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      12-19-2013, 12:24 PM   #1
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Texas Trifecta II March 21-23 Circuit of the Americas

The Houston, Lone Star and Tejas Chapters of the BMWCCA are proud to announce the opening of TIER 1 registration for the Texas Trifecta 2014 at The Circuit of the Americas. Our second event at this premier venue will be held March 21-22-23, 2014. Registration is on www.MotorsportReg.com. Remember, you MUST join BMWCCA to register.
TIER 1 registration will open at 8:00 am on Thursday, December 19th and will run through 11:59 pm (midnight) on Thursday, December 26th.
TIER 2 registrations will then open to a larger group of drivers at 8:00 am on Friday, December 27th.
TIER 3 registrations will open on January 4th.
Event Fees
  • HPDE (Friday, Saturday and/or Sunday) - you may chose one, two or three days at $325 per day - options depend on the offerings at each tier
  • TIER 1 & 2 entries/registration options will include Friday (as a single Day) for $325, or two-day packages (Friday + Saturday, Friday + Sunday (for autocrossers) or Saturday + Sunday) for $650
  • Single-day a la carte registrations will not be offered until Tier 3 registration opens
  • Autocross - Saturday only: $55
  • Hill Country Drive, or Rally (TBD) - more info to be published on the Texas Trifecta website at http://texastrifecta.com as this event option is finalized.
  • NOTE: If you choose to compete in the Autocross on Saturday you can NOT register for and participate in the Driving School on that same day.
Plan to get your registration in as soon as possible as this event will SELL OUT. The direct link to the registration is: http://msreg.com/TexasTrifecta14

A complete set of guidelines and rules are listed on the site. As noted on the event registration site, garages and/or individual garage spaces are available for rental at: http://msreg.com/Trifecta14Garages

If you have any questions please contact shodges883@gmail.com, or our event registrars at LSC.BMWCCA.Registrar@gmail.com.

We will soon be posting event information on the event website at http://texastrifecta.com. Please check that website regularly for updated event information as we get closer to the event date. See you at COTA!

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      12-19-2013, 11:54 PM   #2
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I can't make this one...already committed to Driver's Edge. But a LOT cheaper than the other event right now!
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      12-20-2013, 08:53 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976
I can't make this one...already committed to Driver's Edge. But a LOT cheaper than the other event right now!
But huge difference in track time. The other group is 3 full days with only 4 run groups of 35 max cars per group.
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      12-20-2013, 09:43 AM   #4
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Last year there were very few cars on Sunday....blew up, tires, brakes...not to mention the drivers getting smoked.

Trust me...this event will be run WAAAAAYYYYYY better. We can talk offline if you want.
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      12-20-2013, 03:52 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
I can't make this one...already committed to Driver's Edge. But a LOT cheaper than the other event right now!
the other event that doesnt actually exist. ? there are CALLOUT type postings for an MVP event..


Also. you may want to do a " discount double check" on that TDE schedule... i believe your weekend is now free..
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      12-20-2013, 05:31 PM   #6
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No convertibles.




- V


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      12-20-2013, 09:03 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
the other event that doesnt actually exist. ? there are CALLOUT type postings for an MVP event..
...so I've heard but no comment from me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Also. you may want to do a " discount double check" on that TDE schedule... i believe your weekend is now free..
You mean...the "discount dabble check?" PM sent
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      12-24-2013, 12:31 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by VMcV3y View Post
No convertibles.




- V


.

