BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Wheels + Tires Sponsored by The Tire Rack
  TireRack

KEEP M3POST ALIVE BY DOING YOUR TIRERACK SHOPPING FROM THIS BANNER LINK!
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      05-17-2012, 01:12 PM   #23
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1000 View Post
Because nobody is dumb enough to put a lug-centric spacer on a hubcentric wheel/car combo? I don't know how else to explain this to you.
You don't have to act like you need to explain. I understand what you're saying, I just don't agree with it 100%.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:12 PM   #24
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by leemik View Post
the pattern on the ring of the spacer looks a bit unusual.. like the wheel was rocking in and out to create that.. and finally it just gave way and bent the top

I'm thinking the wheel wasn't 100% flush on the spacer.. the bolts would still torque down "properly" (as you said) but there would be a small gap and the load of driving just worked the gap wider and wider until 4 of the bolts snapped and the wheel bent the lip of the spacer working itself off..
Sounds plausible.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:18 PM   #25
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

wow, that's a shitty part. I just can't fathom why people would buy these spacers.

if you're going to track, Turner's spacers are the way to go. hell, even the RSTechnik, H&R and Ichiba spacers are good stuff.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:20 PM   #26
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
wow, that's a shitty part. I just can't fathom why people would buy these spacers.

if you're going to track, Turner's spacers are the way to go. hell, even the RSTechnik, H&R and Ichiba spacers are good stuff.
I'd love to know where your reasoning comes from.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:32 PM   #27
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
I'd love to know where your reasoning comes from.
Sure, how much racing experience does MS/EAS have? They're just putting their stuff on cars that get taken to HDPEs now.

How much REAL racing experience has Turner had? H&R? LOTS.

When you're putting on a part on a heavy car that experiences tons of stress and load, you want something proven and something that's used in even higher stress applications.

Go on, tell me that these spacers are all "generic" parts and the same shit. But, anyone with eyes can see the difference.

MS Spacers:


Turner Spacers:


Why buy an inferior quality part when you can buy something good for just a little more? You don't drive a Civic, cough up the extra $100 for something of good quality. That's all I'm saying.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:38 PM   #28
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
Sure, how much racing experience does MS/EAS have? They're just putting their stuff on cars that get taken to HDPEs now.

How much REAL racing experience has Turner had? H&R? LOTS.

Go on, tell me that these spacers are all "generic" parts and the same shit. But, anyone with eyes can see the difference.

MS Spacers:


Turner Spacers:


Why buy an inferior quality part when you can buy something good for just a little more? You don't drive a Civic, cough up the extra $100 for something of good quality. That's all I'm saying.
Turner's def look nicer. But seriously, if I were tracking a car, I would avoid using a spacer at all in the first place. For most of us, it's just for the cosmetic difference.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:42 PM   #29
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Turner's def look nicer. But seriously, if I were tracking a car, I would avoid using a spacer at all in the first place. For most of us, it's just for the cosmetic difference.
lol, I just noticed in your about me section that you put "not leased" after your car.

so since you had to mention that, I assume you care more about your car as it's "yours" and won't get "returned" after a pre-determined period of time. I also think you're trying to say that you're better off than the people that "have to lease" the M3. then why don't you just spend some more $ and buy a good part.

even if it's just cosmetic, what if you hit a pothole?

do you track? there's nothing wrong with using spacers at the track. real race cars run spacers all the time.

do I track? lots. I've tracked my M5 with spacers (I've used RS Technik and even Ichiba on it) and I track my GT-R without. it all depends on the setup and how well your car is looked after and maintained.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:50 PM   #30
leemik
Major
 
Drives: 2013 LRP M3 Coupe
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Quincy, MA

Posts: 1,342
iTrader: (2)

Garage List
2013 BMW M3  [4.67]
i didn't even know spacers were legal at the track

i don't think i would ever run a car with any brand spacers at the track
__________________
leemik is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:51 PM   #31
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

BTW, Garage5, sorry to hear about your troubles and the damage to your car. hope it all works out for you. I would definitely contact MS/EAS. that's a bad quality/failed part.

good luck.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:52 PM   #32
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by leemik View Post
i didn't even know spacers were legal at the track

i don't think i would ever run a car with any brand spacers at the track
you obviously don't track. give me a rulebook of a track where it says "spacers are not allowed."

like I said, real race cars use spacers all the time. either to push out the track of the car, to use different tire/wheel combinations or to clear the calipers. there's nothing wrong with using quality spacers at the track.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:54 PM   #33
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
lol, I just noticed in your about me section that you put "not leased" after your car.

so since you had to mention that, I assume you care more about your car as it's "yours" and won't get "returned" after a pre-determined period of time. I also think you're trying to say that you're better off than the people that "have to lease" the M3. then why don't you just spend some more $ and buy a good part.

even if it's just cosmetic, what if you hit a pothole?

do you track? there's nothing wrong with using spacers at the track. real race cars run spacers all the time.

do I track? lots. I've tracked my M5 with spacers (I've used RS Technik and even Ichiba on it) and I track my GT-R without. it all depends on the setup and how well your car is looked after and maintained.
Well, so far it's just your opinion that one part is better than another based on the cosmetics of it and assumptions concerning a connection between Turner's racing and the products they sell.

I would be more than happy to agree with you that the MS spacers were inferior if you had more proof than "they just don't look as good".
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:55 PM   #34
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Well, so far it's just your opinion that one part is better than another based on the cosmetics of it and assumptions concerning a connection between Turner's racing and the products they sell.

I would be more than happy to agree with you that the MS spacers were inferior if you had more proof than "they just don't look as good".
take a look real closely at the Turner vs. the MS.

look at the ring on the MS. it's comprised of a thin wall. the ring on the Turner spacers are thicker and reinforced. the ring has more material and has a better design. can't you see that?
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 01:57 PM   #35
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
take a look real closely at the Turner vs. the MS.

look at the lip on the MS. they comprised of a thin wall. the Turner spacers are ridged and reinforced. the lip is thicker and stronger. can't you see that?
I do indeed see that. So you are assuming that this isolated failure was due to this aspect of the part? Seems unlikely if the bolts were tightened properly. Heck I still fail to see how the actual spacer could cause this failure.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 02:00 PM   #36
e1000
that's what SHE said!
 
Drives: 2011 E92 M3 ZCP
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: OC

Posts: 1,076
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
I do indeed see that. So you are assuming that this isolated failure was due to this aspect of the part? Seems unlikely if the bolts were tightened properly. Heck I still fail to see how the actual spacer could cause this failure.
I don't think anyone said it's the cause of the failure.

I think most people on the thread agree that the failure of a bolt or bolts lead to the eventual failure of the spacer.

I pointed out that I wouldn't use MS parts on load bearing areas of a car, which include bolts and spacers.
__________________
e1000 is offline  
0
      05-17-2012, 02:00 PM   #37
aus
Major General
 
Drives: Odysse
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seal Beach, CA

Posts: 7,306
iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by e1000 View Post
Let me put it to you this way, if you put a 15mm spacer on your car without that lip (which extends the hub), your wheel will shear all 5 bolts off and fall off of the car very quickly. It's a load bearing piece. PERIOD.
This is the truth. All the weight of the car is on the lip on the hub/spacer. But I still think this is either an install problem or bolt problem. Once one bolt fails the rest usually fail pretty quickly.
There have been other threads on this happening to stock bolts too after a lot of track time.

.
__________________
Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
aus is offline  
0
      05-17-2012, 02:00 PM   #38
mkPOTO
Mr. Nice Says Hello
 
mkPOTO's Avatar
 
Drives: 1999 528I
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: USA

Posts: 15,444
iTrader: (23)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Well, so far it's just your opinion that one part is better than another based on the cosmetics of it and assumptions concerning a connection between Turner's racing and the products they sell.

