BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis
 
E92-lighting
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      01-06-2012, 12:40 PM   #1
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Brembo Caliper on stock rotor



Saw this photo here on the board and figured I would do some research. I figured it was maybe the smaller caliper that brembo sells for their 365mm/345 setup. If this is possible I think it would be an awesome cost effective upgrade if you did just lines, calipers, and mounting hardware. Consumables are much cheaper using the oem rotors but you would still need to use the very expensive pads that fit the Brembo calipers. Another idea was maybe the stoptech 355/355 setup which would be great because the ST60/40 use cheaper pads. Any thoughts?

OEM
Front Rotor: 360x30
Rear Rotor: 350x24

Smaller Brembo Kit for e92
Front Rotor: 365x34mm
Rear Rotor: 345x28mm
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 12:43 PM   #2
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,079
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
My guess is no. Never seen a kit that you could put an upgraded caliper on a stock setup.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 12:50 PM   #3
Malek@MRF
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Malek@MRF's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Irvine, California

Posts: 3,365
iTrader: (5)

Send a message via AIM to Malek@MRF
We are working on this upgrade right now. I'll keep you guys posted.
__________________

BMW PERFORMANCE SPECIALISTS. Suspension. Forced Induction. Brakes. Race Preparation. Service. Alignments.
OFFICIAL PARTNERS: Íhlins. KW Suspension. Brembo. AP Racing. ESS Tuning. iND Distribution. Turner Motorsport.
Facebook | Instagram | Yelp! | Flikr | Contact | YouTube
Malek@MRF is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 12:51 PM   #4
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,079
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
We are working on this upgrade right now. I'll keep you guys posted.
That would be awesome!
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 12:52 PM   #5
JAJ
Captain
 
Drives: 2014 Shelby GT500
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC

Posts: 927
iTrader: (4)

There are three main considerations in putting a non-OEM caliper onto the OEM rotors:

- the friction face width of the rotor has to match the radial depth of the pads. Racing and aftermarket BBK pads usually range from 49 to 53 mm radial depth. Putting an ST40/60 on a stock E92 M3 front rotor will only work if the rotor annulus is the same width as the pads.

- the setback of the rotor has to be such that a caliper bracket can be made that will actually fit. The setback will also determine if the caliper hits the inside of the rim.

- the rotor minimum thickness has to be sufficient that the pistons won't fall out of their bores when the pads are worn out

From an engineering standpoint, this is not a trivial exercise.
JAJ is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:00 PM   #6
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
We are working on this upgrade right now. I'll keep you guys posted.
Definitely. Super interested.


Caliper upgrade/SS lines/Mounting Hardware/and backplates with and without duct option. We can only pray.
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:27 PM   #7
Z K
Colonel
 
Z K's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: San Francisco

Posts: 2,085
iTrader: (3)

You never know .. could be these!



Z K is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:31 PM   #8
Malek@MRF
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Malek@MRF's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Irvine, California

Posts: 3,365
iTrader: (5)

Send a message via AIM to Malek@MRF
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAJ View Post
There are three main considerations in putting a non-OEM caliper onto the OEM rotors:

- the friction face width of the rotor has to match the radial depth of the pads. Racing and aftermarket BBK pads usually range from 49 to 53 mm radial depth. Putting an ST40/60 on a stock E92 M3 front rotor will only work if the rotor annulus is the same width as the pads.

- the setback of the rotor has to be such that a caliper bracket can be made that will actually fit. The setback will also determine if the caliper hits the inside of the rim.

- the rotor minimum thickness has to be sufficient that the pistons won't fall out of their bores when the pads are worn out

From an engineering standpoint, this is not a trivial exercise.
We have taken all this into consideration. The brackets I am designing in Solidworks for this specific application.

The factory rotor is thick enough to support the Brembo Caliper. I will not be designing this for the Stoptech caliper however.

