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      07-11-2012, 08:31 AM   #23
shah269
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How many M's are sold with slush O matics? Or flappy paddles?
Way more than those sold with 6 speeds!

It is what it is....our asses are getting fatter and cars are costing us more.
What's the 1M selling for? $65k....$65 freaking K
Hell how much is a new 135I? $45k? WTF!

Sorry boys as the price of these great cars goes up expect people with more moeny and less desire to buy them.

Such is ife...the fat of the land will rule us all.
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      07-11-2012, 08:45 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shah269 View Post
How many M's are sold with slush O matics? Or flappy paddles?
Way more than those sold with 6 speeds!

It is what it is....our asses are getting fatter and cars are costing us more.
What's the 1M selling for? $65k....$65 freaking K
Hell how much is a new 135I? $45k? WTF!

Sorry boys as the price of these great cars goes up expect people with more moeny and less desire to buy them.

Such is ife...the fat of the land will rule us all.
Yeah, as an auto enthusiast, i'm going to say the golden age of cars where you could buy off the lot and live the dream with NA engines and $1 gas was about 87'-99'. It's ova......
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      07-11-2012, 12:02 PM   #25
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BMW will soon be offering extra M badges as a separate option on all cars. The first badge will be $500 and every additional badge will be $100, until you reach five and then the price will drop to $20 per badge. Sadly, there will be no further discount for bulk orders of more than 20.
That is freaking hysterical and pretty much sums up how they've gone from expensive but good and largely understated to look at me garbage and shameless extortion.
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      07-11-2012, 12:37 PM   #26
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So nobody cares that this isn't unprecedented? And that BMW has put M in front of a normal model designation before? They actually did it a lot in the 80s
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      07-11-2012, 12:56 PM   #27
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That doesn't make it right. The Germans have a pretty extensive history of horrible atrocities that I hope never repeat themselves.
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      07-11-2012, 01:00 PM   #28
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It's happening in all the adjacent brands. AMG went soft and then added Black Edition cars. Audi gave up on S as the performance line and created RS and so on. Will we see a BMW RM?

Only thing I agree with is that brand dilution sucks. While it bolsters the name/market value of the brand, it dilutes the purpose which ultimately means it goes away or becomes meaningless and thereby destroys the brand it was trying to bolster. I feel as though BMW M division should have stuck to only cars - I don't even like the concept of M sport packages on regular cars.

As to the OP - I think you'd be surprised just how many groceries you can pack into a Cayman! Remember, they have TWO trunks.

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      07-11-2012, 01:20 PM   #29
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Can't say I disagree with what was written by that jalopnik.com author.

BMW //M has been more Luxury than Motorsport. Like some say //M stands more for Marketing than Motorsport. I think we all would like to see a more hard core //M car(s) being made for us.

At least give us the option of ordering a car the way WE WANT it build - at a low price point. Perhaps with delete options and a super low base price. And let the posers buy the fully loaded limited edition models/versions - so BMW can pad their bottom line.

As Jeremy Clarkson once said... "...clearly car makers do not make money on selling new cars... they make money on selling (us the) OPTIONS"!!
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      07-11-2012, 01:23 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ptack View Post
BMW will soon be offering extra M badges as a separate option on all cars. The first badge will be $500 and every additional badge will be $100, until you reach five and then the price will drop to $20 per badge. Sadly, there will be no further discount for bulk orders of more than 20.
Thats just what we need. A BMW with 20 M badges
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      07-11-2012, 01:25 PM   #31
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When I was a child we had to walk 30 miles to school every day. And it was uphill... BOTH WAYS!
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      07-11-2012, 03:06 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dackelone View Post
Can't say I disagree with what was written by that jalopnik.com author.

BMW //M has been more Luxury than Motorsport. Like some say //M stands more for Marketing than Motorsport. I think we all would like to see a more hard core //M car(s) being made for us.

At least give us the option of ordering a car the way WE WANT it build - at a low price point. Perhaps with delete options and a super low base price. And let the posers buy the fully loaded limited edition models/versions - so BMW can pad their bottom line.

As Jeremy Clarkson once said... "...clearly car makers do not make money on selling new cars... they make money on selling (us the) OPTIONS"!!
I fully agree with your post and have to say the article did have a lot of good points. My frustration isnt at the point of the author or even close, but one can't say he doesn't touch on some truth.

even though my current car is a non M, i was just as upset as the 'M' car owners when I saw the new 'M' line vehicles coming out. It is really cheapening.
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      07-11-2012, 03:28 PM   #33
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u guys need to watch the movie "in paris"

then realize

people always consider the "old" times, better. As an example, old IBM M keyboards lasts longer, types better and can be used as a weapon with its 5lb steel backplate. Nowadays keyboards die in a few month, eh?
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      07-11-2012, 03:43 PM   #34
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Quote:
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u guys need to watch the movie "in paris"

then realize

people always consider the "old" times, better. As an example, old IBM M keyboards lasts longer, types better and can be used as a weapon with its 5lb steel backplate. Nowadays keyboards die in a few month, eh?
IBM is a bad example because old IBM stuff is legit agog bulletproof.

I had a topspec '99 think pad laptop that I abused the crap of. That notebook fell 25 feet onto concrete, was overclocked by 40% it's entire life, and was even set on fire once.

When it was over, I sealed the hole from the flame with some petex and it stayed like that for a month until I could get a new case for it.

