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      06-27-2012, 09:30 AM   #441
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Are there any tuners in NY that can do this?

Or has anyone in NY had any luck with the dealer updating it? What did they charge? How long did it take?
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      06-27-2012, 07:12 PM   #442
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I had the dealer update the software on my 08, updating my 080E software. Maybe my car is different since I always run mix of 93oct and 100oct. I honestly think my car feels slower, with a loss of mid-range and throttle response. I dyno'd my car right before taking it in for the update so tomorrow I will re dyno it with the newest update and see the gains/losses and post them here.
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      06-27-2012, 08:07 PM   #443
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopSpeedInc View Post
I had the dealer update the software on my 08, updating my 080E software. Maybe my car is different since I always run mix of 93oct and 100oct. I honestly think my car feels slower, with a loss of mid-range and throttle response. I dyno'd my car right before taking it in for the update so tomorrow I will re dyno it with the newest update and see the gains/losses and post them here.
thats what i am VERY afraid of
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      06-27-2012, 09:00 PM   #444
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I updated my 08 6sp and I notice a difference. Before I thought my car was slow but now I can actually feel the car pull. But they also changed my spark plugs at the same visit with 37k on the odo.
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      06-27-2012, 09:27 PM   #445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longuyen88 View Post
Before I thought my car was slow but now I can actually feel the car pull.
Awesome, simply awesome. Glad to hear that the update made your car not slow anymore. Can you describe the feeling of "pull"?
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      06-28-2012, 09:08 AM   #446
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Hey fellow M'ers , i took my 08 e93 dct in this monday for the update and it turns out that i have ISTA 2.39.4 . The SA told me that it was the latest SW they had and i told him that it was impossible since 2.46.x should be the series that were being flashed now. He quickly looked for the shop foreman and brought him over to me to ask why ? was i looking to update . I explained to him that after a lot of research i found that the new software was a hp gain over the one i currently had, and he quickly replied saying that i was impossible for bmw to release this because it would mean it would raise emissions and blah blah. Also that if a module went of i would be at fault, and that their computer were having issues. Guy was very hesitant and kept coming with excuses about that there was no way that the car would gain hp from the flash, and that it was so easy to mess up module. Anyways im taking it to a tuner shop tomorrow to get it done. Is there a difference in between the dealer sw and tuner shop Sw??. And what is the software that i have now and how old is it. Ista 2.39.4
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      06-28-2012, 09:54 AM   #447
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Had a chance to re-dyno my car this morning. This confirms what I had thought and felt on the street. I lost power with the new update. I can only assume the gains people are getting with the latest update are due to the lower octane fuel they are using. I always run a mix of 93/100oct and maybe when the car isn't octane limited there are no gains.

Here is the dyno comparisons, same dyno, same car/mods fuel in the tank. Dyno was done 4 days apart to allow time for the car to adapt to the new version software.

Mods: Drop in airfilter, undedrive pulley, 2nd cat delete 93oct/100oct mix


Last edited by TopSpeedM3; 06-28-2012 at 10:17 AM.
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      06-28-2012, 09:56 AM   #448
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Very interesting result. Some of us have suspected that these engines are octane sensitive.
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      06-28-2012, 10:18 AM   #449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopSpeedInc View Post
Had a chance to re-dyno my car this morning. This confirms what I had thought and felt on the street. I lost power with the new update. I can only assume the gains people are getting with the latest update are due to the lower octane fuel they are using. I always run a mix of 93/100oct and maybe when the car isn't octane limited there are no gains.

Here is they dyno comparisons, same dyno, same car/mods fuel in the tank. Dyno was done 4 days apart to allow time for the car to adapt to the new version software.

Mods: Drop in airfilter, underive pulley, 2nd cat delete 93oct/100oct mix

Anymore info on the dynos - like IAT for the two runs or correction factor (unless I missed it)?

The interesting thing here is that the dynos show it making very similar power; but only in certain areas.

Are you going to downgrade back? ...if that is even possible.

Thanks for the data.
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      06-28-2012, 10:27 AM   #450
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
Are you going to downgrade back? ...if that is even possible.

Thanks for the data.
The Autologic for sure will not let you downgrade.
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      06-28-2012, 10:34 AM   #451
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
Anymore info on the dynos - like IAT for the two runs or correction factor (unless I missed it)?

The interesting thing here is that the dynos show it making very similar power; but only in certain areas.

Are you going to downgrade back? ...if that is even possible.

Thanks for the data.
Ambient temps were within 3-5 degrees of each other. Those were the two best runs from both factory tune versions. Typically on the dyno you will see the hp go up each run as the ECU adapts till it backs it off just a tad and finds its "happy" spot.

I have no plans on changing the software as I will be installing a SC in the not to distant future.
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      06-28-2012, 11:15 AM   #452
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE TECH View Post
The Autologic for sure will not let you downgrade.
Incorrect. Autologic can downgrade SVs if desired.
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      06-28-2012, 11:18 AM   #453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom @ eas View Post
Autologic can downgrade SVs if desired.
It's interesting that you say that since they told me they don't allow reverting software. Although I can't say I'm too surprised with the level of service I've gotten from them.
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      06-28-2012, 11:40 AM   #454
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updated mine from 080e to 231e and although I dont notice performance changes per se, I do see fuel consumption improvements; which I am happy about!
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      06-28-2012, 12:24 PM   #455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopSpeedInc View Post
Had a chance to re-dyno my car this morning. This confirms what I had thought and felt on the street. I lost power with the new update. I can only assume the gains people are getting with the latest update are due to the lower octane fuel they are using. I always run a mix of 93/100oct and maybe when the car isn't octane limited there are no gains.

Here is the dyno comparisons, same dyno, same car/mods fuel in the tank. Dyno was done 4 days apart to allow time for the car to adapt to the new version software.

Mods: Drop in airfilter, undedrive pulley, 2nd cat delete 93oct/100oct mix

Quote:
Originally Posted by m3alabama View Post
Isn't 3-5hp well within standard random error in a 350 wph car?
Agreed. This is well within the margin of error. I'd consider this no change.
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      06-28-2012, 12:28 PM   #456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3PO View Post
Agreed. This is well within the margin of error. I'd consider this no change.
You are looking at peak though. Look at the area under the curve, all along the curve...there is a fairly significant difference.
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      06-28-2012, 12:28 PM   #457
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TopSpeedInc View Post
Ambient temps were within 3-5 degrees of each other. Those were the two best runs from both factory tune versions. Typically on the dyno you will see the hp go up each run as the ECU adapts till it backs it off just a tad and finds its "happy" spot.

I have no plans on changing the software as I will be installing a SC in the not to distant future.
Cool!

Good luck with the SC; will be a monster.
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      06-28-2012, 12:47 PM   #458
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
You are looking at peak though. Look at the area under the curve, all along the curve...there is a fairly significant difference.
I don't see a statistically significant change anywhere other than in the torque at ~2750 and you shouldn't be going WOT at 2750 anyway.
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      06-28-2012, 09:17 PM   #459
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I just finished reading all the posts. very interesting! i am still not sure if I should ask about the 231E software update or just say the hell with it! Also, I felt like I was reading about a Jerry Springer episode or something like that half the time...don't fight! If you want to, put the gloves on and step into a ring or cage. can direct you to some friends in Cal who can lend the space and referee.
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      06-28-2012, 10:38 PM   #460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3PO View Post
I don't see a statistically significant change anywhere other than in the torque at ~2750 and you shouldn't be going WOT at 2750 anyway.
There's a pretty significant difference in some other areas as well IMHO. But more interesting to me is that the power is equal in certain areas and less in others, but never more. Shrug.

Either way, one car, one dyno, with special fuel. I dunno...need more data points to confirm.

...unless one of the tuners can tell us what is actually different about the 231+, we are all pretty much guessing. I know that Bren from brentuning has stated that they relaxed the knock sensitivity.
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      06-29-2012, 01:49 PM   #461
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
There's a pretty significant difference in some other areas as well IMHO. But more interesting to me is that the power is equal in certain areas and less in others, but never more. Shrug.

Either way, one car, one dyno, with special fuel. I dunno...need more data points to confirm.

...unless one of the tuners can tell us what is actually different about the 231+, we are all pretty much guessing. I know that Bren from brentuning has stated that they relaxed the knock sensitivity.
I think that makes sense. The reduced knock sensitivity allows the car to advance timing and make more power on cars running regular fuel. If you run high octane fuel, the car has likely already advanced timing as much as possible.
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      06-29-2012, 01:55 PM   #462
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singletrack View Post
There's a pretty significant difference in some other areas as well IMHO. But more interesting to me is that the power is equal in certain areas and less in others, but never more. Shrug.

Either way, one car, one dyno, with special fuel. I dunno...need more data points to confirm.

...unless one of the tuners can tell us what is actually different about the 231+, we are all pretty much guessing. I know that Bren from brentuning has stated that they relaxed the knock sensitivity.
They did not relax the knock sensitivity from what I see. Knock control maps are the same.

I suspect some changes were made in the program area which have to do with the ion sensing knock control parameters.
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