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      12-08-2013, 03:39 PM   #1
rumelk
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Audio Change Help

Hi All

So my system has been in for a little while now, and i keep on blowing the SWS-8 under the seats. They're powered off a Alpine PDX - M6 which I know is too powerful but the aesthetics of the AMP mean that I cant change it. The gain's have been low and yet still they keep on burning out (blown 2 already). The PDX-M6 is outputting 600w RMS, so I wanted to know if there is anything on the market which will fit into the standard housing and output a minimum of 300w RMS.

The set up is as follows:

2 x Alpine PDX M6
1 x Alpine PDX F4
1 Audison Bit One
2 x Focal 100 KRS Components
1 x Alpine SWR-T10 (Ski Hatch, Custom Box)

Any help or suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks
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      12-09-2013, 01:58 AM   #2
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Hi pass the SWS8 at 60 to 70hz since you have a sub in the trunk you don't need to send the lowest freqs. to the SWS, think of them more as mid bass speakers then subs and you should be fine. Sounds like the single 10 out back is not enough for you, i would put in 2 10s or 1 good 12". The SWS are never gonna give you the hit like a good box and a pair of anything in the trunk.
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      12-09-2013, 12:32 PM   #3
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Have you deleted the stock amp entirely? I would just run that to the SWS and call it a day since you have the other sub for your main bass.
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      12-10-2013, 09:59 AM   #4
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Quote:
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Have you deleted the stock amp entirely? I would just run that to the SWS and call it a day since you have the other sub for your main bass.
Delete the stock amp?

I had a base audio system so no Hifi Amp.
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      12-10-2013, 10:00 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rumelk View Post
Delete the stock amp?

I had a base audio system so no Hifi Amp.
Understood. I would just run a smaller amp then to power the SWS.
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      12-10-2013, 09:24 PM   #6
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Quote:
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Understood. I would just run a smaller amp then to power the SWS.
Under powered subs will blow even easier if clipped all the time, the only way to stop blowing them is to high pass them, they will not produce 20,30,40hz even 50hz without generating heat in the coil when driven hard. remove the lowest stuff and they will be fine with your current amp setup.
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      12-11-2013, 06:38 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Understood. I would just run a smaller amp then to power the SWS.
As mentioned in the original message, I dont want to change the amps as the aethetics of the PDX in my set up will be ruined.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully1Time View Post
Under powered subs will blow even easier if clipped all the time, the only way to stop blowing them is to high pass them, they will not produce 20,30,40hz even 50hz without generating heat in the coil when driven hard. remove the lowest stuff and they will be fine with your current amp setup.
The Audison Bit one, when plugged into the PC will show clipping of any woofers, however cannot computer whether its being over powered or theres distorion going through the speakers, which I guess is where the keen hearing comes into.

Running the SWS -8 at high pass, is pointless imo, they were originally running at 80hz, but may have to increase to 100hz, keep the gain low.

Another alternative was to change the amp to the PDX F4 (4 channel) bridge it (resulting in 200w per channel) and then run the subs that way, and as Sully1Time mentioned originally, run it as mid bass.

Whats your thoughts?

A few pics of my set up



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      12-11-2013, 10:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rumelk View Post
As mentioned in the original message, I dont want to change the amps as the aethetics of the PDX in my set up will be ruined.



The Audison Bit one, when plugged into the PC will show clipping of any woofers, however cannot computer whether its being over powered or theres distorion going through the speakers, which I guess is where the keen hearing comes into.

Running the SWS -8 at high pass, is pointless imo, they were originally running at 80hz, but may have to increase to 100hz, keep the gain low.

Another alternative was to change the amp to the PDX F4 (4 channel) bridge it (resulting in 200w per channel) and then run the subs that way, and as Sully1Time mentioned originally, run it as mid bass.

Whats your thoughts?

A few pics of my set up
I know it sounds silly, but have you ever checked the phase of the SWS8s? How about phase & time between the 10" and the SWS8s, If your blowing them with a 80hz high pass then something is not set right. The BitOne is capable of adjusting both phase and time for accurate coherency at any seating position in the car. I have my bit one set to A) as the driver seat B) in-between the front seats C) the passenger seat D) driver seat with no trunk sub

Just setting the distance between drivers is not enough to get it right, I use Smaart7 with 3 RTA mics and actually check coherence at each position.
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      12-12-2013, 04:36 AM   #9
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The phase is on 0 and the time correction is off. Smaart7 seems like a good piece of kit, but at almost a 900 (1500 US) plus MIC's think il give that a miss.
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      12-12-2013, 10:45 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rumelk View Post
The phase is on 0 and the time correction is off. Smaart7 seems like a good piece of kit, but at almost a 900 (1500 US) plus MIC's think il give that a miss.
I am a touring concert FOH engineer so Smaart7 is part of my every day life while working, you could easily rent a Smaart rig from any of your local sound co. Brittania row, Eighth day Sound, SSE, Skan, for 1 day and get it perfect.

Coherency is when the sound from the speakers all arrive at the same time and is a big deal when multiple sources produce the same freq.

But i would put money on you have a physical phase issue between your SWS8, or SWS8 and your single 10", which means they are canceling what each other do, so you have the gain set so you hear anything.

Find the Focal test CD online and use the phase test track to audibly check your SWS for phase.

Get a tape measure out and measure the distance between your head and all the speakers, then enter the data into the BitOne so at least you have it close time wise.

Most important is check the phase between the SWS8.

Where are you located?
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      12-13-2013, 09:54 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully1Time View Post
I am a touring concert FOH engineer so Smaart7 is part of my every day life while working, you could easily rent a Smaart rig from any of your local sound co. Brittania row, Eighth day Sound, SSE, Skan, for 1 day and get it perfect.

Coherency is when the sound from the speakers all arrive at the same time and is a big deal when multiple sources produce the same freq.

But i would put money on you have a physical phase issue between your SWS8, or SWS8 and your single 10", which means they are canceling what each other do, so you have the gain set so you hear anything.

Find the Focal test CD online and use the phase test track to audibly check your SWS for phase.

Get a tape measure out and measure the distance between your head and all the speakers, then enter the data into the BitOne so at least you have it close time wise.

Most important is check the phase between the SWS8.

Where are you located?
Definitely some pro advice!
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      12-16-2013, 06:40 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sully1Time View Post
I am a touring concert FOH engineer so Smaart7 is part of my every day life while working, you could easily rent a Smaart rig from any of your local sound co. Brittania row, Eighth day Sound, SSE, Skan, for 1 day and get it perfect.

Coherency is when the sound from the speakers all arrive at the same time and is a big deal when multiple sources produce the same freq.

But i would put money on you have a physical phase issue between your SWS8, or SWS8 and your single 10", which means they are canceling what each other do, so you have the gain set so you hear anything.

Find the Focal test CD online and use the phase test track to audibly check your SWS for phase.

Get a tape measure out and measure the distance between your head and all the speakers, then enter the data into the BitOne so at least you have it close time wise.

Most important is check the phase between the SWS8.

Where are you located?
I guess I will have to give this a shot to get the best sound. Im based in London, UK. Feel like doing a long haul flight?
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      12-16-2013, 07:17 PM   #13
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I guess I will have to give this a shot to get the best sound. Im based in London, UK. Feel like doing a long haul flight?
You Buying? Business Class Please!!!

I can't stress to you enough how important time alignment is for the overall sound of your system, installing as much as you have, with a BitOne and not time aligning is kind of a waste of money.

But once again physical phase is crucial for time alignment to even matter!!

email me if you need help!
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      12-17-2013, 10:07 AM   #14
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hahah, I think we can do First class, If EasyJet allows that LOL

I'll whip out the laptop and give you a shout if needed, Thanks again
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