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      05-12-2013, 12:37 PM   #1
brucewil
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DCT clutch slipping - HELP PLEASE

I only did a quick search, so I apologize if this topic has already been discussed.

I have been having trouble since my car was inspected back in December with the DCT clutch appearing to slip. (Best way I can describe it). It is most noticeable when the car is cold (first 5-10 minutes of driving). It occurs when at a complete stop and going into first gear. I step on the gas and for 0.5 to 0.75 seconds nothing happens, then the clutch engages and the car lurches forward. It has stalled probably 5 or 6 times when trying to engage the clutch in that same scenario. It is more noticeable when I am stopped on a hill. The dealer has been no help in the three times they have had the car. They say they haven't been able to reproduce it. I find that really hard to believe because of late it happens several times everyday.

Here is my setup. ESS 575 supercharger, Dinan 3.62 diff. I tend to drive in MDM and S5.

The problem began when the dealer could not get my car to pass smog inspection. They had to contact ESS for a special programming cable. (probably to fool the computers into passing it?). The problem almost dissapeared, but then returned even worse.

Has anyone had similar issues with the DCT and shifting into 1st gear?
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      05-12-2013, 12:57 PM   #2
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how has your driving style been with the supercharger? i heard that if you don't ease into the throttle while accelerating from a stop or in a lower gear, it will in time, start to slip because the clutch can not handle that much power. getting my ess blower installed tomorrow so trying to find out all the things i can to prevent things like this from happening. thanks for sharing, hope you get it worked out
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      05-12-2013, 01:02 PM   #3
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You can have the dealer re-adapt the DCT, in particular teach in the clutch, this may help but you most likely need to replace the clutch assembly.
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      05-12-2013, 01:04 PM   #4
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Interesting. I've only experienced clutch slip if leaving the car in Auto mode and ripping it in a higher gear so the gears drop from say 5 to 3. I know you said you tend to drive in S5...does this mean all the time or is there a considerable amount of driving done in auto mode? I have been told to avoid D unless driving very easy and when in S mode to ALWAYS use S5. Could the ESS DCT software possibly help this? After warming up the car does it still happen? I had the cold start program removed as many have and it got rid if the first 5-10 minute quirks I was having.
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      05-12-2013, 02:39 PM   #5
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I drive almost exclusively in manual mode in S5. I rarely ever drive in D. I almost always ease into motion from a stop .When you have that much horsepower while driving in traffic, it's kind of hard not to. Otherwise you will be up the a** of the person in front of you.

The problem rarely occurs when the car is warm.
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      05-12-2013, 03:56 PM   #6
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If the clutch was actually glazed or needing replaced I would think it would split when warm also. I haven't experienced what its like when a DCT clutch is going out, but I know in a manual its pretty obvious.

Does the car find the other gears fine? What about the other odd gears?
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      05-12-2013, 04:16 PM   #7
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No problem in other gears. Only 1st.
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      05-12-2013, 06:05 PM   #8
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Interesting that the problem rarely occurs when the car is warm. It could be worth getting rid of the cold start honestly. When I had the cold start on I would often get hesitation in the throttle while in first from a stop and then bam a jolt which I guess could be confused with clutch slip. This would go away after the car warmed up. Maybe it is clutch slip but i am comparing it to what i know is clutch slip in higher gears. It's going to be the cheapest and easiest possible solution. ESS can remove it for you with some updated software. Removing mine made a night and day difference and there have been people with all different kits that have benefitted from removing it. Give it a shot man, from your description it sounds like it might just do the trick.
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      05-12-2013, 06:22 PM   #9
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I didn't say it was the clutch slipping, only that it was the best way I could describe it. Could you please elaborate what you mean by getting rid of the cold start? What you are describing is exactly the problem I am having.
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      05-12-2013, 06:38 PM   #10
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I hear ya, I just read the title of the thread and assumed clutch slip.

There is a cold start program on all e9x M3s from the factory which is responsible for the car acting very jerky and feeling "off" while it warms up. It seems to be a bit more pronounced on FI cars but I remember it on my NA M3. I guess it's supposed to help the car with warming up but just driving the car like anyone normally would until the oil, etc. is warm is sufficient. I have heard from BMW techs that the cold start program is complete garbage. I don't think I have come across anyone who removed their cold start program and preferred to have it back. The program is part of the ECU software so any of the supercharger tuners can remove it when sending you the software that you upload with their cable (or done at a shop). The non supercharged related tunes have this option as well and many people choose to remove it. Contact ESS and I'm sure they will get you updated software without the cold start program right away. Some supercharger companies recommend doing away with the cold start from the beginning while others seem to look at it on a case by case basis.