I have no issues with convertibles.. with two in my household until recently and I have actually been 140 mph on a race track with " the wind in my hair" while riding in the passenger seat of a Boxster S. Afterwards, I thought to myself.. that probably isnt something I want to do often. Unfortunately, our club rules prevent convertibles that do not have roll cages... and I am very much against the rule... however... if the option were given to me (as CDI of my own events) to offer convertibles, I would allow them at MSR Cresson, Harris Hill, MSR Houston, and the lower run groups at ECR and perhaps TWS. That would allow people that purchased convertibles to experience their car in a DE environment. However.. I would NOT be for convertibles in the highest run groups and
I would NOT want convertibles at COTA. I can easily hit 150 mph in my stock 1M on the back straight... .. a speed that your E93 M3 can also easily attain. Having previously owned a dedicated track car, which I sold to purchase my curreny vehicle, I already question the sanity of being in my CLOSED roof vehicle at 150 mph without additional safety equipment like a dedicated race seat, harnesses or roll cage, not to mention things like a HANS system. Being in an open top vehicle at 100 mph speeds is not a great decision in my opinion. If you do seek a group to run with.. I hope that in time you come to agree with this as well and purchase a closed roof vehicle.
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      12-26-2013, 09:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
I have no issues with convertibles.. with two in my household until recently and I have actually been 140 mph on a race track with " the wind in my hair" while riding in the passenger seat of a Boxster S. Afterwards, I thought to myself.. that probably isnt something I want to do often. Unfortunately, our club rules prevent convertibles that do not have roll cages... and I am very much against the rule... however... if the option were given to me (as CDI of my own events) to offer convertibles, I would allow them at MSR Cresson, Harris Hill, MSR Houston, and the lower run groups at ECR and perhaps TWS. That would allow people that purchased convertibles to experience their car in a DE environment. However.. I would NOT be for convertibles in the highest run groups and
I would NOT want convertibles at COTA. I can easily hit 150 mph in my stock 1M on the back straight... .. a speed that your E93 M3 can also easily attain. I already question the sanity of being in my CLOSED roof vehicle at 150 mph with harnessese or roll cage. Being in an open time vehicle at such a speed is not a great decision in my oponion. If you do seek a group to run with.. I hope that in time you come to agree with this as well and purchase a closed roof vehicle.

I appreciate the thoughtful response you wrote. Thank you.

First, a question, and then my comments: if I had a roll-cage installed, then my car would be eligible?

Now, on to my response:

My issue with the convertible ban is that this is a BMW-produced, modern vehicle -- yet the BMW organization in the United States prohibits them. In other words, I could operate a 320i sedan at COTA, with 16" wheels and standard-OEM brakes. This inconsistency is irritating and defies any semblance of safety logic.

I'll attach two pictures of non-closed vehicles that are allowed worldwide on racetracks. In the smaller of the two vehicles, I've had that up to 166 mph on a track and was 100% within the guidelines. I had all of the required safety equipment, which did not include a rollbar, harness, fire extinguisher, nor ABS. The larger vehicle (red and white), is a convertible but has four wheels instead of two.

I purchased my M3 Convertible because it is a high performance vehicle. None of the brochures from BWM ///M had an * that read "It's got our safest technology, but you can't use it at BMW-oriented events in the USA -- sorry, sukka!"

Finally, I would like to know if there is actual historical data that conclusively shows that the intensity of injuries/fatalities is greater in a convertible at 150+ than in a closed-top. At 150 mph in a closed non-vert vehicle, a roll-over is likely to be fatal.

Anyhow, I will continue to vote against all of the incumbents until the BMWCCA Board of Directors approves BMW convertibles in at least some fashion for use. (i.e. Allow closed-only-mode on convertibles equipped with ROPS.)

Thanks again.

- V

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      12-27-2013, 12:10 AM   #10
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first you can't make the comparison between professional racing and HPDE's. There is a certain etiquette and generally expected behavior in BMWCCA DE's which the national organization expects. Racers still put themselves at considerable risk ...they get paid to do so. That is not an expectation of a HPDE.

I do believe the no convertible rule is an insurance requirement. which is interesting because most other organizations don't have these strict rules. I did see a guy in a Cobra replica not allowed to drive at a DE. I would think that a hard top would work but just curious as to the reason behind that. Understand the issue with soft tops.
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      12-27-2013, 11:56 AM   #11
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Does Tier 2 registration open today? On the main page (http://msreg.com/TexasTrifecta14) it still shows as "closed".

Also, for Tier 2 do you need an email invitation? I thought is was open to all memmber of the three chapters. I was going to register today, but the registration link states:


"Drivers who are eligible for TIER 1 or TIER 2 registration will receive email invitations. These drivers are drawn from those who have supported us by participating in BMWCCA Texas Region Driving schools within the past year and members of the three Texas Region BMWCCA chapters."

I am in the Houston chapter but I did not get an email.
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      12-28-2013, 01:03 PM   #12
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Did you attend a Texas region track day?
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      12-28-2013, 06:32 PM   #13
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The convertible rule is in place due to the being no data the car manufacturers have to provide to the NHTSA to substantiate that the convertibles have the same rollover safety as a tin top. Won't ever see it so you won't see them being allowed at a BMW CCA event. DEs create risk exposure that could cause the entire CCA to be in jeopardy if something were to happen. Doesn't take much in our litigious society to win a case. You can say "I would never sue if something were to happen", but can you say that about your surviving spouse?
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      12-30-2013, 06:10 PM   #14
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Does Tier 2 registration open today? On the main page (http://msreg.com/TexasTrifecta14) it still shows as "closed".