You are right, this is definitely not a trivial exercise.
__________________

BMW PERFORMANCE SPECIALISTS. Suspension. Forced Induction. Brakes. Race Preparation. Service. Alignments.
OFFICIAL PARTNERS: Íhlins. KW Suspension. Brembo. AP Racing. ESS Tuning. iND Distribution. Turner Motorsport.
Facebook | Instagram | Yelp! | Flikr | Contact | YouTube
Malek@MRF is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:34 PM   #9
Malek@MRF
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Malek@MRF's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Irvine, California

Posts: 3,365
iTrader: (5)

Send a message via AIM to Malek@MRF
Quote:
Originally Posted by richardg View Post
Definitely. Super interested.


Caliper upgrade/SS lines/Mounting Hardware/and backplates with and without duct option. We can only pray.
No need to wish. I am working on all you have mentioned.

Through my many times tracking this M3, I have repeatedly realized our factory rotors are great pieces. Our calipers are a major fault.
__________________

BMW PERFORMANCE SPECIALISTS. Suspension. Forced Induction. Brakes. Race Preparation. Service. Alignments.
OFFICIAL PARTNERS: Íhlins. KW Suspension. Brembo. AP Racing. ESS Tuning. iND Distribution. Turner Motorsport.
Facebook | Instagram | Yelp! | Flikr | Contact | YouTube
Malek@MRF is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:39 PM   #10
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Very excited to see final outcome. Please keep me in the loop. Any idea on an ETA?
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:40 PM   #11
Z K
Colonel
 
Z K's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: San Francisco

Posts: 2,085
iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
We have taken all this into consideration. The brackets I am designing in Solidworks for this specific application.

The factory rotor is thick enough to support the Brembo Caliper. I will not be designing this for the Stoptech caliper however.

You are right, this is definitely not a trivial exercise.
The other thing to look at is if the caliper displaces the same amount of fluid as the stock caliper. If you put a larger caliper on that needs more/less brake fluid, it changes the brake bias, throws off the ABS and overall isn't very good. So it has to be a E90 M3-specific caliper used - not a off the shelf part.
Z K is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:42 PM   #12
Malek@MRF
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
Malek@MRF's Avatar
 
Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Irvine, California

Posts: 3,365
iTrader: (5)

Send a message via AIM to Malek@MRF
Quote:
Originally Posted by Z K View Post
The other thing to look at is if the caliper displaces the same amount of fluid as the stock caliper. If you put a larger caliper on that needs more/less brake fluid, it changes the brake bias, throws off the ABS and overall isn't very good. So it has to be a E90 M3-specific caliper used - not a off the shelf part.
I know. I am working on the caliper selection directly with Brembo. It's not going to be an off the shelf unit off a Porsche Cayenne or the likes.

However, a lot of the Brembo calipers are very similar to one another in this size range.
__________________

BMW PERFORMANCE SPECIALISTS. Suspension. Forced Induction. Brakes. Race Preparation. Service. Alignments.
OFFICIAL PARTNERS: Íhlins. KW Suspension. Brembo. AP Racing. ESS Tuning. iND Distribution. Turner Motorsport.
Facebook | Instagram | Yelp! | Flikr | Contact | YouTube
Malek@MRF is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:49 PM   #13
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 E92 M3, 2014 528i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 10,990
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
I know. I am working on the caliper selection directly with Brembo. It's not going to be an off the shelf unit off a Porsche Cayenne or the likes.

However, a lot of the Brembo calipers are very similar to one another in this size range.
Sign me up for your first rear Brembo caliper + OEM rotor application. In Yellow, please.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: September 2011 ED
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:51 PM   #14
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
Sign me up for your first rear Brembo caliper + OEM rotor application. In Yellow, please.
Second kit is right here. I will need front/rear in yellow.
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 01:59 PM   #15
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,079
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
And to say that I was just gonna drop $3200 on a 380mm front kit. Maybe I will wait.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 02:34 PM   #16
1SICKM
Captain
 
1SICKM's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 E92
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Mansfield, NJ

Posts: 946
iTrader: (5)

Very interested as well.....keep me on your list of potential buyers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
I know. I am working on the caliper selection directly with Brembo. It's not going to be an off the shelf unit off a Porsche Cayenne or the likes.

However, a lot of the Brembo calipers are very similar to one another in this size range.
__________________
E92 M3 DCT...Powered by ESS VT2 650/DCT GTS Software/Aquamist HFS-3 50/50/Morr /Toyo R888's

CURRENT WORLD RECORD HOLDER 1/4 MILE - 12/7/12 (ESS VT2 625, Meth Off)
ATCO RACEWAY: 10.65 @ 131.79MPH 1.725 60FT
1SICKM is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 02:49 PM   #17
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malekreza11 View Post
I know. I am working on the caliper selection directly with Brembo. It's not going to be an off the shelf unit off a Porsche Cayenne or the likes.

However, a lot of the Brembo calipers are very similar to one another in this size range.
also btw on your youtube channel you have one of your videos with no audio. Do you have this vid anywhere else. I would like to hear what your exhaust system sounds like. 28hp is a major gain from just full exhaust.
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 02:55 PM   #18
PINHEAD
Motorsport Passion!!!
 
PINHEAD's Avatar
 
Drives: E92M3/997.2RS
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 976
iTrader: (8)

that looks awful, like its photoshopped
__________________
PINHEAD is offline   Monaco
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 02:58 PM   #19
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 E92 M3, 2014 528i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 10,990
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by PINHEAD View Post
that looks awful, like its photoshopped
It is Photoshopped.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: September 2011 ED
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 03:04 PM   #20
bigjae1976
That's what she said...
 
bigjae1976's Avatar
 
Drives: 11 E90 M3 Individual
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Milwaukee, WI

Posts: 5,396
iTrader: (12)

Garage List
2004 BMW M3  [4.50]
2011 BMW E90 M3  [5.00]
2013 BMW 328i  [5.00]
OEM rotors may be cheaper but will they last as long as a Brembo 2pc rotor?
__________________


Sponsored by Momentum BMW #593...We Bleed BMW BLUE!
bigjae1976 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 03:08 PM   #21
richardg
Major
 
richardg's Avatar
 
Drives: e36M / e92M / e36 328i
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Bloomfield Hills Mi.

Posts: 1,307
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigjae1976 View Post
OEM rotors may be cheaper but will they last as long as a Brembo 2pc rotor?
I am willing to bet under street use they would last just as long and under track use I am ASSUME they would wear at the same rate. I know there are other factors but I am assuming the face of both the brembo and oem rotors is the same material. Also for the price of one set of brembo rotors you can get 2 sets of new OEM rotors.
richardg is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      01-06-2012, 03:09 PM   #22
Technic
Lieutenant General
 
Technic's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 E92 M3, 2014 528i
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida

Posts: 10,990
iTrader: (17)

Garage List
2004 M3  [0.00]
If Rotora came up years ago with an relatively inexpensive 4-piston caliper kit for the E46 M3 OEM rotors then I do not see why it cannot be replicated for the E9x M3. Especially if Brembo is involved and all the required ancillaries are done to exact specs.

I bought the first Rotora caliper kit offered in the US back then. The first kit delivered had the front brackets and SS lines done incorrectly -wrong dimensions, seriously. When all was corrected I found the kit to be an excellent upgrade -both visually and performance-wise- over the sliding calipers. No issues that I know of for the last 5 years or so, and 4 different owners of that car.

Of course, such an effort is not trivial at all, however that's what R&D is made for.
__________________
-2015 F30 320i, Imperial/Oyster, 8AT: August 2014 ED
-2012 E92 M3 Jerez Black/Rust Brown, M-DCT: September 2011 ED
-2008 E90 M3 Melbourne Red/Bamboo, 6MT: Gone
-2007 MK5 GTI United Grey/Grey, DSG: Gone
-2004 E46 M3 Carbon Black/Cinnamon, 6MT: Gone
Technic is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:30 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST