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      07-20-2007, 11:05 AM   #45
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thing is guys was there ever a negative review of the E46 ///M3. The way i recall it was hands done the best in its class no doubt .. thats why i bought one ... the E92 M3 just isn't the same, value for money right now, the 335i looks a better option, have to agree ... BTW i have owned a good few ///M model BMWs ... so yes after having the 335i you wonder sh1t if the 335i is so awesome wonder how the E92 ///M3 will be ... i wanted to read every review saying how awesome this car is and is the king ... and it ain't ... disappointed to say the least
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      07-20-2007, 11:11 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by adamr View Post
thing is guys was there ever a negative review of the E46 ///M3. The way i recall it was hands done the best in its class no doubt .. thats why i bought one ... the E92 M3 just isn't the same, value for money right now, the 335i looks a better option, have to agree ... BTW i have owned a good few ///M model BMWs ... so yes after having the 335i you wonder sh1t if the 335i is so awesome wonder how the E92 ///M3 will be ... i wanted to read every review saying how awesome this car is and is the king ... and it ain't ... disappointed to say the least
There's actually a thread that lists the e46 reviews. They are eerily similar.
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      07-21-2007, 12:52 PM   #47
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Some people like their cars fast out of the box. Even though you would only be spending less than 10k to make the 335 pretty comparable in terms of performance numbers, a lot of people don't want to go through the hassle of modding their cars and possibly voiding their warranty. The question for me is if the m3 is around 70k with options, should I start to consider the z06 for around the same price?

I too flirted with the z06. Go sit in one and you'll be disappointed. Plus you have to expect it will have the Vette rattle in a few years and things start to deteriorate and fall apart. The glue comes undone and the dash falls to the floor. That kind of thing. Plus, these cars can't withstand beat up roads whereas a BMW can.
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      07-22-2007, 01:04 AM   #48
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If I am not mistaken when the E46 M3 came out the price difference between a comparably equipped 330i and M3 was about $10K, and no one thought twice about which one they would get as a performance car. There was a huge performance difference in straight line speed and in the corners.

Now, if the base E92 costs over $60K like most mags are predicting, there will be a $20K price difference between the 335i and the M3. Meanwhile the 335i (stock) is running 13.4 @ 105 in the 1/4 mile and the M3 is running 12.9 at 111. This is not a huge difference when you take the $20K price gap into account. Then factor in the easier tunability of the turbo six that will evaporate the performance difference (and possibly give the edge to the 335i) and also factor in the availability of a $2K LSD and suddenly that $20K price gap seems huge.

If it weren't for the existence of the 335i I would be a lot more excited about the new M3. Also, priced in the mid $60ks the M3 runs into some tough competition (Cayman S, Z06, Skyline GTR) that will get tougher as time marches on.
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      07-22-2007, 01:28 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by e36jakeo View Post
If I am not mistaken when the E46 M3 came out the price difference between a comparably equipped 330i and M3 was about $10K, and no one thought twice about which one they would get as a performance car. There was a huge performance difference in straight line speed and in the corners.

Now, if the base E92 costs over $60K like most mags are predicting, there will be a $20K price difference between the 335i and the M3. Meanwhile the 335i (stock) is running 13.4 @ 105 in the 1/4 mile and the M3 is running 12.9 at 111. This is not a huge difference when you take the $20K price gap into account. Then factor in the easier tunability of the turbo six that will evaporate the performance difference (and possibly give the edge to the 335i) and also factor in the availability of a $2K LSD and suddenly that $20K price gap seems huge.

If it weren't for the existence of the 335i I would be a lot more excited about the new M3. Also, priced in the mid $60ks the M3 runs into some tough competition (Cayman S, Z06, Skyline GTR) that will get tougher as time marches on.
Can someone please tell me again what mods will make the 335i as fast as the M3?
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      07-22-2007, 01:36 AM   #50
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Can someone please tell me again what mods will make the 335i as fast as the M3?
Epacy, looks like your causing trouble again. I like your to the point response. Jakeo has a few good points though.
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      07-22-2007, 01:45 AM   #51
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Epacy, looks like your causing trouble again. I like your to the point response. Jakeo has a few good points though.
Causing trouble? That is only in how someone takes it.

