BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > M3 (E90 / E92 / E93) > General M3 Forum (E90 + E92 + E93)
 
OneEighty
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      10-06-2007, 10:40 PM   #23
pharding
Captain
United_States
26
Rep
880
Posts

 
Drives: '11 550i + '14 X3 28i
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

When I did Euro Delivery on August 2. I saw many white M3's in the lot without the decals. I wondered where are they destined. Someone told that they were for journalists. It looks like this was the destination.
__________________
14 550i Euro Del
14 X3
11 550i Euro Del
Retired: 08 550i Euro Del; 06 330i Euro Del; 04 545i Euro Del; 01 530i Euro Del
Appreciate 0
      10-07-2007, 03:01 AM   #24
southlight
Moderator / European Editor
southlight's Avatar
607
Rep
6,748
Posts

 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PIMP "E" View Post
thats real nice. what do you do?? hell, i live in germany and i cant get into these type of events. who do you have to go through to get in this event?
ide like to test the M3 on the nurburger ring.
There is a offer on the german BMW site: M3 Driving Experience, 2 days with the M3 on the Nürburgring F1 track. Takes place on 8th/9th of Oct. aswell as on 9th/10th of Oct. (quite soon). At the cost of 1.200 € + VAT...
You can find that on the news section of bmw.de
EDIT: Oops, I see the time for applications was till Oct. 1st...

Best regards, south
Appreciate 0
      10-07-2007, 04:56 AM   #25
ILC32
Lieutenant
ILC32's Avatar
18
Rep
580
Posts

 
Drives: 1993 Porsche RSA
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Pics from second post. . .

more photos added to:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...46#post1503146
Appreciate 0
      10-07-2007, 10:25 AM   #26
Epacy
Reincarnated
Epacy's Avatar
88
Rep
4,227
Posts

 
Drives: 02 Maxima SE
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: IL

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 M3  [0.00]
Awesome experience. Thanks for sharing.


That camera rig on the red M3 is extensive.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      10-07-2007, 03:02 PM   #27
Jason
Administrator
Jason's Avatar
United_States
6749
Rep
16,680
Posts

 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: USA

iTrader: (0)

Thanks for sharing!
__________________
Check on the Latest BMW News
Become a fan of Bimmerpost Facebook
Follow us on Bimmerpost Twitter
Subscribe to Bimmerpost Youtube Channel

Appreciate 0
      10-08-2007, 04:28 PM   #28
ILC32
Lieutenant
ILC32's Avatar
18
Rep
580
Posts

 
Drives: 1993 Porsche RSA
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Final Thoughts

Final thoughts:

As to the car itself:

I am convinced EDC is worth the cost. The M test drivers I spoke to all told me the fastest times on the Nordschleife were achieved with EDC in normal mode. I was also told by the suspension and kinematics engineer that "sport" on EDC is a bit of a misnomer. He stated that a more appropriate name for that setting would be "conventional". . .

The steering feel was worthy of an M3. I have read the reviews indicating the steering is lacking in feel, and I simply disagree. Also, I love the quicker steering rack as compared to my non competition package E46 M3.

The car handles very, very well. It feels planted and the grip actually surprised me.

M Track mode is a viable mode for track use, at least for drivers (like me) with less than top-level skills. It allows a good amount of slip and rotation while still keeping the 414 hp on the track on the limit.

The motor is a real masterpiece. It pulls hard to redline, and the torque starts down low. As a bonus, the sound is phenomenal.

I had no issues with the brakes, even after repeated laps in the unseasonably warm weather we had. Yes, they squealed, and yes, "sport" pads were fitted. We were told the pads can be obtained through the dealer. Great bite even when cold, very effective even after sustained use. When I get my own car (not even ordered yet as I am in the US) I will have the pads fitted despite the noise.

