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      02-13-2013, 09:24 PM   #1
Sleeper519
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Tracking turbo/SC cars?

I've been thinking about future track car strategies lately, with a particular eye on the next gen M3. Now I love my current E92 and tend to keep my cars for a long time. Am thinking about getting in a little deeper with this one and getting more heavily modded for the track--maybe making it a dedicated one. So whether I go SC here or get tempted and buy a new turbo M3/4 when they come out or a tittied-up E36 M3(maybe with a SC), I have concerns about tracking a FI car. I've heard about overheating issues on the SC engines and turbo cars in general and am worried about reliability and how they would hold up to heavy track day abuse over time. I know there are a lot of turbocharged track cars out running without problems (?) but many are purpose-built race cars, etc.

I'd hate to invest time and money into a FI car, only to be able to run for a few laps each session before heat soak sits me back in the paddock. I feel like I can run my S65 all day long.

Are these concerns valid at all? What is the general consensus and experience out there?

Thanks.
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      02-13-2013, 09:34 PM   #2
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Well, you'll have to get into the throttle faster with FI, in general they don't have the throttle response of a NA car. The FI car will make more power and usable torque than a SC or NA car. The heat problem can happen but you'll just have to upgrade other things besides "go fast" parts. Plus you can run different fuels/oils that will help the car run cooler. There's a lot that goes into a tune and setup for the track. The worse part about racing on the track is, you need to be prepared to write a check or write off the car if you crash or get crashed. Shit does happen, unfortunately.
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      02-13-2013, 09:37 PM   #3
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http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=794681
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      02-13-2013, 10:27 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raucky2000 View Post
Well, you'll have to get into the throttle faster with FI, in general they don't have the throttle response of a NA car. The FI car will make more power and usable torque than a SC or NA car. The heat problem can happen but you'll just have to upgrade other things besides "go fast" parts. Plus you can run different fuels/oils that will help the car run cooler. There's a lot that goes into a tune and setup for the track. The worse part about racing on the track is, you need to be prepared to write a check or write off the car if you crash or get crashed. Shit does happen, unfortunately.
Yeah, it's called track insurance.

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Originally Posted by schnell325 View Post
Thanks. I had read that thread, seems like most talk was about SC power vs. track speed/times. I'm more concerned with being able to stay out on session short-term, and overall reliability long-term. Track cars are money pits as it is...
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      02-14-2013, 08:25 AM   #5
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So you want the extra power for the street? It seems that tracking a highly modded car with FI is more of a crapshoot. There's nothing worse than having to drive your car time trial style at a DE to keep it cool/safe.

I heard an interesting point of view about FI recently. It was discussing SC vs turbo and the fact that a SC uses engine power to make boost...we all know that. The part that I learned and never thought about is that the engine has to make X+SC loss horsepower to compensate. When it's under boost, it's using gas and cooling capability of the higher hp requirements. That theory turned me off even more to SC'ing.
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      02-14-2013, 10:58 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Car54 View Post
So you want the extra power for the street? It seems that tracking a highly modded car with FI is more of a crapshoot. There's nothing worse than having to drive your car time trial style at a DE to keep it cool/safe.

I heard an interesting point of view about FI recently. It was discussing SC vs turbo and the fact that a SC uses engine power to make boost...we all know that. The part that I learned and never thought about is that the engine has to make X+SC loss horsepower to compensate. When it's under boost, it's using gas and cooling capability of the higher hp requirements. That theory turned me off even more to SC'ing.
Yep. I've read that a typical 8,000hp Top Fuel dragster engine uses something like 800-900hp just to run the supercharger.
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      02-14-2013, 12:52 PM   #7
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I just started tracking my 2013 M3 with an ESS VT2 625 S/C without a hiccup. Have done 3 events at over 100 laps and the oil needle didn't budge. No issues, no problems whatsoever.

Contrary to the post above, the throttle response is the same as when the car was N/A. A turbo car would have throttle delay.

From my experience, everything about it feels stock OEM, except the acceleration feels like a 750cc sport bike, not an M3.
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      02-14-2013, 09:14 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Longboarder
I just started tracking my 2013 M3 with an ESS VT2 625 S/C without a hiccup. Have done 3 events at over 100 laps and the oil needle didn't budge. No issues, no problems whatsoever.

Contrary to the post above, the throttle response is the same as when the car was N/A. A turbo car would have throttle delay.

From my experience, everything about it feels stock OEM, except the acceleration feels like a 750cc sport bike, not an M3.
The thing to be worried about is when you start getting up there in usage. Not sure 3 days is enough of a sample size to truly test the longevity of a system, especially when you start talking about a dedicated track car, 3 days is just the weekend I've hit close to 60 days which is well over 1000 laps and have no doubt I would be having issues with that kind of usage going the FI route. If someone can honestly tell me I wouldn't, I would give it a shot, but don't think we're their yet (I may be wrong though). Think the much safer, more fun, route would be lightening the car, which would be much cheaper too, if you were going the dedicated track car route, but hey, too each his own
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