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      08-22-2007, 08:26 PM   #1
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M5s rusting on dealer lots?

Several posters have commented on BMW messing up M5 pricing and M5s supposedly rusting on dealer lots. Fact or (Audi troll induced) fiction? What was BMW's target volume, and how many have they sold? How about the M6?

I am obviously wondering about the implications of those facts for the M3 pricing.
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      08-22-2007, 08:42 PM   #2
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There's been an M5 and M6 at my dealer since I took delivery of my car last October (I was last there about a month and a half ago). Funny you mentioned rust....one of the things I noticed was that on both cars there was a lot of rust accumulating on the rotors.
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      08-22-2007, 08:45 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by normtrum View Post
There's been an M5 and M6 at my dealer since I took delivery of my car last October (I was last there about a month and a half ago). Funny you mentioned rust....one of the things I noticed was that on both cars there was a lot of rust accumulating on the rotors.
Wow, you're saying the cars have been sitting there for at least 10 months?
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      08-22-2007, 08:52 PM   #4
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Wow, you're saying the cars have been sitting there for at least 10 months?
Ya, can you believe that? Like I said it's been about 6 weeks since I've been there, but I'm actually going back this next tuesday to have some new wheels mounted, and I always check for them (I like to walk around the lot while I'm waiting). The M5 is gorgeous too. Black with grey leather. Looks amazing. You'd think they would offer some killer deals on these cars to get em out of there....that's a lot of inventory tied up in only 2 cars...almost 200k!
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      08-22-2007, 08:59 PM   #5
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I am one that has mentioned the M5 and M5 rusting on dealer lots.

Like the poster above, there has been a black M5 mannual (priced at 99K) and an Indianapolis Red M6 SMG (104K) on my dealer's lot since last November.

Both cars have rust on the calipers.

I can't imagine anyone paying those prices for a car not tailored specifically to what the end-consumer wants.

This is the evidence I have when making claims that BMW are WAY overshooting the pricing on their latest M models.
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      08-22-2007, 09:07 PM   #6
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really good post and that's a good point.

thanks
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      08-22-2007, 09:32 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by normtrum View Post
Ya, can you believe that? Like I said it's been about 6 weeks since I've been there, but I'm actually going back this next tuesday to have some new wheels mounted, and I always check for them (I like to walk around the lot while I'm waiting). The M5 is gorgeous too. Black with grey leather. Looks amazing. You'd think they would offer some killer deals on these cars to get em out of there....that's a lot of inventory tied up in only 2 cars...almost 200k!
The funny thing is, I checked KBB, and there aren't any incentives for the M5 or the M6. That's why those cars will continue to sit on the lot for another 6 months! Ouch!

I think the dealers get special financing from BMW for inventory, and interest rates are low by historical standards.
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      08-22-2007, 11:47 PM   #8
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Offering a bit of evidence in the other direction:

When I put my deposit down at a local bay area dealership (East Bay BMW) for the M3 the associate and I had a quick conversation about inventory/allocation and he mentioned that one of his customers had been looking for an M5 for months and had a deposit at this dealership for 1 but couldn't get 1 allocated. He said the customer eventually took back his deposit after finding an available spot in SoCal. Obviously don't know exactly how truthful it is but that's what I've heard.
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      08-23-2007, 12:15 AM   #9
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Ya, same here. At my dealership there are 2 M5's as well as a M6 Cab just sitting there. Probably for around 4-5 months.
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      08-23-2007, 12:20 AM   #10
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my local dealer is selling M5's with a $25k mark-up = $119k........

and M6's with a $40k mark-up = $146k..........

then again....they're selling the 335i cabrio for $72k.............

Go figure...........
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      08-23-2007, 12:42 AM   #11
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WHAT??????????? A mark-up on an M5????? I am a dealer(in exotic used cars) and you can pick up an 06' with 15k miles for around $64.5, 07' 7K miles $78K and I could get a new 08' for $5000 off MSRP. I also live on the West Coast. Newport Beach. I know this because I have bought 3 for customers. They are SOFT!!!! I like driving the M5 though. I am looking myself for one around $61K under 20K miles. I will be able to pick one up in about a month. If any one needs a car, give me a heads up. Porsche, Bently, BMW, Honda Civic etc............
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      08-23-2007, 12:46 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NaTuReB0Y View Post
my local dealer is selling M5's with a $25k mark-up = $119k........

and M6's with a $40k mark-up = $146k..........

then again....they're selling the 335i cabrio for $72k.............

Go figure...........
That's amazing. Well, I guess if they're actully selling them, obviously there's people who are willing to pay that price.