It can't hurt at all to get it removed. It made a night and day difference with my car which used to jump a little on the revs when starting and would feel like a crack head until it warmed up.

Search "cold start" and you'll find plenty of information on it. Again, it can't hurt to remove it and if you have to put it back on for any reason it is just a simple software update again. Let us know how it goes!
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      05-12-2013, 06:44 PM   #11
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Thanks so much for the info. It sounds exactly like the problem I am having. I asked the dealer (who installed the ESS kit for me) if we should contact ESS the second time I brought it in. The dealer also said they checked all the bulletins and found nothing. It sounds like its a known issue. Hopefully the 4th time is the charm!
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      05-12-2013, 11:58 PM   #12
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No problem - I hope this solves the issue. When working with a dealership they obviously have limited e92 m3 supercharger experience so I would definitely call the manufacturer myself or insist upon it. They see so many more cars and know what to look out for. Contact ESS and explain to them the problem you are having. You can definitely insist on removing the cold start as there's no harm to it even if they don't suggest it. There was another local guy with a similar kit that was experiencing strange startup issues and sure enough removing the cold start took care of them.
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      05-13-2013, 07:19 AM   #13
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Just replace your clutches !
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      05-13-2013, 07:35 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brucewil View Post
Thanks so much for the info. It sounds exactly like the problem I am having. I asked the dealer (who installed the ESS kit for me) if we should contact ESS the second time I brought it in. The dealer also said they checked all the bulletins and found nothing. It sounds like its a known issue. Hopefully the 4th time is the charm!
Hope it works out for you, but it doesn't sound like a cold start issue to me. The car bucks like crazy, and that's only if you take off right after you start the cold. It doesn't feel like clutch slip, but more like riding a bull haha.

Keep us updated.
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      05-13-2013, 10:49 AM   #15
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The first tune I got from ESS didn't seem to have the cold start and would free rev on start-up. The car eventually stalled once, so I called ESS and they sent me a new tune file which definitely has a cold start and cured the issues I was having. I later asked ESS to send me the same tune without cold start and they said cold start is necessary for the SC tune and would not remove it. I guess my neighbors will just get to enjoy it when I leave for the gym at 6:30am
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      05-13-2013, 04:46 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
Hope it works out for you, but it doesn't sound like a cold start issue to me. The car bucks like crazy, and that's only if you take off right after you start the cold. It doesn't feel like clutch slip, but more like riding a bull haha.

Keep us updated.

Yeah should be interesting to see what it is. From personal experience with the issues I was having with the cold start program I figured it is worth a shot. I would particularly remember a half second stutter when pulling out of my street. It was definitely different than clutch slip but the OP said he isn't familiar with clutch slip...just trying to describe what it feels like. I could see that stutter getting mixed up with clutch slip. Hopefully it's just something tune related - cold start or not.
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      05-14-2013, 01:39 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
Hope it works out for you, but it doesn't sound like a cold start issue to me. The car bucks like crazy, and that's only if you take off right after you start the cold. It doesn't feel like clutch slip, but more like riding a bull haha.

Keep us updated.
Not DCT but my 6spd manual had the same bucking, crazy bull feeling upon cold start. I have no bucking issues now with the supercharger w/cold start delete installed but did have it with the NA ESS tune w/cold start delete previous to supercharging. DCT however may react differently. good luck.
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      05-14-2013, 01:53 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lenzm3edan View Post
Not DCT but my 6spd manual had the same bucking, crazy bull feeling upon cold start. I have no bucking issues now with the supercharger w/cold start delete installed but did have it with the NA ESS tune w/cold start delete previous to supercharging. DCT however may react differently. good luck.
I had that too (6MT), and that happened with stock car, and when I would take off when the car was still revving (cold start). It would then buck big time for the next 10 seconds.

I just learned to give the car 30 seconds or so before I took off. Now I've got cold start delete, but still wait anyway.
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