As to the M testing center:

It was a real treat to see this facility and meet the person responsible for the suspension of all M3 cars since the beginning. We saw a presentation of some of the data captured during testing on the Nordshleife, and the amount of data captured and interpreted blew me away. I knew in the abstract that the car computes a lot of data to run its various systems (DSC, EDC, ABS, etc.) but to see even a part of what is being measured and evaluated was a real eye-opener.

As to the Nordshleife:

As I reported earlier, we were all taken on a lap of the ring in an E92 M3 by an M3 development driver or Fahrer Training instructor. The lap was the most memorable part of the trip for me. I have driven on tracks before in my own M3 and it was certainly thrilling to drive the E92 on the GP circuit. But the ride I had on the Ring was out of this world. The car control my driver had, and the speed we were going, left me laughing in disbelief. The ring is really not comparable to any other track, and to see someone who really knows how to drive piloting the M3 with such skill and speed, made me realize that the performance envelope of the car far exceeds my own capabilities as a driver.

Thoughts about BMW and M:

Reflecting back on the trip, I have a new appreciation for BMW and M. The passion its people have for performance in general and the M3 in particular was incredible. It was really eye-opening to see how important the ring is to M and to the development of M cars. Experiencing first hand the skill of the M testing/development driver on the ring, honed over thousands of laps, made me realize how seriously M takes ring testing as a part of the car development process. I think M's presence at the ring, and its extensive use of the ring to tune M cars, sets it apart from most other manufacturers, including competitors building cars often compared to the M3 on this forum.

Finally, let me respond to questions raised by a few of you about my job, how I got to attend this program, and whether I attended at BMW's expense. I am a fan of M cars. I am not a journalist, and I do not work for BMW. I was invited to attend the program by virtue of a friendship I developed with an upper-level contact at BMWNA as a result of my interest in the new M3. I met others there who were invited because of their participation in various BMW driver training schools, such as the Advanced M School. It is my understanding that all program participants (including me) paid the same fairly substantial fee to attend the program, and paid their own travel expenses as well.
Appreciate 0
      10-08-2007, 06:09 PM   #29
savage.ulm1
First Lieutenant
savage.ulm1's Avatar
Italy
25
Rep
398
Posts

 
Drives: M3 E92
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Italy

iTrader: (0)

[quote=ILC32;1509773]

As to the Nordshleife:

As I reported earlier, we were all taken on a lap of the ring in an E92 M3 by an M3 development driver or Fahrer Training instructor. The lap was the most memorable part of the trip for me.

My thanks for this full report. I feel that this report will help most of us to remember the value of "those" unknown and passionate people working at M company.
Anyway, did you get any info about the RING official times? any rumors?

thanks
Appreciate 0
      10-08-2007, 06:46 PM   #30
swamp2
Lieutenant General
swamp2's Avatar
United_States
214
Rep
10,201
Posts

 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Diego, CA USA

iTrader: (1)

Thanks ILC32

Great thread and conclusion post. Good idea to post about how you got to attend as well. I'm sure many were curious.

-I agree about the level of data and testing. Most folks have no idea the level of detail that goes into testing of a sophisticated car like the M3 and the amount of information collected.

-Like we have been hearing, you confirm again that Sport mode on EDC is simply a passive suspension mode with no active electronics intervening. I like the idea that the mode is present but most of us will likely never need it.

-Last - nice humble comments about your own driving ability. I am right with you. These folks who can really work magic in this car (or even an old 2002) are so far beyond 99.9% of us fans. At the same time I have no problem owning a car beyond my ability.
Appreciate 0
      10-08-2007, 07:19 PM   #31
Epacy
Reincarnated
Epacy's Avatar
88
Rep
4,227
Posts

 
Drives: 02 Maxima SE
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: IL

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2008 M3  [0.00]
Very nice. Thanks ILC32.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      10-08-2007, 11:53 PM   #32
Bennu
Colonel
Bennu's Avatar
United_States
33
Rep
2,257
Posts

 
Drives: BMW Coupe
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: West Palm Beach

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW/M235i  [0.00]
OMG thanx for the write up. Another amazing experience I've read in just 30 min. I am so wanting this car right now.