I think I can recite the needed modifications and their approx dollar value by heart now.
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      07-22-2007, 01:50 AM   #52
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Causing trouble? That is only in how someone takes it.

I think I can recite the needed modifications and their approx dollar value by heart now.
It's my way of saying you are the man.
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      07-22-2007, 01:57 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Causing trouble? That is only in how someone takes it.

I think I can recite the needed modifications and their approx dollar value by heart now.
OK I am switching to the dark side... JK...

Just finished getting in to "it", i.e. this with him over at the other board. IF the Vishnu fellow can get over 400 hp and tq from the 335i and you slap a LSD and coilovers on the 335i it is going to be pretty damn fast. I keep hearing he will be getting that but I have not seen it yet. Of course you'll have to add a $6k BBK for any serious track work. With these mods in many performance contests this heavily modded car will give the M3 a serious run. However, once you consider the whole package (high speed stability, steering feel, handling, fun factor, reliability, hassle, etc., etc.) is will still be no contest.
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      07-22-2007, 02:18 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
OK I am switching to the dark side... JK...

Just finished getting in to "it", i.e. this with him over at the other board. IF the Vishnu fellow can get over 400 hp and tq from the 335i and you slap a LSD and coilovers on the 335i it is going to be pretty damn fast. I keep hearing he will be getting that but I have not seen it yet. Of course you'll have to add a $6k BBK for any serious track work. With these mods in many performance contests this heavily modded car will give the M3 a serious run. However, once you consider the whole package (high speed stability, steering feel, handling, fun factor, reliability, hassle, etc., etc.) is will still be no contest.
Sounds like steering is actually better in the 335. Reliability may not be as good as the straight six, even with the added complication and possible heat issues due to turbo charging. High reving V8 racing engines can be finicky and operate at very high tolerances. In addition, all the electronics and software on the e92 scares the bejeebus out of me as far as reliability. Only need to read the M5 forums to get a taste of that. Otherwise, I couldn't agree more. Mods are not the way to go if reliability is an important factor. Mods also tend to be real negative with resale value.
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      07-22-2007, 04:10 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Car Enthusiast View Post
I get a little frustrated seeing all the M-loving worshippers on this Board get offended by any question as to the supremacy of their M's.
Do you know whats THE most frustrating or overused sight on this and darn near everyother car forum? " 335 with a Procede/xcede and an exhaust. ....."

From a non M-loving whorshipper fanperson... This type of thread is annoying because....

1. You think this is the 1st one to compare the 2 cars? This must be the 100th "comparison" already.
2. Damn car isnt even out to the public yet. Is it too much to ask if we can test it out and decide for ourselfs, instead of taking some mag or online reviewers word for it?
3. Not everyone buys a car for 1/4mi, 0-62 or time around the ring etc.. etc..
4. The 335 and M3 share what? A couple of doors and trunk lid? Lot more than a chip, exhaust and some tires...
5. Sister to #2 Its "absurd" to go magazine racing or make a choice by a magazines (review) word ALONE.

Bottom line for me is....Dont care if other cars faster etc.. Or this guy said this and that guy said that. So unless this car is released to the general public and proper roadtests/reviews are done and most importantly until my very own butt touches the seat, everythings just speculation.

Btw I wonder how many of these "New" 1-3 posts members/critics are just offspring of previous critics?

Last edited by Tobizach; 07-22-2007 at 04:28 AM.
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      07-22-2007, 06:13 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
OK I am switching to the dark side... JK...

