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      06-16-2013, 03:38 PM   #1
dasvolk
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2013 BMW M3  [4.50]
What is it that makes the car feel sharper?

Two M3s ago now, my first E92, had the Dinan Stage 3 suspension on it. It felt great - very sharp turn-in, cornered nice and flat, understeer cured, the lot. But it was pretty stiff, and American roads are crap. I'm sitting here waiting for car #3 to get shipped across the pond from Regensburg and now considering my options on handling. I had EDC on my second M3 and didn't like it, and felt that the electric steering in MDM wasn't doing much, so I left that off the BTO sheet. For reference, I drove the EDC car on the Nurburgring, with MDM configured to leave the suspension in "comfort" mode as the car skittered and had wheelhop on rougher parts (especially on the back part of the track through brunnchen/pflanzgarten.)

Now for my question: Dinan's kit consists of springs, a front ARB, camber plates, urethane bushings and adjustable end links. From what I've read, I suspect that the camber plates helped the turn-in, but I'm not clear on whether the ARB or the springs or both combined to reduce body-roll. The reason I'm asking about this is, I would like to retain as much of the ride quality as I can while sharpening up the handling. Suggestions/ideas would be very welcome.
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      06-16-2013, 05:12 PM   #2
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The stock M3 with proper tires has excellent handling/feel on the street IMHO. I'm not a fan of EDC, so opt'd out of that too. Hopefully your car comes with PS2's, that's a start. I'd try to dial in more camber in if you want quicker response but seems twitchy to me on the street...it's all personal preference. Lot's of suspension options but at some compromise to the sublime stock setup. There's no way around getting more performance w/o sacrificing some comfort...all subjective of course.
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      06-16-2013, 09:21 PM   #3
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What I don't get is dinan offers these three stages and not a single one comes with shocks? Bizzare

The stock shocks are not meant to be dealing with lowering springs I am pretty sure. So it's just a matter of time.
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      06-16-2013, 11:13 PM   #4
dasvolk
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I'm thinking about doing camber plates alone to see what effect that has. The Dinan kit is just a 1/2" drop with a change in the bump stop to retain the suspension travel, which helps the shock out quite a bit. If I recall correctly BMW doesn't use different shocks on the ZCP cars with the 10mm drop so I'm assuming it isn't an issue in their minds.
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      06-17-2013, 05:52 AM   #5
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I know everyone gonna push what they got, but I have been beyond impressed with Ohlins Road & Track coilovers.

I feel they are more comfy and composed on street that stock suspension and very capable on track when you stiffen them up.

That, plus pilot super sports and max camber without plates seems to work great for me. Excellent all around.
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      06-17-2013, 01:43 PM   #6
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To me, turn in and grip is what defines "sharp". Better tires can make a pretty big difference in turn in. Stock Michelins aren't bad, but an extreme performance tire can really make a difference. Noise can increase though. Camber also helps, but I thought I would notice a bigger difference than I did going from -1.5 to -2.5. Decreasing unsprung weight is another option but with that you're talking pricey wheels and BBK.
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      06-17-2013, 02:09 PM   #7
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There are quite a few factors that will help make a car feel 'sharper.' This also depends on your definition of the word, but your OP came across pretty clear.

A double adjustable damper where you can control rebound AND compression will make a big difference in the feel of the car, along with well matched set of springs. Your wheels and tires will also make a difference, and one thing people overlook is your alignment. A good alignment can make a car feel very vague, twitchy, or somewhere in between, and can also accommodate a feel of 'sharpness' in the car.

As Transfer was hinting towards, it really depends on what your budget is, and changing the things that will most affect the car with least amount of dollars....unfortunately, that isn't always easy to do
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      06-17-2013, 02:12 PM   #8
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Yeah, one reason to opt for the 18" wheels is that you have a lighter combination. I will do changes slowly, but I'm also wondering if there's some 'magic' in the package Dinan puts together to make it work, or if it's the full combination of more camber, stiffer springs and stiffer ARB that makes it happen.

Friends who race have told me about Ohlins being an excellent choice and worth the price. I think I'll take a dig around in the post your setup thread and see what people's reactions are.
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      06-17-2013, 02:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TC Kline Racing View Post
There are quite a few factors that will help make a car feel 'sharper.' This also depends on your definition of the word, but your OP came across pretty clear.

A double adjustable damper where you can control rebound AND compression will make a big difference in the feel of the car, along with well matched set of springs. Your wheels and tires will also make a difference, and one thing people overlook is your alignment. A good alignment can make a car feel very vague, twitchy, or somewhere in between, and can also accommodate a feel of 'sharpness' in the car.

As Transfer was hinting towards, it really depends on what your budget is, and changing the things that will most affect the car with least amount of dollars....unfortunately, that isn't always easy to do
I'm more focused on the value of what I get - the Dinan setup works well, but I look at the picture and think "is that really $2000 worth of parts? I doubt it." I'm happy to pay for something that works better though. Do you have any opinions on alignments when the car is new?
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      06-19-2013, 12:28 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbraslins
I know everyone gonna push what they got, but I have been beyond impressed with Ohlins Road & Track coilovers.

I feel they are more comfy and composed on street that stock suspension and very capable on track when you stiffen them up.

That, plus pilot super sports and max camber without plates seems to work great for me. Excellent all around.
+1 on the Ohlins. They simply make the best suspension components hands down.
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