Cheers!
__________________
------------------------------------------------
Lack of money is not the problem. It is merely a symptom of what's going on inside of you! - T Harv Eker

Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 12:32 AM   #33
shiggy
Major
shiggy's Avatar
Canada
26
Rep
1,305
Posts

 
Drives: BMW 2009 M3
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: vancouver

iTrader: (2)

fantastic write up....best post on this site yet!...
thanks for taking the time you put into this write up and sharing your experience...i for one dream of taking a lap around the "Ring" and although it may not come true, your level of enthusiasm, detail and passion brought me there for a brief moment!
cheers, shiggy
__________________
2009 Jet Black E92 M3, DCT, Nav, Novillo Leather, PDC, EDC, BBS CHR's 20", Yokohama Advan Sports Tires, Eiback Pro-Kit Springs, Dinan Pullies and Dinan Stage1 software, black grills, black side gills, alcantara shift and ebrake boot.
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 01:47 AM   #34
PIMP "E"
Colonel
PIMP "E"'s Avatar
Germany
35
Rep
2,495
Posts

 
Drives: AW 2011 M3
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: ft. lauderdale fl, in mannheim germany

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2011 M3  [0.00]
Send a message via AIM to PIMP "E"
Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
There is a offer on the german BMW site: M3 Driving Experience, 2 days with the M3 on the Nürburgring F1 track. Takes place on 8th/9th of Oct. aswell as on 9th/10th of Oct. (quite soon). At the cost of 1.200 € + VAT...
You can find that on the news section of bmw.de
EDIT: Oops, I see the time for applications was till Oct. 1st...

Best regards, south
Thanks alot, thats is a little bit pricy just to drive around the little track. Right now im stuck in the desert so i guess the end of next year when i pick my ///M3 up, im going to make it a road trip to the ring. This will give me planty of time to plan it all out. One thing my german friend said is when you buy a BMW from a german dealer the whole event is free. So i have to get info on that. If anything good comes out i will post.
__________________
MONEY IS THE SAIL TO MY BOAT
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 03:25 AM   #35
Stahlgrau
Second Lieutenant
2
Rep
225
Posts

 
Drives: Backwards
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Greenland

iTrader: (0)

Thank you very much for your post, ILC32. Excellent.
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 07:54 AM   #36
devo
Lieutenant Colonel
28
Rep
1,942
Posts

 
Drives: .2GT3/335Cpe/991 GT3 coming
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: thinking about cars, girls and money, not necessarily in that order.

iTrader: (0)

Fantastic review. Very much appreciated.
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 08:51 AM   #37
Just_me
Captain
65
Rep
605
Posts

 
Drives: RWD
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Sweden

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PIMP "E" View Post
Thanks alot, thats is a little bit pricy just to drive around the little track.

Little? Isnt N-ring like 20,8 km long?
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 09:03 AM   #38
southlight
Moderator / European Editor
southlight's Avatar
607
Rep
6,748
Posts

 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Germany

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_me View Post
Little? Isnt N-ring like 20,8 km long?
Sure, but you're only driving the F1 track on your own, the Ring experience just as a passenger.

Best regards, south
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 09:07 AM   #39
ILC32
Lieutenant
ILC32's Avatar
18
Rep
580
Posts

 
Drives: 1993 Porsche RSA
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Somewhere

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PIMP "E" View Post
Thanks alot, thats is a little bit pricy just to drive around the little track.
Not for a pimp!
Appreciate 0
      10-09-2007, 12:33 PM   #40
Just_me
Captain
65
Rep
605
Posts

 
Drives: RWD
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Sweden

iTrader: (0)

if I had the cash and M3 on order , I would pay the double
Appreciate 0
      10-10-2007, 12:53 PM   #41
EBuyuk
Private
EBuyuk's Avatar
2
Rep
95
Posts

 
Drives: E60 M5
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Istanbul

iTrader: (0)

I happened to be there as well for this great experience so I figured this would be the thread to keep adding to about my thoughts as well. Most of my pictures are the same as ILC32s but I do have some other ones and will post them for you. Great review ILC32!

My partner for the car was also awesome. We had a lot of laughs as we were really riding the people that weren't going fast enough in our group. So cheers to you Alex if you are reading this

For those of you that are wondering what we did there, here is a short summary.

1st Day of Driving:

- Warm-up laps (we warmed up by driving the whole sprint section a couple times)
- Braking and Avoiding (Went up to 100kmh and braked as hard as possible. The second part was going up to 100kmh and avoiding the cones infront you by making a left and a right while braking as hard as you can without hitting the cones. Timing and your eyes were very important in this part)
- Arena (This part was an exercise in slalom training where we had to go through the blue cones in 3rd gear and red cones in 2nd gear. It was a blast to do it if you were one of the last because the bad drivers infront of you can knock a lot of cones which makes it a little more difficult but much more fun Here you could also see how different the car was when you played with the DSC-MDM and power button)
- Ideal Line (This was an exercise that we did only on the second half of the sprint section. The instructors showed us the ideal line and we followed them. This was a blast as well because we got the cars up to 220kmh here)
- Drift (This was just a regular drift exercise just like in any other driving school. Infact this exercise was much better in Spartanburg)

- Race Track Experience ( This was where each driver did about 12 laps in the sprint section again in a lead and follow the instructor. It sure was a blat to drive behind the instructor. Just so you know, when you were on them, some of the instructors really knew how to get away from you. Such as Claudia. You can follow the ideal line with her as much as you want. Your car will end up going into understeer and she will get a way...)

2nd Day of driving:

-Warm-up laps (same as 1st day)

- Braking and Cornering (This exercise was at the Michelin corner I believe. You breaked as hard as you could to a complete stop from 115kmh as you were cornering without hitting the cones. Again the DSC made a big difference. MDM)

- Driving agility Experience (From various speeds between 70kmh - 115kmh you went into cones and you made a quick left and a right without hitting the brakes and then braked to a full stop and while braking you had a quick right and a left.)

- Slalom (This was a timed exercise where you did slaloms with your own choice of gear and modes, made a loop and more slaloms and then stop in the box)

- Competitive Cornering Experience (We did this in the Mercedes Arena. It was a timed event and you really sawhow many seconds you lost when you didn't follow the ideal line which also endedup in a lot of understeering.

- Race Track Experice (Same as 1st day)


The ring-taxi in the M3 on the Nordschleife was just increadible like ILC32 mentioned. My level of went up so much to all those M engineers. The one thing I learned from here is that 99% of us that buy the car will never even come close to using the full potential of the vehicle. I tried to take some pictures but all I ended up getting was the picture of the headliner or the floor


A lot of people have been asking the seat height. The conclusion I have come to from what I have seen is that when you sit in your comfortable driving position, the seat height is normal. When you sit in your "I wanna go fast" position (i.e. closer to the steering wheel) you seem to sit higher. In Alex's case as he liked to sit pretty close to the steering wheel in his racing position he almost touched the ceiling with his head. We were both about 6 feet/180cm tall.

I really liked the feel of the steering. The servetronic for the steering is great IMO. However I only drove it in Sport mode so can't tell you how it feels in normal mode.

I agree with ILC32 on the EDC as well. I think it is a great feature. I really enjoy it on the M5 and was awesome on the M3. Even though the road on the track is of course in perfect condition, I could still feel the difference. The one thing I really enjoyed hearing from one of the instructors was that when you have the EDC in sport mode, the suspension setting is always stiff. However when you are in comfort or normal mode and you are driving and you come to a corner, the car adjusts automatically to the stiffest setting in the corner and when you are out of the corner it goes back to the mode you selected. This gives you the comfort you want from the ride and still be able to go into a corner at the stiffest setting. So to summarize: auto adjusting modes are comfort and normal. In sport mode there is no auto adjusting and it always stays stiff.

