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      08-20-2014, 08:08 PM   #1
templarklimek
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driveshaft

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If the carbon fiber driveshaft reduces rotational mass on F80 thus better power why no aftermarket for e92 M3? just trying to squeeze every extra HP we can.
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      08-20-2014, 08:29 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by templarklimek View Post
Gents,

If the carbon fiber driveshaft reduces rotational mass on F80 thus better power why no aftermarket for e92 M3? just trying to squeeze every extra HP we can.
Well, the driveshaftshop.com has 'em for all the older M3s at $1399 each. Maybe the E9x is in the works? They do customs as well. I knew a guy with one of their carbon fiber driveshafts on his Viper.
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      08-20-2014, 08:30 PM   #3
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thank you, gonna check it out right now.
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      09-08-2014, 09:49 PM   #4
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i just contacted them on facebook, and they told me they should have prototype e9x carbon driveshafts done this week. so it looks like this is happening.
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      09-08-2014, 10:09 PM   #5
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Uber awesome, thanks!
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      09-08-2014, 10:10 PM   #6
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Exciting!
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      09-08-2014, 10:12 PM   #7
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And how much loss improvement does it generate a quarter percent?
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      09-09-2014, 06:34 AM   #8
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Lighter DS have been dyno tested on other cars, with the most data on domestic V8 cars, and proven to reduce drivetrain loss. Not dramatically, but by more than 1/4%. If I had to guess, I would say on the order of 2-3%.

BMW is doing it -- spending the money -- for a reason. Definitely an expensive aftermarket performance item. I bought the chromoly DSS DS for my turbo 99M3, after breaking two stock aluminum DS at the dragstrip. The CF version was about $600 more. If you have all the toys and are looking for more and have the money, buy one.
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      09-09-2014, 06:45 AM   #9
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      09-09-2014, 08:44 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
Lighter DS have been dyno tested on other cars, with the most data on domestic V8 cars, and proven to reduce drivetrain loss. Not dramatically, but by more than 1/4%. If I had to guess, I would say on the order of 2-3%.

BMW is doing it -- spending the money -- for a reason. Definitely an expensive aftermarket performance item. I bought the chromoly DSS DS for my turbo 99M3, after breaking two stock aluminum DS at the dragstrip. The CF version was about $600 more. If you have all the toys and are looking for more and have the money, buy one.
So about 1 hp on a 300 whp car? If losses are 15 percent On my 360 hp m3 I have 54 hp loss at 15 percent. Saving 2.5 percent of that loss is 1.35hp.
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      09-09-2014, 08:49 AM   #11
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The I6 needs it because the crank is longer than the V8
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      09-09-2014, 09:24 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
So about 1 hp on a 300 whp car? If losses are 15 percent On my 360 hp m3 I have 54 hp loss at 15 percent. Saving 2.5 percent of that loss is 1.35hp.
No. When I say 2-3 percent improvement, I mean in rwhp. Do some research on the subject and see what you come up with. It is out there because I have read it before over the years, though generally for aluminum versus heavier steel.
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      09-09-2014, 09:41 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
So about 1 hp on a 300 whp car? If losses are 15 percent On my 360 hp m3 I have 54 hp loss at 15 percent. Saving 2.5 percent of that loss is 1.35hp.
2-3% would be more in the range of 7-10hp on a 360hp car, would make a pretty good difference on a supercharged car like mine, can't wait to see what this option will look like!!
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      09-09-2014, 10:36 AM   #14
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It is not just the small power increase. There is also a more direct feeling from a 1 piece DS. And a more rev-happy feeling from the lighter weight. It won't transform the car but if you already have all the other mods, consider this new one.
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      09-09-2014, 11:17 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
It is not just the small power increase. There is also a more direct feeling from a 1 piece DS. And a more rev-happy feeling from the lighter weight. It won't transform the car but if you already have all the other mods, consider this new one.
I may in the future thanks. Will have to research first.
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      09-09-2014, 11:18 AM   #16
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The center bearing wouldn't be needed with a CF driveshaft IIRC, so 1 hp and 1 less part to bust.
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      09-09-2014, 06:06 PM   #17
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there is some great discussion in this thread. if its in the same ballpark range as the carbon driveshaft for the e46 m3, i'll be getting it.
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...ber+driveshaft
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      09-09-2014, 09:36 PM   #18
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I wonder if there would be a cel. I know on subarus you risked a cel with too little rotational mass, so on the super advanced s65 (compared to the subaru) there's a very good chance of it having one too. You might have to add a tune to account for that, but I think it's worth it for a rev happy motor like ours.
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      09-09-2014, 11:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex07M3 View Post
2-3% would be more in the range of 7-10hp on a 360hp car, would make a pretty good difference on a supercharged car like mine, can't wait to see what this option will look like!!
I thought it reduced how much loss you have which usually is in fractions of percent. Like a light weight flywheel and clutch. You don't go from 15 percent loss to 10 percent with the drive shaft.
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      09-10-2014, 12:48 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Arben View Post
I wonder if there would be a cel. I know on subarus you risked a cel with too little rotational mass, so on the super advanced s65 (compared to the subaru) there's a very good chance of it having one too. You might have to add a tune to account for that, but I think it's worth it for a rev happy motor like ours.
What sensor would cause a CEL? Sounds a little far fetched to me because this would imply that going to a lightweight flywheel could cause a CEL.
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      09-10-2014, 01:48 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bdaddylo View Post
What sensor would cause a CEL? Sounds a little far fetched to me because this would imply that going to a lightweight flywheel could cause a CEL.
Again, I'm only saying this from my knowledge of subaru's, but a combination of a lightweight flywheel and pulley (or a very lightweight flywheel) was exactly what was causing the CEL on them. It's a misfire CEL, even if it's a false, it's nice not to have an orange light on your dash. This was with old subaru electronics, these cars are much more sensitive to these things.
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      09-10-2014, 06:33 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
I thought it reduced how much loss you have which usually is in fractions of percent. Like a light weight flywheel and clutch. You don't go from 15 percent loss to 10 percent with the drive shaft.
I agree 5% would be a lot. Do some research on what others have dyno tested and dragstrip tested. Even the dragstrip testing does not show transient response in normal or aggressive driving. It is pretty well proven on other cars, but part of the improvement does depend on weight reduction and I don't know the weight differences. My stock E36M3 driveshaft was very light, lighter than the DSS chromoly unit I replaced it with, but I needed a stronger one and could not afford the CF version. Still, BMW is doing it on the new M3. I doubt they would triple their costs for 1/4 of one percent.
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