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      03-26-2014, 11:59 AM   #23
Z K
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There are a lot of cars that don't get CPO'd. The dealer usually don't do it because of the costs. They'll CPO a car if they feel like it makes the car easier to sell. They'll generally CPO all their regular 3 series as it makes them look nicer for the buyer.

For hot sellers like the M3, they can move the car without CPO so there is no need for them to add to the cost of the car and possibly price it out of the buyer's price ranges. Not everyone wants a CPO warranty - a lot of people just want a lower price tag.
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      03-26-2014, 01:09 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by M3Captain View Post
I paid that price for a CPO car. Thats a crappy deal in my opinion.

To be honest you need to be asking why this car is not CPO. If you are buying from a dealer it should be CPO. If it is not CPO it is because they can't certify it and they are not telling you why.

If thats the case stay away.
I'm with this guy. Only reason to buy from a dealer is to get a CPO'd car. Otherwise, you are going to get a better deal from private party.

I would be suspicious if they didn't CPO the car. Typically dealers like to jack up the price, not compete for low offers on something like a used M3. Maybe there is a good reason they didn't CPO the car, maybe not. If I'm spending my money on it, I'm passing.
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      03-26-2014, 01:17 PM   #25
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I'm with this guy. Only reason to buy from a dealer is to get a CPO'd car. Otherwise, you are going to get a better deal from private party.

I would be suspicious if they didn't CPO the car. Typically dealers like to jack up the price, not compete for low offers on something like a used M3. Maybe there is a good reason they didn't CPO the car, maybe not. If I'm spending my money on it, I'm passing.

Hallelujah someone gets it!
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      03-26-2014, 01:35 PM   #26
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Are you done posting your bullshit?

I looked into the service history in over 20 different vehicles before purchasing mine. I came across several m3's at dealers that were NOT cpo. And everyone of those non-cpo vehicles we NOT cpo because the previous owners did not get their oil service done in time.

I had more information about the vehicles than the people selling the cars themselves. There is absolutely ZERO reason to not CPO a car. BMW has a stringent set of parameters that the vehicle must pass in order to CPO.
A preference is a preference. If you prefer a CPO car, then so be it.
But a dealer's reason for CPO'ing or not is strictly a business decision.

Go back to school. Business 101 and then try again.

Don't make me laugh
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      03-26-2014, 01:39 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Z K View Post
There are a lot of cars that don't get CPO'd. The dealer usually don't do it because of the costs. They'll CPO a car if they feel like it makes the car easier to sell. They'll generally CPO all their regular 3 series as it makes them look nicer for the buyer.

For hot sellers like the M3, they can move the car without CPO so there is no need for them to add to the cost of the car and possibly price it out of the buyer's price ranges. Not everyone wants a CPO warranty - a lot of people just want a lower price tag.
This.
Thank you for understanding basic economics. M3Captain, take notes!
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      03-26-2014, 01:50 PM   #28
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This.
Thank you for understanding basic economics. M3Captain, take notes!

Yes I should make business decisions based on someone's opinion. Very intelligent.
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      03-26-2014, 02:01 PM   #29
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I've heard that reason from several premium dealers. I denno, I take anything a salesman says with a grain of salt. My M wasn't CPO, but the records came back clean. I can get an extended warranty later.
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      03-26-2014, 02:09 PM   #30
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Yes I should make business decisions based on someone's opinion. Very intelligent.
Precisely why your argument is invalid; it is an opinion, a preference.

You provided the OP with nothing other than your mentality of "if its not CPO, its crap", which is false & misleading while other members have stood to correct you but to no avail.

Not here to change your opinion, but please do not mislead new buyers (i.e., the OP) with your groundless bias.

Bottom line, one can find a great used M3, with clean records, low mileage, etc., without having to pay the premium of CPO. An educated, well-informed buyer is better than one blindly taking everything the dealership offers. At the end of the day, the dealership is a business, not a charity.

Good day.
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      03-26-2014, 03:10 PM   #31
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Quote:
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So dealers don't wanna CPO a car because it costs too much? When a vehicle is CPO it raises the value of the vehicle and gives assurance to the buyer that the vehicle is covered under warranty.

Only two reasons for a car not to be CPO....

1. Vehicle is already beyond the factory warranty
2. Vehicle is not eligible for CPO thru BMW.

I hope someone like GOLFRR can contribute to this thread i think he has a little more credibility.
Funny your reasons for non-CPO changed from your last post.
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      03-26-2014, 03:21 PM   #32
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My car wasn't CPO but the records were clean and the dealer said they can CPO the car for me if I wanted to pay about $5k more for the car. No way are they going to do CPO and sell it to me for their CPO cost - they'll mark up a CPO car. They pulled the BMW records to show the CPO availability for the car and showed it qualified for CPO.

The CPO is not worth $5k to me plus I had a few years remaining on the original new car warranty.

CPO only increases the value of the car if the buyer wants CPO. Otherwise, it's a overpriced car to people who don't care about CPO.
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      03-26-2014, 03:26 PM   #33
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The BMW extended warranty is the same as CPO except a few small, insignificant nuances.

EDIT: Gah, stupid fat fingers.

In other words, you can find a non-CPO car with clean records, save yourself some interest charges and just buy an extended warranty later with cash etc.
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      03-26-2014, 03:35 PM   #34
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To the poster who said there has to be a strong business case for CPO'ing, BINGO!

Example: '11 loaded coupe comes in off lease. Good color; clean car; clean history. Needs tires; small scrape on bumper; curb rash on 2 rims. $41K wholesale buy in.

Option #1: Sell as-is for upper forty's. $8K profit.

Option #2: CPO. new tires $1.25K; fix scrape $.5K; Fix curbing >$.25K; CPO $2.5K
Total cost in car $45.5K; est sale $49K; $3.5K profit.

Why in hell would you choose option #1. "Because it adds value"? BS. It's about bottom line. The car is a widget to a dealer.
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      03-26-2014, 04:05 PM   #35
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So I had the car checked out by a relative and it's definitely as clean as advertised. Really gonna try to get the cost down some more though. Found another one that's identical in terms of options but it's a coupe with slightly higher miles (46K). Having said that, the dealer is asking for $43.5K and that includes shipping the car to my door. Much better deal!

I would certainly prefer a sedan, but it's really just for aesthetic reasons and $4K is a pretty big gap even considering that the sedan is more rare. Gonna go back to the sedan dealer and see if we can work something out, but the $47.5 was already discounted off their listed price of $48.8, so not sure how far that's gonna get me :-/
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      03-26-2014, 04:27 PM   #36
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So I had the car checked out by a relative and it's definitely as clean as advertised. Really gonna try to get the cost down some more though. Found another one that's identical in terms of options but it's a coupe with slightly higher miles (46K). Having said that, the dealer is asking for $43.5K and that includes shipping the car to my door. Much better deal!

I would certainly prefer a sedan, but it's really just for aesthetic reasons and $4K is a pretty big gap even considering that the sedan is more rare. Gonna go back to the sedan dealer and see if we can work something out, but the $47.5 was already discounted off their listed price of $48.8, so not sure how far that's gonna get me :-/

I have a MINT 2009 CPO e90 jet black w/ 6 speed I could be convinced to sell if interested
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      03-26-2014, 04:40 PM   #37
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I have a MINT 2009 CPO e90 jet black w/ 6 speed I could be convinced to sell if interested
Thanks for the offer but looking specifically for DCT instead of manual.
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      03-26-2014, 09:19 PM   #38
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by 02rusWRX View Post
So I had the car checked out by a relative and it's definitely as clean as advertised. Really gonna try to get the cost down some more though. Found another one that's identical in terms of options but it's a coupe with slightly higher miles (46K). Having said that, the dealer is asking for $43.5K and that includes shipping the car to my door. Much better deal!

I would certainly prefer a sedan, but it's really just for aesthetic reasons and $4K is a pretty big gap even considering that the sedan is more rare. Gonna go back to the sedan dealer and see if we can work something out, but the $47.5 was already discounted off their listed price of $48.8, so not sure how far that's gonna get me :-/

I have a MINT 2009 CPO e90 jet black w/ 6 speed I could be convinced to sell if interested
Where are you located? PM me.
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      03-26-2014, 09:29 PM   #39
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I recall about a year or so ago that there was a post on here from a forum member/dealer employee who claimed that BMW was recommending that dealers stop CPOing M3s. That obviously was untrue.

I once spoke with a dealer about an M3 and when I inquired as to why it was not CPO'd he responded that its break-in maintenance was not completed on time.

Not too long after I talked with a different dealer about a CPO M3 with break-in @ 3,000 miles. When I asked how the car could be CPO he claimed that the other dealer didn't know what he was talking about.

Why isn't this car CPO? Why is this one? Probably depends on the dealer or more specific variables. But it would not scare me away, the same way I wouldn't assume a CPO car will be problem and accident free.
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      03-26-2014, 09:46 PM   #40
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Don't get a coupe if you want a sedan, you'll regret it.
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      03-27-2014, 07:48 PM   #41
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It's decided, I'm getting the coupe. The sedan dealer wouldn't go below $48K which just seems overly inflated and the maintenance history did turn out to be flaky. The winner is a 1-owner, perfectly maintained. 2011 E92, Jet Black/Black Novillo extended leather package, fully loaded with Tech, Premium 2, Comfort, DCT and Competition Package with carbon roof. It's $43.5K transported to my door with 46K miles. The difference between this and the sedan will actually more than cover an extended warranty.

Needless to say, I'm pumped to join the club!
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      03-27-2014, 10:06 PM   #42
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I am in the same boat you are. I am considering picking up a coupe instead of a sedan for the availability and cost ease.
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      03-27-2014, 10:50 PM   #43
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I paid that price for a CPO car. Thats a crappy deal in my opinion.

You guys are in totally different markets. It's not a fair comparison.


Anyway, my two cents is to wait for what you want. Don't settle. I had to wait a while and move very quickly when a white sedan with ZCP finally popped up.
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      03-28-2014, 11:50 AM   #44
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So dealers don't wanna CPO a car because it costs too much?
Yes, that is THE most important reason - the cost of the CPO process.

The cost involves -
- internal inspection. This is a formal, corporate checklist several pages long, involving much time and several workstations. The cost is carried as hours + materials. If the car is "perfect" the booked cost will run anywhere from $1700 - $3000 depending upon the car.
- condition of car. If there is no work to be done and materials to be consumed, then obviously the CPO cost is lower and probably worth doing. BUT - even if one tire needs to be replaced in order to meet CPO specs, the decision may well be made to not spend the few hundred dollars for the tire.
- model of car and market. A fully-loaded car can support a CPO cost where a stripped model often cannot. A hot M market can support a CPO cost where a slow 3 series market cannot. A car with 30k miles left on the warranty can support a CPO cost where a model with only 10k left cannot.

The decision to not certify a car does NOT mean that car is necessarily inferior to a CPO car. The certification process is mostly a market-based business decision. Most good dealers would not knowingly sell a used BMW car that had apparent flaws making it ineligible for certification solely on that basis.

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Only two reasons for a car not to be CPO....
1. Vehicle is already beyond the factory warranty
2. Vehicle is not eligible for CPO thru BMW.
No, for reasons above. Conversely, there are many cars that are eligible for certification that meet those two criteria that do not receive it.

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BMW Dealers don't like to CPO the car due to additional costs to them. Typical costs to dealers are about $2400 and they add $3000 to the buyer's purchase price ($600 profit). It's simply do they want to put in the additional costs into the car? That's up to the dealer.
Correct, although I might quibble with the exact dollars.

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Go back to school. Business 101 and then try again.
A bit abrupt ... but a valid suggestion.

One more note - the CPO warranty that kicks in after the original 50k warranty is not quite the same as the original warranty. A buyer may well decide that the added cost for CPO status may not be in his/her best interests compared to an extended warranty. That would be a ... business decision.

(reference - yes, I have seen CPO requirements, pages, checklists, cost figures, etc., and spoken directly with SA's, service techs, etc.)
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