In our cars the "DSC off" button was disabled. However we could turn on the MDM mode. In the various excersies that we did such as slalom and braking you could really see how the car actied differently when there was full DSC compared to the MDM. IMHO the MDM has improved quite a bit from the M5. With the MDM on, I was getting great launches, better times in slalom, better handling during breaking. So I am trying to say that when I get the car, I will always drive in MDM.

The M button was the same as the one in the M5/6. So not much to talk about there.

The power button also made a big difference in the slaloms IMO. You really felt the car respond to you immediately. The power button + MDM = Perfection.

The shift knob looked a bit long in the pictures to me. But in real life, I can say that it is much shorter than the E46 M3 and the E39 M5. I thought that it was at a very good height. If they had gone any shorter I think they would have recieved a lt of complaints as this is a production car where many non-racers will purchase as well. It could have been a tad shorter but I was very happy with it. The lengths of the shifts weren't that bad as well. Like I said any shorter people might complain.

I read somewhere on the forum where someone was worried that the CF roof might turn yellowish in time. So I asked various people out there about this and the answer I ended up getting was they never had a report about this in the M6 and never heard about this problem from the M3 CSL owners either. So that puts that question out to the side for some people. For those of you that keep asking if the convertable is going to have a CF roof. The answer is %100 NO. I overheard somebody ask this.

I think I can say that pretty much everyone asked about M-DCT at some point during the event. Me being one of them. The only answer I got was "Is there one coming out?" with a smiling face. But I was told that if there was one to come out, I should definitely wait for it if I liked SMG. But not to expect hard shifts like you get in the M5 when you are in S6 mode. It is supposed to be very smooth. I guess you can forget about chirping your tire from 2nd to 3rd gear. But this was info that we already knew so nothing new there.

Fuel consumption, I guess I can say that if you own an M5/M6, the fuel consumption is better. A full tank of gas was just right for a day of driving.

IMO the car had a bit too much understeer. I really felt it in some corners.

The brakes squeled alot. Especially when they were hot. My ears were hurting from the noise. Towards the end of the day I did feel some fading in my brakes.

The wheels in 18" looked terrible IMO. I think I can say that they were worse in real life than in pictures.

The other thing that didn't excite about the car was the center console( where the A/C controls, radio control, etc. are). What I didn't like about it was that it was just like a regular 3 series and didn't give an extra excitement. Our cars had about 3600-4800 km on them. The one thing that caught me was the wear and tear in the drivers side seats. The left side where you get in to the car looked like there was a lot of wear to it.

Overall BMW did an awesome job in organizing the event. Would love to do it again in a heartbeat.

Enjoy the pictures!
Attached Images
          
Appreciate 0
      10-10-2007, 01:03 PM   #42
EBuyuk
Private
EBuyuk's Avatar
2
Rep
95
Posts

 
Drives: E60 M5
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Istanbul

iTrader: (0)

The one thing that they kept saying was "If you can't see the castle, the weather is sucks. If you see the castle the weather will suck."

More pictures.
Attached Images
          
Appreciate 0
      10-10-2007, 01:12 PM   #43
EBuyuk
Private
EBuyuk's Avatar
2
Rep
95
Posts

 
Drives: E60 M5
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Istanbul

iTrader: (0)

More pictures.
Attached Images
          
Appreciate 0
      10-10-2007, 01:21 PM   #44
EBuyuk
Private
EBuyuk's Avatar
2
Rep
95
Posts

 
Drives: E60 M5
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Istanbul

iTrader: (0)

More pictures.
Attached Images
          
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:59 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST