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      05-12-2012, 02:39 AM   #1
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M3 Coupe -> '07 997CS? Would you do it?

My car is fully loaded with 25k miles. It's worth roughly 45-50k. I've been looking on auto trader and I think I can probably do a straight trade for '07 997 Carrera S with under 30k miles. Or maybe throw in a couple Gs. But anyways, would this be a smart thing to do? My gut is telling me it'll be more fun but won't be as nice daily driving it, although I only work 3 blocks from my home. Anyone else here go from m3 to '07 or '08 997S? Any regrets?
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      05-12-2012, 06:05 AM   #2
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I would not do this. When i was shopping for my M3, I cross shopped a '08 and '09 Carrera S. Spent a bit of time driving them too. Biggest reason for not changing.....the subjective feel of the engine. The M3's V8 is a real gem, pure and simple. The way it feels and sounds is simply intoxicating. You will also be giving up a significant amount of comfort. Make no mistake, the 911 is a harsh ride. The only thing you gain with the Carrera is a slightly sharper feel to the steering, and a crisper feel to the gearbox (if you have a MT). I think a lot of people get used to their M3 then forget just how good the it is. It is a legendary car, and is arguably one of the most balanced performance cars available.
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      05-12-2012, 09:12 AM   #3
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I would only trade in an M3 for a Porsche GT3 or Turbo. The other ones are too over-priced and compromising.
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      05-12-2012, 11:26 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SehrSchnell View Post
A '07 997? - no way. If at all I'd only consider a 997.2.
+1. The 997.1 tried to kill me, the 997.2 has suspension tweaks and is worth the extra $ IMO.
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      05-19-2012, 12:49 PM   #5
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Don't do it unless it's a 2009 or higher. Trust me.

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      05-19-2012, 01:21 PM   #6
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997.1 is very old at this point and I don think you should go for it. As good as it was, the 997.2 was a nice upgrade and the 997.2 is def a pretty good step up in all aspects of performance/handling/feel v. our cars and should be the car you target, or a cayman R which is an absolute gem of a car all around. Its quick, but has the best steering feel and could be regarded as the best handling car in the world, without question.
The new 991 is on a whole other level again, may be the most balanced car out there if you only need 2 seats as its performance and handling is mindblowingly good given the 'paper stats'.
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      05-19-2012, 02:19 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaneristiDriver
997.1 is very old at this point and I don think you should go for it. As good as it was, the 997.2 was a nice upgrade and the 997.2 is def a pretty good step up in all aspects of performance/handling/feel v. our cars and should be the car you target, or a cayman R which is an absolute gem of a car all around. Its quick, but has the best steering feel and could be regarded as the best handling car in the world, without question.
The new 991 is on a whole other level again, may be the most balanced car out there if you only need 2 seats as its performance and handling is mindblowingly good given the 'paper stats'.
Cayman r will most likely be my next car if I don't like the new m3. The green is incredibly beautiful
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      05-21-2012, 04:34 PM   #8
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Well I went from a 997.1S to a 2011 E92 M3. Larthal and others pretty much nailed it. To be honest even a 997.2S I wouldn't make the switch over. I know subjective testing may show otherwise but the M3s S65 motor just feels alive under your right foot vs. the rather lethargic 997.1S motor and .2S motor. Yes they are extremely quick, but the M3s just feel like there is a 100hp advantage in feel over the 997.1 and .2S's.

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      05-21-2012, 04:37 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
+1. The 997.1 tried to kill me, the 997.2 has suspension tweaks and is worth the extra $ IMO.
LOL... I know the way the rear end would just swing around with little or no warning. I had my wife at pucker factor 10 one day in my 997.1S, have to admit I needed a little underwear cleaning myself, after I got on the throttle a little to early and "whoa". I feel the lack of a LSD had a lot to do with this. Also having the PSM switched off didn't help much either.

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      05-21-2012, 08:08 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarThaL View Post
Biggest reason for not changing.....the subjective feel of the engine. The M3's V8 is a real gem, pure and simple.
+1000! This too, is the single biggest reason holding me back from getting a 991. Never been a fan of the flat-6 though it does sound a little better in the 991.
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      05-21-2012, 08:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
LOL... I know the way the rear end would just swing around with little or no warning. I had my wife at pucker factor 10 one day in my 997.1S, have to admit I needed a little underwear cleaning myself, after I got on the throttle a little to early and "whoa". I feel the lack of a LSD had a lot to do with this. Also having the PSM switched off didn't help much either.

Dave
Dave, mine happened during a spirited drive on my secret test route, at around 90-100 mph, long sweeper, throttle to the floor and no steering input to cause it.

The car did a weird corkscrew motion that started with the front bobbing around, then a split second later the rear followed (front had settled by then). I was watching the scene from about 2 feet above, comfortably sitting in a white luminous cloud. Was snapped out of that out of body experience when we ended up one lane over, without the slightest clue of what had just happened.

The same corner in the M3 (and 997.2) can produce an exit speed of 110-120mph without any drama.


That's why I mentioned suspension, and possibly bushings as having a big influence in the 911 world. The M3 is much more forgiving, because you aren't fighting strange weight distributions.

YMMV.
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      05-21-2012, 09:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adc View Post
Dave, mine happened during a spirited drive on my secret test route, at around 90-100 mph, long sweeper, throttle to the floor and no steering input to cause it.

The car did a weird corkscrew motion that started with the front bobbing around, then a split second later the rear followed (front had settled by then). I was watching the scene from about 2 feet above, comfortably sitting in a white luminous cloud. Was snapped out of that out of body experience when we ended up one lane over, without the slightest clue of what had just happened.

The same corner in the M3 (and 997.2) can produce an exit speed of 110-120mph without any drama.


That's why I mentioned suspension, and possibly bushings as having a big influence in the 911 world. The M3 is much more forgiving, because you aren't fighting strange weight distributions.

YMMV.

Agreed, the M3 is so much easier to go fast in. The 911 can eek out better times but you really have to know what you are doing with the 911. I never liked the way the 997.1S used to bob its nose up and down, never felt settled. I drove a 997.2S and they definitely improved it..but still not as settled as the E92. Not saying the M3 was faster but it felt just so much more stable, also the LSD in the M3 really is a joy.

Dave
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      05-21-2012, 09:31 PM   #13
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Quote:
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+1000! This too, is the single biggest reason holding me back from getting a 991. Never been a fan of the flat-6 though it does sound a little better in the 991.
A lot of the lethargic feel of the H6 motors in these cars is the extremely heavy flywheel. If you ever drove one with a light weight flywheel it feels much better.

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      05-21-2012, 09:32 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
A lot of the lethargic feel of the H6 motors in these cars is the extremely heavy flywheel. If you ever drove one with a light weight flywheel it feels much better.

Dave
Nothing to do with the performance, Dave. It's the sound...
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      05-21-2012, 10:11 PM   #15
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I test drove a '05 Carrera S after I sold my E46 M3. It definitely didn't feel like an upgrade and while it was a fun ride I was overall disappointed. The E9x is a lot more car. I'd take a healthy E46 M3 over a 997.1 (and know someone who actually did this trade).

Short of a turbo or GT3 you'll be disappointed IMHO.
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      05-22-2012, 10:27 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave07997S View Post
Well I went from a 997.1S to a 2011 E92 M3. Larthal and others pretty much nailed it. To be honest even a 997.2S I wouldn't make the switch over. I know subjective testing may show otherwise but the M3s S65 motor just feels alive under your right foot vs. the rather lethargic 997.1S motor and .2S motor. Yes they are extremely quick, but the M3s just feel like there is a 100hp advantage in feel over the 997.1 and .2S's.

Dave
I think the m3 engine sounds beutiful. not obnoxious, but refined, classy, and beautiful.

if bmw man up and put this engine in a lighter chassis (like 3000lbs z4m coupe....if that even exist, LOL). it would be truly amazing performance wise.
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      05-22-2012, 11:00 AM   #17
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Quote:
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Nothing to do with the performance, Dave. It's the sound...
PSE sounds killer, and the GT3 is the best sounding car this side of a Ferrari IMO. Love the sound of the 991, especially with PSE, every exotic and an entoxicating sound. Ive always enjoyed the sound of P car engines since first being in one. Sounds like mechanical perfection.
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      05-22-2012, 11:22 AM   #18
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Quote:
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I test drove a '05 Carrera S after I sold my E46 M3. It definitely didn't feel like an upgrade and while it was a fun ride I was overall disappointed. The E9x is a lot more car. I'd take a healthy E46 M3 over a 997.1 (and know someone who actually did this trade).

Short of a turbo or GT3 you'll be disappointed IMHO.
It seems as though everyone on this forum has the same train of thought when it comes to the 911. If it ain't a turbo or a gt3 it ain't a sh**. The 997.2 c2s will surprise most m3 drivers especially when gunning it at speeds over 80mph it will destroy our m3s, especially when equipped with pdk. I for one feel more confident in the handling of my 911 than I do with my m3. The amount of grip you get in the Porsche is just insane where as in the m3 ur slipping and sliding all over the place when stabbing the throttle. Don't sell the standard 911 911s short they are ultimately more rewarding and more fun to drive than an m3.
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      05-22-2012, 06:50 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KKM3 View Post
It seems as though everyone on this forum has the same train of thought when it comes to the 911. If it ain't a turbo or a gt3 it ain't a sh**. The 997.2 c2s will surprise most m3 drivers especially when gunning it at speeds over 80mph it will destroy our m3s, especially when equipped with pdk. I for one feel more confident in the handling of my 911 than I do with my m3. The amount of grip you get in the Porsche is just insane where as in the m3 ur slipping and sliding all over the place when stabbing the throttle. Don't sell the standard 911 911s short they are ultimately more rewarding and more fun to drive than an m3.
I agree with you. To me even a 911 carrera feels more raw than m3. In real world, it might not be as fast as the M3 with its V8, but the lightweight make a carrera feels as fast as a M3 or even faster. I love my M3, but I will move into a 911 very soon and that has always been part of my dream.
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      05-22-2012, 11:22 PM   #20
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only 997.1 I would swap for would be a Turbo
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      05-24-2012, 04:37 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KKM3 View Post
It seems as though everyone on this forum has the same train of thought when it comes to the 911. If it ain't a turbo or a gt3 it ain't a sh**. The 997.2 c2s will surprise most m3 drivers especially when gunning it at speeds over 80mph it will destroy our m3s, especially when equipped with pdk. I for one feel more confident in the handling of my 911 than I do with my m3. The amount of grip you get in the Porsche is just insane where as in the m3 ur slipping and sliding all over the place when stabbing the throttle. Don't sell the standard 911 911s short they are ultimately more rewarding and more fun to drive than an m3.
I loved my 997.1S, just like the E92 M3 better. Now if we are talking 997.2S different ball game, but it wouldn't be enough for me to switch. Now I am just trying to get my finances in order to get into a 991S,

I don't agree with you that everyone on this forum thinks the only decent 911 is a GT3 or turbo, its just the difference in performance isn't all that great until you get into a GT3 or Turbo for a 997.1 or .2, especially for the amount of money you spend.

My 07 997S





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      05-24-2012, 06:15 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SehrSchnell
A '07 997? - no way. If at all I'd only consider a 997.2.
+1

Main reason for getting a 997.2 over 997.1 is the fact they got rid of the IMS in the design of the engine.

No one can deny the 911 feels more special than a M3, M3 is a very well rounded car though and that's where it shines for me at least
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