In other words you picked a bad example - because IBM used to make some legitimately fantastic products
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      07-11-2012, 06:14 PM   #35
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Read the article and it has a few good points and some bad ones, sure an E30 M3 was an amazing car, it feels like you are part of the car no aids at all, an E46 M3 looks great doesn´t feel outdated (IMO), and still they are daily drivers, but depending on the road can be really harsh hard. an e9X M3, feels more soft, but a lot more quick than any other m3, i was in cincinnati last week and i cant imagine a car without a/c, M3 or porsche gt3 rs just coz a true racing car doesnt need a/c, has 5 point seatbelt and a 6 speed manual.... and no radio. but that "new" SE M3, has nothing special about it, only if you are skip barber
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      07-11-2012, 07:05 PM   #36
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In general, I think BMW has morphed into more of a luxury brand, which has been very profitable for them. All well and good. I just wish they would ship *one* performance minded M model to the US. Just one. For less than $50K. That's all I'm asking for. The 1M was close enough for my tastes even though it wasn't a "true" M car.
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      07-11-2012, 07:46 PM   #37
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Yes, but the reality is that people say they want a more hardcore, lighter, no AC, no Radio, no back seat, etc... sports car, but they won't buy it at BMW prices.

Subyota just released the BRZ/FRS, how many of you will actually buy one, or even consider buying one?
It's a low cost excellent handling sports car, lightweight, and with a good power to weight ratio. Yet, it's already being knocked for not having enough power. When the turbo's get released they'll sell more, but most BMW enthusiasts will find ways to hate on it anyway, declaring how bland the interior is, and how much cheap plastic it has, and how few luxury items come standard, blah blah.
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      07-11-2012, 07:58 PM   #38
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So nobody cares that this isn't unprecedented? And that BMW has put M in front of a normal model designation before? They actually did it a lot in the 80s
I'd like to see that plethora of 1980s BMWs in this country that weren't actual M cars. One that I found was M635CSi but it was called M6 here and it wouldn't say it was normal. I think the point is that cars with no M model pedigree or input whatsoever are being slathered with M badging because it sells and everyone wants to think they drive a racecar to work. I say leave that crap for dummies to do on their own, don't pimp out the M brand. On the other hand when you dilute it as much as they have in recent years from within I guess it doesn't really matter anymore, shame really.
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      07-11-2012, 08:08 PM   #39
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Yes, but the reality is that people say they want a more hardcore, lighter, no AC, no Radio, no back seat, etc... sports car, but they won't buy it at BMW prices.

Subyota just released the BRZ/FRS, how many of you will actually buy one, or even consider buying one?
It's a low cost excellent handling sports car, lightweight, and with a good power to weight ratio. Yet, it's already being knocked for not having enough power. When the turbo's get released they'll sell more, but most BMW enthusiasts will find ways to hate on it anyway, declaring how bland the interior is, and how much cheap plastic it has, and how few luxury items come standard, blah blah.
I had an FR-S on order but found a lightly used 2009 CPO 135i. 40-50 more hp would have sealed the deal. It's not a BMW. It is a great car.
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      07-11-2012, 08:09 PM   #40
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Yes, but the reality is that people say they want a more hardcore, lighter, no AC, no Radio, no back seat, etc... sports car, but they won't buy it at BMW prices.

Subyota just released the BRZ/FRS, how many of you will actually buy one, or even consider buying one?
It's a low cost excellent handling sports car, lightweight, and with a good power to weight ratio. Yet, it's already being knocked for not having enough power. When the turbo's get released they'll sell more, but most BMW enthusiasts will find ways to hate on it anyway, declaring how bland the interior is, and how much cheap plastic it has, and how few luxury items come standard, blah blah.
I won't hate on it, but with a toddler and a 40m one way commute just don't think it will fit the bill, otherwise I'm very happy they made these cars and really hope they do well.
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      07-11-2012, 08:19 PM   #41
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I'd like to see that plethora of 1980s BMWs in this country that weren't actual M cars. One that I found was M635CSi but it was called M6 here and it wouldn't say it was normal.
In addition to the M635Csi, there was the E12 M535i and E28 M535i. In the latter case, it slotted between the E28 535i and E28 M5. Exactly what BMW says they want the M Performance line to do (but perhaps on a bigger scale -- to more models). I'm only aware of those three in the US, not sure where the plethora is... please let me know of any more.
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      07-11-2012, 08:29 PM   #42
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Those 5s weren't here in the states though, were they?
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      07-11-2012, 08:36 PM   #43
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Yes, but the reality is that people say they want a more hardcore, lighter, no AC, no Radio, no back seat, etc... sports car, but they won't buy it at BMW prices.
Witness the E36 M3 LTW. Sat on dealer lots, heavily discounted. I think the BMW market is different 17 years later, but I also don't think it's a coincidence we've never had another lightweight/hardcore M3 offered in the US.

Quote:
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Subyota just released the BRZ/FRS, how many of you will actually buy one, or even consider buying one?
It's a low cost excellent handling sports car, lightweight, and with a good power to weight ratio. Yet, it's already being knocked for not having enough power. When the turbo's get released they'll sell more, but most BMW enthusiasts will find ways to hate on it anyway, declaring how bland the interior is, and how much cheap plastic it has, and how few luxury items come standard, blah blah.
I really like this. Love the concept, styling, size, weight and price. I've yet to drive one but I plan to. Prefer the FRS, but hate the Scion brand. Told my wife I should trade in my 135i. Would hate to get the NA model when I know a higher output/turbo model is planned though.

I almost started a thread about this very topic but figured I'd get flamed/thrashed/etc for even considering 135 => BRZ/FRS.
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      07-11-2012, 08:54 PM   #44
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Obviously WOT acceleration alone will be a buzz kill coming from the 35 but as long as you have some bendy roads around I'll bet the overall fun factor won't suffer, could even go up! The dyno results of the motor were a little weird with an odd, pronounced dip in mid range torque, not sure if it will be seat of pants perceivable, but I'm sure a snail would cure it. I actually hope they offer a supercharger for increased immediacy of power.
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