40k mark up for a M6 really blows me away. I'm not even sure they charge that much in Australia!
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      08-23-2007, 12:49 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Bruno View Post
WHAT??????????? A mark-up on an M5????? I am a dealer(in exotic used cars) and you can pick up an 06' with 15k miles for around $64.5, 07' 7K miles $78K and I could get a new 08' for $5000 off MSRP. I also live on the West Coast. Newport Beach. I know this because I have bought 3 for customers. They are SOFT!!!! I like driving the M5 though. I am looking myself for one around $61K under 20K miles. I will be able to pick one up in about a month. If any one needs a car, give me a heads up. Porsche, Bently, BMW, Honda Civic etc............
the next time i am there......hopefully soon....second free oil change at 40k+ miles.

i will take some pictures of the price and it's mark-ups.

i guaranteed the new M3s will be mark-up to sell at over $80k+.........
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      08-23-2007, 12:52 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Bruno View Post
WHAT??????????? A mark-up on an M5????? I am a dealer(in exotic used cars) and you can pick up an 06' with 15k miles for around $64.5, 07' 7K miles $78K and I could get a new 08' for $5000 off MSRP. I also live on the West Coast. Newport Beach. I know this because I have bought 3 for customers. They are SOFT!!!! I like driving the M5 though. I am looking myself for one around $61K under 20K miles. I will be able to pick one up in about a month. If any one needs a car, give me a heads up. Porsche, Bently, BMW, Honda Civic etc............
haha ill let you know if i need one of those

i find it strange that you say you can make deals on them while i assume others wont because of the fact that theyre are sitting on lots for so long, am i assuming wrong, whats the reason theyre not moving more quickly?
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      08-23-2007, 12:57 AM   #15
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I work at a BMW dealer on the gold coast in Australia, We dont even have M5 's on our show room. we had one that lasted a couple of weeks. M6's we have 1 only now , which is a convertible. 335i SOLD OUT...... can only deliver them JAN 08 onwards. New M3 have 20+ orders filled and we still have driven or touched the new car.
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      08-23-2007, 01:56 AM   #16
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I seriously think the M5's extremely thirsty engine and lack of range (16.6 gallon tank, 12 MPG = 190 mile range - yikes) combined with the jerky SMG in a performance/luxury sedan have hurt its sales. I also think they overpriced it, especially when ordered with all the goodies.

I hope this will keep them realistic about the M3 pricing. If they want to sell 100,000 M3s they can't get too greedy with the pricing.

BTW, a slightly used M5 sounds like a good deal!
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      08-23-2007, 03:16 AM   #17
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FYI a south Texas dealer is getting 5K over sticker without any problem on 2008 M3's...people are lining up.
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      08-23-2007, 03:27 AM   #18
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One figure

Good idea. One figure I located was the total volume of E39 M5s built over its 5 year span. That number is 20482. All the rest of the volume information about E60 M5 I could find was NA only and assuming something like 50% of the total volume is NA would be reasonable but quite rough. T Bone, our resident M5 expert should be able to help, or south. Perhaps the worldwide numers are easier to find in German.
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      08-23-2007, 08:21 AM   #19
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Ruling out exotic cars, dealer mark-ups are meaningless unless customers are paying for them. Asking price is not the transaction price. The dealer markup is an intimidation tactic in the negotiation game for people who don't know how to negotiate. (There is a VW dealer in Oakland where ALL cars in the lot are marked up about $3k. Do you really thing people are paying that for Golfs?) As to the M3s, there are plenty of dealers across the US that are happy to take orders down at MSRP, including mine in Boston.
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      08-23-2007, 08:34 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Ruling out exotic cars, dealer mark-ups are meaningless unless customers are paying for them. Asking price is not the transaction price. The dealer markup is an intimidation tactic in the negotiation game for people who don't know how to negotiate. (There is a VW dealer in Oakland where ALL cars in the lot are marked up about $3k. Do you really thing people are paying that for Golfs?) As to the M3s, there are plenty of dealers across the US that are happy to take orders down at MSRP, including mine in Boston.
My dealer only sells at MSRP or below, as well. I would not go to a dealer who plays those ADP games unless it was a last resort. Maybe that's not logical since you expect markdowns when supply exceeds demand. I think US dealers have put themselves in a bad situation by games and discounts over the years.
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      08-23-2007, 10:27 AM   #21
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I think it also depends on where the dealer is- in some parts of the country I can easily see and M5 or M6 sitting around for quite a while.

In other parts,
say like sunny, image conscious, willing to pay almost any ridiculous price just to get it before my neighbor does Southern California then they will move quicker..............
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      08-23-2007, 02:16 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Several posters have commented on BMW messing up M5 pricing and M5s supposedly rusting on dealer lots. Fact or (Audi troll induced) fiction? What was BMW's target volume, and how many have they sold? How about the M6?

I am obviously wondering about the implications of those facts for the M3 pricing.
M5's don't sell because they are cold to the touch. Too much isolation. It requires going over 120mph before the car can be appreciated. In U.S. that is just not possible..... BMW should consider this..... There was no problem with E39 M5?
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