Also, for Tier 2 do you need an email invitation? I thought is was open to all memmber of the three chapters. I was going to register today, but the registration link states:


"Drivers who are eligible for TIER 1 or TIER 2 registration will receive email invitations. These drivers are drawn from those who have supported us by participating in BMWCCA Texas Region Driving schools within the past year and members of the three Texas Region BMWCCA chapters."

I am in the Houston chapter but I did not get an email.

if you attended the trifecta last year, you should have received an email from the registrar via motorsport reg.

An email to the entire general houston chapter would have to be generated from a Houston Chapter social chair. It is my understanding that copy was forwarded from the DE chair to all three chapters socal chairs for distribution. In order to determine why you did not receive an email from the chapter, first confirm that the email address for you on file with BMWCCA.ORG is your current correct address. Then, contact your chapter social chair to determine if the email was forwarded.

PS. IMPORTANT NOTE! ** Receipt of the email is NOT required for you to register. *** Registration is now open for all current members of the 3 texas chapters (Lonestar, Tejas and Houston). The Trifecta registars are closely reviewing each entry to confirm that the individual is tier 1, tier 2, tier 3 etc before processing the event registration.
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      12-30-2013, 06:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMcV3y View Post

I'll attach two pictures of non-closed vehicles that are allowed worldwide on racetracks. In the smaller of the two vehicles, I've had that up to 166 mph on a track and was 100% within the guidelines. I had all of the required safety equipment, which did not include a rollbar, harness, fire extinguisher, nor ABS. The larger vehicle (red and white), is a convertible but has four wheels instead of two.

.

Both of the vehicles above (Honda Sport bike and Mercedes Vodaphone F1 chassis) are not allowed at BMW CCA HPDE events. We do not allow TWO wheeled vehicles at all. Perhaps check with https://bmwmoa.org/ .

I'm still looking for the roof on the larger , red and white " convertible"... perhaps a grid girl walked off with the Umbrella that covers the driver on the grid..? We do not allow OPEN WHEEL racecars either... so leave the retired March Cosworth chassis, SRF, and Formula Ford at home. And. while we are at it... Here's your sign.....

now that I have addresed the *ridonkulous and inane* part of your reply.. I will provide further explanation to your questions shortly. I actually crafted a nice reply and it got nuked when my log in timed out.. sigh...
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      12-30-2013, 08:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
first you can't make the comparison between professional racing and HPDE's. There is a certain etiquette and generally expected behavior in BMWCCA DE's which the national organization expects. Racers still put themselves at considerable risk ...they get paid to do so. That is not an expectation of a HPDE.

I do believe the no convertible rule is an insurance requirement. which is interesting because most other organizations don't have these strict rules. I did see a guy in a Cobra replica not allowed to drive at a DE. I would think that a hard top would work but just curious as to the reason behind that. Understand the issue with soft tops.

Agree! thanks for returning us to the real world! Indeed... racing and HPDE events are apples and oranges. Death is an INEVITABLE (defn: certain to happen; unavoidable ) risk as a consequence of racing. I would imagine that none of us would anticipate death as a LIKELY consequence of participating in a DE... although we do understand that risk is certainly possible.


With respect to insurance.... it is my understanding that the decision to not allow convertibles without a roll bar or roll cage is solely that of the BMW CCA Board of Driving Events Coordinators (DEC), which reports to and makes recommendations to the BMW CCA Board of Directors. Since the policy that BMW CCA uses to insure events is provided by a company that also provides coverage for other organizations that DO allow convertibles, I would have to say that the insurance company or policy is not the root cause at all.

That said... it *may* be possible that BMW CCA is able to negotiate a more advantageous rate with said insurer, because of the convertible restrictions in place.. but that is merely conjecture. I have no idea. to be perfectly honest, I actually rather doubt that is the case anyway.. but it may be a factor.
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      12-30-2013, 08:25 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMcV3y View Post
I appreciate the thoughtful response you wrote. Thank you.

First, a question, and then my comments: if I had a roll-cage installed, then my car would be eligible?

Now, on to my response:

My issue with the convertible ban is that this is a BMW-produced, modern vehicle -- yet the BMW organization in the United States prohibits them. In other words, I could operate a 320i sedan at COTA, with 16" wheels and standard-OEM brakes. This inconsistency is irritating and defies any semblance of safety logic.


I purchased my M3 Convertible because it is a high performance vehicle. None of the brochures from BWM ///M had an * that read "It's got our safest technology, but you can't use it at BMW-oriented events in the USA -- sorry, sukka!"

Finally, I would like to know if there is actual historical data that conclusively shows that the intensity of injuries/fatalities is greater in a convertible at 150+ than in a closed-top. At 150 mph in a closed non-vert vehicle, a roll-over is likely to be fatal.

Anyhow, I will continue to vote against all of the incumbents until the BMWCCA Board of Directors approves BMW convertibles in at least some fashion for use. (i.e. Allow closed-only-mode on convertibles equipped with ROPS.)

Thanks again.

- V

.


Sure! ... more thoughtful answers on the way!

First... YES, if you had a roll cage installed in your vehicle, it would be permitted. We have many drivers of Spec Miatas and Spec Boxsters that have roll cages that attend our events.

Second.. Could you bring a 320i with 16" wheels and standard brakes.. ? Well of course!.. it has a roof!

Let's move on to your BMW convertible. None of the materials that came with or advertised alongside about your vehicle EVER referred to BMW CCA. If you think they did .... well then YOU are the only SUKKA... The reason for this is that BMW CCA is NOT OWNED, NOR OPERATED by BMW North America (BMW NA). They are separate entities.

So.. the fact that BMW NA makes a cool " high peformance vehicle " like your M3... has ZERO relation to the club and it's decision on whether or not to permit said vehicle at certain club events. NOTE that BMW NA makes NO promoises to owners about their safety while in a convertible, with respect to rollover protection... do they?

Consider this.... if you go 140 mph down a US highway, and then crash and roll your convertible, are injured, and then sue the manufacturer due to inadequate rollover protection..... What will happen? The suit will likely not even make it to a judge.. however.. even it it gets to a jury... BMW NA lawyers would of course argue that they sell convertibles that are designed to be used at US highway speeds, and of course that the vehicle meets all the requirements of the US DOT laws. They would never imagine that someone would drive the vehicle at 140 mph... and of course.. anyone doing so would of course have to be a crazy mother sukka! Undoubtedly.. you as the driver would be considered GROSSLY negligent for operating the vehicle above the posted limits. Negligence would be imputed to the driver, not the manufacturer.

now.. if you take the same vehicle... And then enter it in an HPDE... And you drive the same 140 mph and then lose control of the vehicle and crash and are injured, and you claim that the vehicle did not have adequate rollover protection... a jury certainly might end up hearing the case that the club organized an event in which it was known or assumed that you would exceed the speed limits in a vehicle without a roof. liability COULD be imputed to the club for creating an environment where one can go 140 mph in a convertible.

Or... what if you crashed the vehicle in a rollover... and an INSTRUCTOR in the vehicle died. What if the family of that instructor then sued the club and YOU respectively for gross negligence by providing an event and participating in an event where people drive around in a vehicle without a roof? Do you think the jury might possibly feel sorry for the family of that instructor (particularly any children that would now be missing a parent) and potentially award them hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars?


Were you aware of the following data point? Although rollover crashes constitute just three percent of all American accidents, they account for almost half of all fatalities.

Do you see the difference in liability between the manufacturer producing the vehicle and an organization running an event where the vehicle can be driven at supra-legal speeds?

For more information than you ever wanted to know on rollovers....

http://www.nhtsa.gov/Cars/rules/ruli...nce/index.html

Now.. then... the question we all want to know is WHY did BMW CCAs Board even begin to separate convertibles from other vehicles... perhaps because my comments above. And while we are at it.. Let's look at US Federal motor Vehicle roof crush standards..

http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...px?reg=571.216

S1. Scope. This standard establishes strength requirements for the passenger compartment roof.
S2. Purpose. The purpose of this standard is to reduce deaths and injuries due to the crushing of the roof into the occupant compartment in rollover crashes.
S3. Application. (a) This standard applies to passenger cars, and to multipurpose passenger vehicles, trucks and buses with a GVWR of 2,722 kilograms (6,000 pounds) or less. However, it does not apply to—
(a) School buses;
(b) Vehicles that conform to the rollover test requirements (S5.3) of Standard No. 208 (571.208) by means that require no action by vehicle occupants;
(c) Convertibles, except for optional compliance with the standard as an alternative to the rollover test requirements in S5.3 of Standard No. 208; or
(d) Vehicles certified to comply with 571.216a.