Just finished getting in to "it", i.e. this with him over at the other board. IF the Vishnu fellow can get over 400 hp and tq from the 335i and you slap a LSD and coilovers on the 335i it is going to be pretty damn fast. I keep hearing he will be getting that but I have not seen it yet. Of course you'll have to add a $6k BBK for any serious track work. With these mods in many performance contests this heavily modded car will give the M3 a serious run. However, once you consider the whole package (high speed stability, steering feel, handling, fun factor, reliability, hassle, etc., etc.) is will still be no contest.
A 335 with those mods will be fast, but say goodbye to the drivetrain warranty unless you are willing to try to conceal what you have done to the car. There are already threads on the Forced Induction forum about whether to remove the controller, etc. when the car goes in for major work. . . "have it towed to your house first, remove everything and then have it towed to the dealer". To use your expression, ugh.
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      07-22-2007, 08:13 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tobizach View Post
Do you know whats THE most frustrating or overused sight on this and darn near everyother car forum? " 335 with a Procede/xcede and an exhaust. ....."

From a non M-loving whorshipper fanperson... This type of thread is annoying because....

1. You think this is the 1st one to compare the 2 cars? This must be the 100th "comparison" already.
2. Damn car isnt even out to the public yet. Is it too much to ask if we can test it out and decide for ourselfs, instead of taking some mag or online reviewers word for it?
3. Not everyone buys a car for 1/4mi, 0-62 or time around the ring etc.. etc..
4. The 335 and M3 share what? A couple of doors and trunk lid? Lot more than a chip, exhaust and some tires...
5. Sister to #2 Its "absurd" to go magazine racing or make a choice by a magazines (review) word ALONE.

Bottom line for me is....Dont care if other cars faster etc.. Or this guy said this and that guy said that. So unless this car is released to the general public and proper roadtests/reviews are done and most importantly until my very own butt touches the seat, everythings just speculation.

Btw I wonder how many of these "New" 1-3 posts members/critics are just offspring of previous critics?
It appears that this talk simply won't end--even after the car comes out. There will always be another 335 owner who has this brilliant idea that his/her car can be somehow faster than the M3 with an array of mods, and registers on this forum just to share his/her brilliant thinking with us without searching to see if the topic has already been beaten to death. When called upon, he/she will state that we are hostile and all he/she was trying to achieve was to establish a collective discussion on the issue. I just wish they stuck to a single thread or something that I could ignore forever...
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      07-22-2007, 11:11 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Caravello View Post
I too flirted with the z06. Go sit in one and you'll be disappointed. Plus you have to expect it will have the Vette rattle in a few years and things start to deteriorate and fall apart. The glue comes undone and the dash falls to the floor. That kind of thing...
This seems a little harsh. I wasn't disappointed with the Z06 interior - but then again, I'm used to Vette engineering/development money being spent elsewhere. It's definitely a little low rent for the money, but for those who feel that the interior is the ne plus ultra of cardom, Audi is definitely the way to go. Not BMW. I understand the Chevy guys are addressing the interior (for those who care) with a $4k optional fix for '08.

Vette rattles pretty much disappeared with the advent of the C5 back in '97, although the C4 had them in abundance with its flexible flyer chassis. The C6 is an extremely rigid ride, however. Nothing has been falling off Vettes for at least ten years, so turn your wayback machine to "current day", and take a C6 for a drive.


"Plus, these cars can't withstand beat up roads whereas a BMW can."

Now you're onto something - sorta.

Vettes are OK on less than perfect back roads, but they don't engender confidence in the driver. You *can* really hammer along, but intuitively, you're going to be backing off. On track, where you can repetitively deal with bumps until you're going flat out, Vettes can destroy anything made by BMW.

But tracks are where we spend one or two percent of our driving time, and if you find joy in bombing and strafing back roads into oblivion, then a BMW is what you want for that work. Because of the fact that they generally provide the best ride/handling compromise across the board, BMWs make the absolute best back road bandits. If you're in a Z06 or Z51 Vette on a less than perfect back road, behind even an E46 M3 who's at all serious, you're not going to be able to stay with the bimmer unless you are completely out of your mind. On track, you'll kick his ass, but on those roads, he *owns* you.

We can all bitch about how BMWs are getting too big and heavy to be driving fun (God knows I do), but your bimmer will simply slice, dice and have those back roads for breakfast - even the E9X cars.

It may be magic.

Bruce
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      07-22-2007, 01:14 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epacy View Post
Can someone please tell me again what mods will make the 335i as fast as the M3?
One Procede tune from Vishnu and your at 365 rwhp and torque in a 335i- thats about 400+ HP/torque to the crank. E92 M3 sits at 414hp to the crank, and 295 lb feets of torque.
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      07-22-2007, 01:18 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by lucid View Post
It appears that this talk simply won't end--even after the car comes out. There will always be another 335 owner who has this brilliant idea that his/her car can be somehow faster than the M3 with an array of mods, and registers on this forum just to share his/her brilliant thinking with us without searching to see if the topic has already been beaten to death. When called upon, he/she will state that we are hostile and all he/she was trying to achieve was to establish a collective discussion on the issue. I just wish they stuck to a single thread or something that I could ignore forever...
Didnt your mother ever tell you.... If you have nothing niceto say, then dont say it at all.
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      07-22-2007, 01:23 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by revah2 View Post
One Procede tune from Vishnu and your at 365 rwhp and torque in a 335i- thats about 400+ HP/torque to the crank. E92 M3 sits at 414hp to the crank, and 295 lb feets of torque.
Can you please point out this offer, what parts it consists of, hp/tq estimates and the place on the manufacturers web site where you got this information?

Also totally agree with the other that this topic is a extremely well beaten DEAD HORSE. Also this particular foray is a nice thread hi-jack as well...
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      07-22-2007, 01:57 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Can you please point out this offer, what parts it consists of, hp/tq estimates and the place on the manufacturers web site where you got this information?

Also totally agree with the other that this topic is a extremely well beaten DEAD HORSE. Also this particular foray is a nice thread hi-jack as well...
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...t=procede+v2.0
Carrera S stock- runs a 12.6 1/4 mile @112mph. Heres a thread where a 335i owner with just procede tune beats a stock carrera S on 2 different rolls. Wait a minute, if the 335i is beating a carrera S, and the carrera S is getting a faster quarter mile then the new e92 M3, then doesnt this 335i with one mod already beat the M3 in a straight line?
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      07-22-2007, 02:12 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by revah2 View Post
One Procede tune from Vishnu and your at 365 rwhp and torque in a 335i- thats about 400+ HP/torque to the crank. E92 M3 sits at 414hp to the crank, and 295 lb feets of torque.
Hi revah, this is sarcasm. Have we met?
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      07-22-2007, 02:17 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by revah2 View Post
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...t=procede+v2.0
Carrera S stock- runs a 12.6 1/4 mile @112mph. Heres a thread where a 335i owner with just procede tune beats a stock carrera S on 2 different rolls. Wait a minute, if the 335i is beating a carrera S, and the carrera S is getting a faster quarter mile then the new e92 M3, then doesnt this 335i with one mod already beat the M3 in a straight line?
OMG do you know what ANECDOTAL means. This dribble is nothing even close to what I was asking for, clearly this could be nothing more than a driver issue.

I wanted to see where on the Vishnu site you can get 400+ hp at the crank, what this system consists of and how much it costs.
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      07-22-2007, 02:33 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
OMG do you know what ANECDOTAL means. This dribble is nothing even close to what I was asking for, clearly this could be nothing more than a driver issue.

I wanted to see where on the Vishnu site you can get 400+ hp at the crank, what this system consists of and how much it costs.
I apologize, I confused Procede with the tune from Active Autowerk. Either way, both Companies use the Same ECU interceptor: Xede
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ht=xede+update
The Dyno reads 361 rwhp and 402 rwtorque, do the math. Thats ONE tune, ONE Xede, and like i said about 400+ HP. Dont give me the driver issue bullshit.And dont play stupid, you and I both know its not a driver issue, you'd have to be retarded to gravely influence the outcome of a race, especially on a roll. Ill take my chances and say both drivers know where their clutches are, and know how to shift gears.
Anecdotal- (def) Pertaining to the relationship of figures or to the arrangement of elements in a scene so as to emphasize the story content of a subject.
Example Sentence: "There are anecdotal reports of children poisoned by hot dogs roasted over a fire of the oleander stems"
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      07-22-2007, 02:44 PM   #66
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Stock C6 corvettes rated at 400HP dyno at around 345 rwhp. Still need help with the math?
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