I would be more than happy to agree with you that the MS spacers were inferior if you had more proof than "they just don't look as good".
agreed with your statement, I mean parts can fail, OP did you contact EAS and see what they have to say about this?
__________________

EVOLVE BMW E92 M3
mkPOTO is offline  
0
      05-17-2012, 02:04 PM   #39
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by e1000 View Post
I don't think anyone said it's the cause of the failure.

I think most people on the thread agree that the failure of a bolt or bolts lead to the eventual failure of the spacer.

I pointed out that I wouldn't use MS parts on load bearing areas of a car, which include bolts and spacers.
Agreed.

Phil, before he deleted it, posted that he thought it was the spacer that caused it.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 02:05 PM   #40
nlpamg
MBWorld Spy
 
Drives: M5, GT-R BE, C250
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles

Posts: 588
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
Agreed.

Phil, before he deleted it, posted that he thought it was the spacer that caused it.
Yeah, I thought of it some more and I didn't want to put that out there until there was more information.
__________________
-Phil
nlpamg is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 02:09 PM   #41
signes
Brigadier General
 
signes's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spinnin at 8k

Posts: 4,175
iTrader: (3)

I won't ever buy MS products after my experience with their stud kit. Only 7 of the 20 studs had the proper hex head, the other 13 were smaller or had some incomplete finishing. Showed really bad QC and got a response from the company saying this was "commonplace" for their studs. Furthermore they told me to torque the studs using the double nut method to 90 lbft. Needless to say I returned them and went with Turner. Not sure if this incident was their mfg problem or something else (not properly seated, metal fatigue, etc.)
__________________
08 E90 | Jet Black / Black | 6MT
Mods: RAC RG63 w/ Pirelli Corsa 255F/285R | Akrapovic Evo Exhaust | OEM Blacklines
Winter Setup: OEM 18s w/ Nokian Hakkapeliita R 245/40-18
signes is online now   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 02:14 PM   #42
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by nlpamg View Post
Yeah, I thought of it some more and I didn't want to put that out there until there was more information.
Makes sense and I appreciate that.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 02:15 PM   #43
THE TECH
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor

 
THE TECH's Avatar
 
Drives: BPMsport 2012 E92 M3
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Kansas

Posts: 13,065
iTrader: (44)

Garage List
Send a message via AIM to THE TECH Send a message via Skype™ to THE TECH
Quote:
Originally Posted by signes View Post
I won't ever buy MS products after my experience with their stud kit. Only 7 of the 20 studs had the proper hex head, the other 13 were smaller or had some incomplete finishing. Showed really bad QC and got a response from the company saying this was "commonplace" for their studs. Furthermore they told me to torque the studs using the double nut method to 90 lbft. Needless to say I returned them and went with Turner. Not sure if this incident was their mfg problem or something else (not properly seated, metal fatigue, etc.)
There's nothing wrong with the double nut method. I don't have their studs but I did this with the studs I do have.

Quality control however is a whole other issue.
__________________
THE TECH is offline   United_States
0
      05-17-2012, 04:57 PM   #44
signes
Brigadier General
 
signes's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Spinnin at 8k

Posts: 4,175
iTrader: (3)

It wasn't the method that was the problem, it was telling me to install at 90lbft. I had already researched Turner and other studs and knew better. That combined with the quality of the studs themselves (and their reaction to it) was really bad. I can't imagine buying something like studs, spacers, seat mounts, etc from a company that has such an apparently casual attitude about quality.
__________________
08 E90 | Jet Black / Black | 6MT
Mods: RAC RG63 w/ Pirelli Corsa 255F/285R | Akrapovic Evo Exhaust | OEM Blacklines
Winter Setup: OEM 18s w/ Nokian Hakkapeliita R 245/40-18
signes is online now   United_States
0
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:59 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST