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      10-03-2007, 01:12 AM   #1
JerezBlue!
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M3 May Depreciate Big Time!

I regret to say it, but in the UK the situation seems to be different for the E92 V8 M3 launch than it was for the most recent M5 launch.

BMW seem to have increased supply considerably, and like before, there are many speculators who have bought cars for an immediate premium sale but;

You CAN get build slots for December delivery from a several London dealers AND the speculators CAN'T seem to sell their cars at a premium - even £3k. Some are selling under list with 300 miles on the clock!

Also, I would have expected Demo Cars in UK showrooms all to have been pre-sold by now - but they simply haven't. IMO, this is clearly abnormal. At one time you couldn't get an M5 for love nor money.

I get the feeling that this situation is not being helped by the general caution in spending of UK consumers; which may mean major depreciation! I am now concerned that the M3 may suffer like the M6 did.

A new M6 costs £83k (standard spec) and an 18 month old M6 is £53k (standard spec); that's around 17% down in the first 12 months, which actually seems high to me for a BMW M Car.

The above is all financial, but from an emotional point of view once the focus on the M3 has died a little, I still think it'll be a great car as a daily drive.
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      10-03-2007, 01:24 AM   #2
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Pay above MSRP is retarded.
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      10-03-2007, 01:31 AM   #3
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well here in the UAE M car depreciate faster than the titanic sinking! and since we're being ripped off for a new M3, i might opt for a low millage E92 M3 once DCT is introduced.

you know, i've owned my E60 M5 for a year and 8 months now, and it's current value is scary! i bought the car for $111,000......now it has 23000km on it, and it's only worth 70,000 IF I'M LUCKY!!! most go for 60k.

the depreciation value made me sick, and i expect the same for the new M3....oh and the M6 is in the same boat!

why do M cars drop in price so much? i have not a single clue! ;(

bad for us owners, good for used car buyers!


(edit: converted prices are approximate)
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      10-03-2007, 03:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtown View Post
Pay above MSRP is retarded.

You may be right, but, this has been going on quite a bit in the UK over the last few years for most of the exotics including most BMW M cars.
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      10-03-2007, 04:54 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
I regret to say it, but in the UK the situation seems to be different for the E92 V8 M3 launch than it was for the most recent M5 launch.

BMW seem to have increased supply considerably, and like before, there are many speculators who have bought cars for an immediate premium sale but;.
I probably agree with you, but all the dealers would deny it.

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Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
You CAN get build slots for December delivery from a several London dealers AND the speculators CAN'T seem to sell their cars at a premium - even £3k. Some are selling under list with 300 miles on the clock!

Also, I would have expected Demo Cars in UK showrooms all to have been pre-sold by now - but they simply haven't. IMO, this is clearly abnormal. At one time you couldn't get an M5 for love nor money.
Yeah, I'm surprised by this too. This is the opposite of the M5 Scenario, as you correctly mentioned.

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Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
I get the feeling that this situation is not being helped by the general caution in spending of UK consumers; which may mean major depreciation! I am now concerned that the M3 may suffer like the M6 did.
Agree again. The current climate both in the UK and globally is not conducive to buoyant residuals. Also, the sky-high house-prices in the South are forcing people away from luxury marques.

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Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
A new M6 costs £83k (standard spec) and an 18 month old M6 is £53k (standard spec); that's around 17% down in the first 12 months, which actually seems high to me for a BMW M Car.

The above is all financial, but from an emotional point of view once the focus on the M3 has died a little, I still think it'll be a great car as a daily drive.
The car shall be phenomenal I am sure, but the price that one has to pay for this luxury is significant - especially in the U.K. The Yanks have it easy!
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      10-03-2007, 06:06 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
I
A new M6 costs £83k (standard spec) and an 18 month old M6 is £53k (standard spec); that's around 17% down in the first 12 months, which actually seems high to me for a BMW M Car.
Worse than that - Pay £83k for a new M6 and a dealer will offer you £50-£55k after 12 months, if you can actually find one who will buy it from you. You're looking at a 30-35% drop in the first year. Sadly I can say that, speaking from experience!

I think the M3 will fare rather better, but in the current climate, with rising interest rates and fears over stability of the financial markets, people are not quite as eager to spend money as they once were. I guess time will tell how it holds up, but I've found that most dealers are still quoting 6-12 months for delivery of a new car...
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      10-03-2007, 08:36 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
Worse than that - Pay £83k for a new M6 and a dealer will offer you £50-£55k after 12 months, if you can actually find one who will buy it from you. You're looking at a 30-35% drop in the first year. Sadly I can say that, speaking from experience!
Look at the price of an Aston Martin Vantage. There are nearly the same when compared to the M6. Im not sure how it is in Europe but here in the US a new M6 optioned out is close to $110,000 US, the same as a Vantage. You can pick up one year old M6's for under $80,000 all day long, however you cant find a Vantage under $95,000. Thats a shame.
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      10-03-2007, 09:45 AM   #8
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The biggest enemy of the M6 has always been the M5. On paper they are essentially the same car. It's not until you drive them back to back that you realise the difference, but it's hard to justify and extra 33% onto the price of an already expensive stable mate!
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      10-03-2007, 10:08 AM   #9
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R u a news reporter. Because your headline sounds way over-exagerated
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      10-03-2007, 10:16 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
The biggest enemy of the M6 has always been the M5. On paper they are essentially the same car. It's not until you drive them back to back that you realise the difference, but it's hard to justify and extra 33% onto the price of an already expensive stable mate!


Tell me about it, I was wondering if thr 4 door M3 will hold up better than the coupe when it is launched next year. From what I understand, it's not going to cost as much from the get go.
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      10-03-2007, 10:35 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bambam View Post
R u a news reporter. Because your headline sounds way over-exagerated


No mate, I work in sales in the financial markets - but based upon people cancelling orders of a whole bunch of exotic cars including the M3, I think that it's quite possible a good car like the M3 V8 will have a poor start.

Quite frankly I'm not bothered and never have been. I just find it a little weird that I can't simply make a call and sell my car over the phone at a premium; as I have done for other nice cars in the last few years.

Please don't get me wrong, I am really looking forward to my new arrival - scheduled for collection on 28/10 but that's cause I am and always have been a car fanatic. It's the peripheral interest that seems to be falling.

BMW dealers are not really helping much by offering large discounts on the 335i M Sport Coupe and Saloon (Sedan) - 11% is achievable. For non-car nuts it's an obvious alternative; combine this with big M3 supply in the UK!
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      10-03-2007, 10:40 AM   #12
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Let's slow down a bit. I believe the main issues with the relatively high deprecitation of the M5 and M6 have more to do with the SMG issues and people's expectations of what SMG is about. Also, the fact that BMW doesn't offer these vehicles as CPO with that 100k warranty contributes. Fuel consumption may have a bit to do with it as well.

Do not attempt to factor in the premium that someone paid the dealer over MSRP. That is the finest example of disposable income that I have ever seen.
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      10-03-2007, 10:44 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
Tell me about it, I was wondering if thr 4 door M3 will hold up better than the coupe when it is launched next year. From what I understand, it's not going to cost as much from the get go.
Won't be a huge price diff here. Also, the market will soon be flooded with the C63 and other competitors so...........

Let's face it- unique high performance cars such as "M"'s and "AMG"s are no longer rare and therefore they will not retain as much value as they once did.

Those days are over baby.............

There will always be exceptions (Vantage, RS4 etc.) but in general the market for these types of vehicles will continue to soften...
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      10-03-2007, 10:49 AM   #14
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This is not great news... I guess we will have to wait and see how the US market handles the new M
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      10-03-2007, 11:24 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonlowe View Post
Let's slow down a bit. I believe the main issues with the relatively high deprecitation of the M5 and M6 have more to do with the SMG issues and people's expectations of what SMG is about. Also, the fact that BMW doesn't offer these vehicles as CPO with that 100k warranty contributes. Fuel consumption may have a bit to do with it as well.

Do not attempt to factor in the premium that someone paid the dealer over MSRP. That is the finest example of disposable income that I have ever seen.

It's ALWAYS going to be about Supply and Demand. SMG, poor fuel returns etc may all be factors reducing Demand but with the M3 it is becoming quite clear that BMW Supply is high; at least in the UK!
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      10-03-2007, 11:27 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by MI6 View Post
Those days are over baby.............

There will always be exceptions (Vantage, RS4 etc.) but in general the market for these types of vehicles will continue to soften...

Yeah, I agree, but they were really good fun starting with the Boxster in '96 for me!! When I ordered E92, I committed to losing money emotionally just in case.
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      10-03-2007, 12:07 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
The biggest enemy of the M6 has always been the M5. On paper they are essentially the same car. It's not until you drive them back to back that you realise the difference, but it's hard to justify and extra 33% onto the price of an already expensive stable mate!
Can you give me a bit more insight here. I have driven the M5, but not the M6. Which do you consider to be the better car, and why?
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      10-03-2007, 12:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
It's ALWAYS going to be about Supply and Demand. SMG, poor fuel returns etc may all be factors reducing Demand but with the M3 it is becoming quite clear that BMW Supply is high; at least in the UK!
I've heard such different things regarding supply that I am starting to discount everything dealers say (one dealer told me he is currently taking M3 orders for 2010 delivery).

There are not a lot of alternatives available to the "peripheral" market London just now and I agree it's quite likely that the 335i is going to cannibalise things for BMW.

It will be a big mistake by BMW if they do let depreciation get out of hand, since this has traditionally been a major reason for people to choose the M3.

Only thing to do is give it 12 months and see what the second hand prices are like.
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      10-03-2007, 12:42 PM   #19
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Can you give me a bit more insight here. I have driven the M5, but not the M6. Which do you consider to be the better car, and why?
Have a look here for some thoughts I scribbled at the time...
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      10-03-2007, 12:56 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Filthy Monkey View Post
Have a look here for some thoughts I scribbled at the time...
Great read! Thanks!
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      10-04-2007, 05:20 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerezBlue! View Post
I regret to say it, but in the UK the situation seems to be different for the E92 V8 M3 launch than it was for the most recent M5 launch.

BMW seem to have increased supply considerably, and like before, there are many speculators who have bought cars for an immediate premium sale but;

You CAN get build slots for December delivery from a several London dealers AND the speculators CAN'T seem to sell their cars at a premium - even £3k. Some are selling under list with 300 miles on the clock!

Also, I would have expected Demo Cars in UK showrooms all to have been pre-sold by now - but they simply haven't. IMO, this is clearly abnormal. At one time you couldn't get an M5 for love nor money.

I get the feeling that this situation is not being helped by the general caution in spending of UK consumers; which may mean major depreciation! I am now concerned that the M3 may suffer like the M6 did.

A new M6 costs £83k (standard spec) and an 18 month old M6 is £53k (standard spec); that's around 17% down in the first 12 months, which actually seems high to me for a BMW M Car.

The above is all financial, but from an emotional point of view once the focus on the M3 has died a little, I still think it'll be a great car as a daily drive.
JerezBlue is right in terms of being able to find cars if you try. Even though I ordered 2 years ago from a large midlands dealer, I was still not due to receive my vehicle until Q1 2008 for being 7th on their list. 10 emails sent to various dealers last night resulted in as many phone calls this morning, several demo cars(new and used) were offered to me, but then that magic moment, the offer of a build slot for arrival around 11 November 2007 !!! Yes only a few weeks away now. Of course there were other dealers who told me I'd be waiting until the end of 2008 !!!

It certainly will be interesting to see what happens to residuals next year in the UK when supply catches up with demand.
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      10-04-2007, 08:40 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEllis View Post
This is not great news... I guess we will have to wait and see how the US market handles the new M
This is not news at all. Someone makes an opinion and all of a sudden its supposed to be true. When I see cold hard facts then I'll consider it news worthy. I wouldn't be worried at all.
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