just getting heavier.

3000lbs is light to us today but we so easily forget cars like the 78 Porsche 911 RS that weighed significantly less than 3k.

That being said, it matters to me more how the car performs than how much it weighs. I guess you can say "what if" the car was even lighter? But, we dont have that option. At least not until the CSL comes out. If there is in fact a CSL. And even then I like features like AC and HiFi Stereo so I guess in a way I am hypocrite. I really appreciate the compromise that the M3 pulls off so well. I also am nothing but tickled pink that despite all its flaws, the M3 still gets higher marks than MB and Audi... even the flawed steering is better than competitors, at least according to C&D.

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      11-18-2007, 09:58 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEllis View Post
even the flawed steering is better than competitors, at least according to C&D.
Yes, isn't that strange. They have rated M3's steering higher than the C63's and the RS4's. And that's not the only review which does so despite complaining about lack of feel.
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      11-18-2007, 10:31 PM   #17
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You're asking questions about a magazine article?
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      11-18-2007, 10:32 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Yes, isn't that strange. They have rated M3's steering higher than the C63's and the RS4's. And that's not the only review which does so despite complaining about lack of feel.
I have long held the belief that the maintstream Journalists that complain about a lack of feel are unfairly comparing the new M to the GT3 or something. Thats why I put a little more stock in the BMW only magazines where the review is focused on how the car stacks up against other BMW's instead of trying to quantify things in terms of the entire sports car universe.

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      11-18-2007, 11:43 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Yes, isn't that strange. They have rated M3's steering higher than the C63's and the RS4's. And that's not the only review which does so despite complaining about lack of feel.
C&D said the the following abut the M3:

"In the normal mode, the steering felt a bit numb, but in the sport setting, the power assist backs off and gives a bit more heft. Unfortunateely, there isn't any more feel to be had."

Maybe the Motor Trend article was another one of the higher rated M3 steering feel articles you were referring to:

"The Benz's steering is beautifully linear and nicely weighted, the best of any Mercedes."

In referring to the RS4 they state: The stearing is also more linear. As with the C63's steering, you guide the RS4 with precision and no fuss."

In referring to the M3: "The latest Servtronic system, despite its M dynamic adjustments is the weak dynamic link: It's gluey, a touch artificial in feel. Another flaw is that manual gearbox, surprisingly sticky and sometimes difficult to drive smoothly."

There are other reviews with even less bits of praise about the lack of steering feel. A few have stated the 335's steering is superior to the Servotronic version in the M3. You don't hear these kind of steering complaints about lesser BMWs.
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      11-19-2007, 12:05 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEllis View Post
I have long held the belief that the maintstream Journalists that complain about a lack of feel are unfairly comparing the new M to the GT3 or something. Thats why I put a little more stock in the BMW only magazines where the review is focused on how the car stacks up against other BMW's instead of trying to quantify things in terms of the entire sports car universe.

Jason
They are also comparing the steering feel to the Cayman's, Boxter's, C63, RS4 and Miatas and every other car they drive. I bet you don't have a problem comparing the M3's engine to these cars. How many times have we all made the ultimate comparison of Ring times to these cars. IMO, I think it is a bit of a cop out because BMW themselvs have stated in print that they compare the E92 M3 to Carreras and RS4s. It is like saying one is willing to compare a particular characteristic of the car if the M does well in that area but it shouldn't be compared in another performance characteristic if doesn't fair so well.

You think you are getting objectivity out of a BMW only magazines? The M3 needs to be put to the test against all the competition. Price will play a part in what one percieves one gets for their money. No need to be afraid to compare it to anything, even the F430 or GT3. I loved the video where they compared the M3 to the GT3. It should be taken as nothing less than the highest of compliments. No complaints from BMW enthusiasts when the F430 and M3 engines are compared to one another, now are there?
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      11-19-2007, 12:15 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ruff View Post
C&D said the the following abut the M3:

"In the normal mode, the steering felt a bit numb, but in the sport setting, the power assist backs off and gives a bit more heft. Unfortunateely, there isn't any more feel to be had."

Maybe the Motor Trend article was another one of the higher rated M3 steering feel articles you were referring to:

"The Benz's steering is beautifully linear and nicely weighted, the best of any Mercedes."

In referring to the RS4 they state: The stearing is also more linear. As with the C63's steering, you guide the RS4 with precision and no fuss."

In referring to the M3: "The latest Servtronic system, despite its M dynamic adjustments is the weak dynamic link: It's gluey, a touch artificial in feel. Another flaw is that manual gearbox, surprisingly sticky and sometimes difficult to drive smoothly."

There are other reviews with even less bits of praise about the lack of steering feel. A few have stated the 335's steering is superior to the Servotronic version in the M3. You don't hear these kind of steering complaints about lesser BMWs.
I am mainly referring to the reviews complaining about lack of feel but somehow ending up praising its performance, which is the part that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. Eastie commented on the same thing, that the car ultimately goes/steers where you want it to despite the lack of feel. I guess I'll have to drive it and find out for myself...
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      11-19-2007, 12:15 AM   #22
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I, for one, am really excited about the consistent talk of < 3600 lb curb weights for the M3. Car and Driver took it to the scales and weighed it at 3571 lbs, which I believe is with a full tank of gas. If that car had some options on it (not sure what it had other than I-drive, EDC, leather) that may be at least 40 lbs worth of extra weight, bringing the U.S. base car's curb weight in at 3530 or less.

Although not featherlight, it is not bad for the size, practicality, power, and luxury the car has to offer. For reference a GT3 weighs about 3240 lbs, so 300 lbs over that is not bad at all.

Now to find the extra 40 HP to make it have the same power to weight ratio at the GT3 . . .
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