The US DOT neatly *sidesteps* the issue of rollover protection in convertibles by simply EXEMPTING such vehicles from any tests... There is an OPTIONAL test... but what manufacturers do you think run that test.... yeah... me either.. So.. unfortunately... while all of us in the REAL word realize that not having a roof over your head should a vehicle crash is not a good thing.... the government actually ignores the issue.

the following article might given an idea why.... (can you say.... lobbyists?)

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/200...ush-standards/

So.. with no guidance from DOT... and knowing what happens in the REAL WORLD.. the BMW CCA voted to install guidelines to protect participants in DE and CR from rollover injuries. They have opted to NOT overlook the issue of the lack of rollover protection, like the government and many other organizations have done.

That said.. the main issue that I have with the BMW CCA DEC convertible guidelines is that they have not changed, as vehicle design has changed. Certainly a vehicle with a folding mechanical roof like on the E90 provides better protection than a soft top from a 1983... however BMW CCA DEC continues to list any vehicle with a roof that raises and lowers as the same " convertible" regardless of it's construction. They indicate that they are waiting for better guidence from the US DOT with respect to data, laws etc before making any changes to their guidelines. Clearly however.. no such guidance is forthcoming...

Finally... the question of ...... How often do rollovers even occur in a DE? I don't know about you... but I have been to a LOT of events... and i don't see rollovers very often at all, if ever... Looking at the above stat that a rollover occurs in only THREE percent of all vehicle crashes... and seeing that vehicle crashes within a DE environment THEMSLEVES are a rarity... .. why all the concern about rollovers? This is where I belive the club does take this issue too far. It is clear that many (other) organizations have reviewed their own data on DE losses and rollovers and likely determined that the likelihood of both a rollover occurring, along with serious injury/death.. and then a lawsuit on top of all that...( particularly with the knowledge that waivers are in place and signed by drivers and instructors) is small enough that they would rather allow patrons to use convertibles instead of sending their own members away. Perhaps there are better convertible lobbyists in other organizations?

It would be nice if the BMW CCA DEC board would come to a similar conclusion.. or at the least.. as I presented previously... a way in which convertible owners are at least able to begin attending events without having to hack up a car to put a cage in it. Since they have not done so... I FULLY support you making your voice heard by writing to the board and also voting off said members The only way to get this to change is by supporting and voting convertible friendly reps ONTO the BMW CCA DEC board and the Board of Directors.... Not an easy proposition......
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Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 12-30-2013 at 09:47 PM.
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      12-30-2013, 09:52 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Sure! ... more thoughtful answers on the way!

First... YES, if you had a roll cage installed in your vehicle, it would be permitted. We have many drivers of Spec Miatas and Spec Boxsters that have roll cages that attend our events.

Second.. Could you bring a 320i with 16" wheels and standard brakes.. ? Well of course!.. it has a roof!

Let's move on to your BMW convertible.
<snipped>
Well, that's awesome. Hitting the "print" button to save this.

I'll read it a few more times.

Thank you.

- V

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      12-31-2013, 05:32 PM   #19
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This thread has taken an interesting turn...

I'm registered, see y'all there on Friday.
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      01-10-2014, 01:14 AM   #20
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Be lucky you're not trying to drive a mini at a PCA event...banned - but they do allow convertibles.
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      01-10-2014, 11:13 AM   #21
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Why are Mini's banned from PCA events? That's interesting.

1st post here. I picked up an E92 M3 recently and am going to try and make it out to this event. I'm a transplant from the Southeast. I'll also be at the MVP event in Feb. at COTA if anyone else is going to be there. Looking forward to meeting you guys.
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      01-10-2014, 09:46 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Dalton
Why are Mini's banned from PCA events? That's interesting.

1st post here. I picked up an E92 M3 recently and am going to try and make it out to this event. I'm a transplant from the Southeast. I'll also be at the MVP event in Feb. at COTA if anyone else is going to be there. Looking forward to meeting you guys.
One very bad accident at a PCA event around here back in 2006. Guy got hurt pretty bad. Knee jerk reaction. I'd rather be in a mini than an E46 m3 vert that rolls over a few times. Funny how hypocritical some DE groups are about some cars but not others. There is not much method to their madness.
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