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      09-06-2007, 12:46 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Uhh, like almost twice the power? And only by 0.2 sec.
don't forget... twice the price.
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      09-06-2007, 09:45 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_me View Post
South , what was Autozeitung conclusion about these three, a final verdict?
Just in case you're still interested:

VERDICT:
The new M3 wins because of the combination of performance, great engine and the best daily usability. BMW made a family car that's also a super car.
R8 ranks second due to high price and little space, but R8's performance thrills...

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      09-06-2007, 09:47 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by Uli_HH View Post
I think something went wrong in the AUTOZEITUNG Artikel...I don´t believe that they put the M3 on other tyres then that delivered from BMW...and on the pictures in the magazin the M3 stands on the standard 19"M3-wheels as shown in many spypics in this forum...

I don´t know if the 19"-Option meens anytime Michelin Sport Cup...would be nice, but in the M3 cataloge is no notice if 19"tyres stands for Sport(Cup)tyres...
Look at the picture on the top of page 40. On the outside of left rear tire you can see a tread that doesn't match the PS2's tread...

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Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Great numbers but totally meaningless if the car was indeed tested with PSC tires. Not sure why they would do this, does not sound likely to me. We need to get to the bottom of this. German members - please help!!
Sorry, can't help. Cups are Cups...


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      09-06-2007, 10:01 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by southlight View Post
Look at the picture on the top of page 40. On the outside of left rear tire you can see a tread that doesn't match the PS2's tread...


Sorry, can't help. Cups are Cups...


Best regards, south
What a shame. Was there any reference to Cups, or explanation as to why they were fitted in the article itself?
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      09-06-2007, 10:15 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
What a shame. Was there any reference to Cups, or explanation as to why they were fitted in the article itself?
They said: Curve speed is beyond imagination, but we have to mention that this M3 is equipped with 19" rims and sport tires.

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      09-06-2007, 11:06 AM   #50
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      09-06-2007, 11:35 AM   #51
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so here a scan from the times.

Yes time was achieved on cup+ tyres, and in the articel the speak about a time from 15,7 up to 200, so the 15,2 might be wrong.

disapointing in a way the use cup tyres to achieved goog handling times.

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      09-06-2007, 11:49 AM   #52
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Let's be fair

OK Cups are Cups.

Let's all be fair about posting this other places, talking it up really big, or misrepresenting the data as from a stock vehicle. Just like the wonderful 8:09 ring time from the RS4 on special tires all of the good results here should be quoted with a clear disclaimer about the tires.

Shame on the magazine - what a terrible "apples vs. oranges" test.
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      09-06-2007, 11:59 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
OK Cups are Cups.

Let's all be fair about posting this other places, talking it up really big, or misrepresenting the data as from a stock vehicle. Just like the wonderful 8:09 ring time from the RS4 on special tires all of the good results here should be quoted with a clear disclaimer about the tires.
Why should we be the first to be fair? Did you ever read an RS4 guy saying: OK, the 8:09 was on sport tires. Some even denied it here...

*calming down* OK, let's be fair...

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      09-06-2007, 12:06 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
Why should we be the first to be fair? Did you ever read an RS4 guy saying: OK, the 8:09 was on sport tires. Some even denied it here...

*calming down* OK, let's be fair...

Best regards, south
No need to stoop down to their level. Just be sensible about things.
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      09-06-2007, 12:17 PM   #55
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No need to stoop down to their level. Just be sensible about things.
Yeah, you're right. Wasn't meant that serious...

Best regards, south
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      09-06-2007, 12:24 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by speedstar View Post
so here a scan from the times.

Yes time was achieved on cup+ tyres, and in the articel the speak about a time from 15,7 up to 200, so the 15,2 might be wrong.

disapointing in a way the use cup tyres to achieved goog handling times.

See you
I'm not sure what to make of the whole cup tyre issue, other than it seems very disingenuous to use special race rubber on one car and not the others. However, if those acceleration times are accurate, it shows that the M3 gradually reels in the R8 and C6 once it gets traction.
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      09-06-2007, 12:45 PM   #57
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I was very disappointed when I read those Marbella reviews, the new M3 got many negative reviews but lately I have warm up on the M3 but again I'm getting disappointed. Its a disaster after disaster.

Sigh!

If BMW doesnt offer these tires then the car shouldnt be tested with it. BMW finally understand that the new M3 isnt delievering? and in panic they are offering divine tires when the M3 is going to be compared to others.

Sigh!
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      09-06-2007, 12:58 PM   #58
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It is kind of stupid to put track tires on one car and not the others. (I assume that is BMW's doing.) Why even proceed with the test? At least they documented it. Regardless, on a speculative note, how much impact do people think that has had on the various numbers?
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      09-06-2007, 12:59 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by Just_me View Post
IIf BMW doesnt offer these tires then the car shouldnt be tested with it.

Sigh!
+1

I hope there is some reasonable explanation for this. Apparently, the car tested by Autobild also had sport tires fitted.
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      09-06-2007, 01:07 PM   #60
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C6 was an 07 likely not a Z-51

The 08 has a 6.2 liter and a Z-51 uses Supercar tires.

It would be interesting to find out about the tires
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      09-06-2007, 01:08 PM   #61
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Slalom comparison

Here's a quick 18m slalom comparison featuring sport tires. All I could find for the moment:

R8 : 68.6 km/h (Corsa)
RS4: 68.9 km/h (Corsa)
M3: 70.4 km/h (Cup)
997 Turbo: 71.3 km/h (Cup)
997 GT3: 71.8 km/h (Cup)

I know, that 18m slalom is only one point of performance...

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      09-06-2007, 01:16 PM   #62
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Is it the fact that BMW is providing the cars this way or is the testing mag putting the tires on?
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      09-06-2007, 01:22 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ILC32 View Post
+1

I hope there is some reasonable explanation for this. Apparently, the car tested by Autobild also had sport tires fitted.
Now I wonder whether the M3 tested by Autocar in its M3 v. RS4 comparison was fitted with sport tires. The test data page refers to Pilot Sport tires, but Cups would explain why the M3 did so poorly on the wet handling course.
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      09-06-2007, 01:43 PM   #64
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South, send Autozeitung a email?
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      09-06-2007, 01:45 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Is it the fact that BMW is providing the cars this way or is the testing mag putting the tires on?
I guess it is not clear who put the tires on exactly, but I think it is reasonable to assume that it could not have happened without BMW's approval since the car isn't available for purchase yet and must be BMW supplied.
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      09-06-2007, 01:52 PM   #66
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I guess it is not clear who put the tires on exactly, but I think it is reasonable to assume that it could not have happened without BMW's approval since the car isn't available for purchase yet and must be BMW supplied.
Yes, definately BMW supplied. However, that doesn't keep someone from changing the tires. Just would be interested to know...
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