BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > M3 (E90 / E92 / E93) > General M3 Forum (E90 + E92 + E93)
 
GT Haus
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-10-2011, 04:43 AM   #1
motosan
Private First Class
United_States
4
Rep
110
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 E92 ZCP M3
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: CA

iTrader: (1)

Question Double Down Shifting?

BIMMERPOST
     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
Does anyone down shift at the paddle then at the stick right away? I found this technique effective to bring 4th gear to 2nd, or 5th to 3rd, comparing to paddling twice or shifting twice.

Does doing so hurt the transmission by any chance?
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 05:51 AM   #2
jmflukeiii
Captain
9
Rep
727
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 Jet Black M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Tampa, FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by motosan View Post
Does anyone down shift at the paddle then at the stick right away? I found this technique effective to bring 4th gear to 2nd, or 5th to 3rd, comparing to paddling twice or shifting twice.

Does doing so hurt the transmission by any chance?
Haven't tried doing that, but haven't had any problem with just hitting the paddle a couple times for where I want to go..
__________________
2011.5 E92 M3 Jet Black, DCT, Competition, Premium 2, and Convenience Packages, Black Novillo, Enhanced Premium Sound, 15% Tint, Black Kidneys/Reflectors/Gills/Roundels, DINAN Full Exhaust, DINAN Tune.
2006 Range Rover Sport Supercharged Black everything.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 06:20 AM   #3
SenorFunkyPants
Colonel
SenorFunkyPants's Avatar
United Kingdom
38
Rep
2,622
Posts

 
Drives: E92 DCT M3
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

The paddles and stick are simply switches and both perform the same job so it shouldn't make any difference if you use them alternatively or in what order.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 06:49 AM   #4
sameh
Major
sameh's Avatar
United_States
28
Rep
1,471
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 E92 M3 DCT JetBlk
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Texas

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
The paddles and stick are simply switches and both perform the same job so it shouldn't make any difference if you use them alternatively or in what order.
Yep. It's not mechanical
__________________
2011 E92 BatMobile JtBlk/Blk/Blk CF
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:08 AM   #5
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
183
Rep
13,842
Posts

 
Drives: 2015 SO/CSAT F80 M3
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Interesting. I think the OP's point is that by using both you can theoretically get the shifts commands sent to the computer virtually simultaneously. I agree, though, that this isn't really necessary since a quick double pull is plenty fast to get the computer to recognize your intention to do a single two-gear downshift.

It probably doesn't hurt a thing to use both in quick succession, but it doesn't really buy you anything either. Of course if you prefer to drive left hand on wheel and right hand on stick, then I could see this technique feeling pretty natural and I see no reason to avoid it.

By the way, SFP, you guys in the UK still have the downshift on the left and upshift on the right, yes? In that case, for you guys, this wouldn't really work since the same hand is used for the downshift paddle and the stick (but hey you could still use it for double-upshifts though ).
__________________
A gen-u-ine BMW eff-eight-zero with them tandem clutches in the transmission and that dad gum sun roof on the top-a da cawr.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:24 AM   #6
SenorFunkyPants
Colonel
SenorFunkyPants's Avatar
United Kingdom
38
Rep
2,622
Posts

 
Drives: E92 DCT M3
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
By the way, SFP, you guys in the UK still have the downshift on the left and upshift on the right, yes? In that case, for you guys, this wouldn't really work since the same hand is used for the downshift paddle and the stick (but hey you could still use it for double-upshifts though ).
Heh...I hadn't thought of that.
Anyway I don't usually make double downshifts because the time it takes to make the double shift can be a little slow.
Also I tend to only use the stick for downshifts and then mostly only when the steering wheel is turned when its possible to mix up the paddles.

Last edited by SenorFunkyPants; 03-10-2011 at 08:29 AM.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:26 AM   #7
w00tw00t
Lieutenant Colonel
w00tw00t's Avatar
United_States
37
Rep
1,733
Posts

 
Drives: 2015 AY M4
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Issaquah, WA

iTrader: (11)

I've found that when in S5, if I double tap the paddles it downshifts 2 gears at a time... no need to use the paddle and the stick together
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:31 AM   #8
asheesh88
Private
1
Rep
51
Posts

 
Drives: 2010 Space Gray E90 M3
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chicago, IL

iTrader: (0)

Hi all,

Additionally,

If you hold down the left paddle while flooring it (past kickdown button), it will drop as many gears as necessary to maximize acceleration. If you are cruising in 7th, it may drop down to 3rd or even 2nd, depending on RPM.

Asheesh
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:42 AM   #9
mkoesel
Moderator
United_States
183
Rep
13,842
Posts

 
Drives: 2015 SO/CSAT F80 M3
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Canton, MI

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by asheesh88 View Post
If you hold down the left paddle while flooring it (past kickdown button), it will drop as many gears as necessary to maximize acceleration. If you are cruising in 7th, it may drop down to 3rd or even 2nd, depending on RPM.
Yeah the kick down feature is pretty well known, but are you sure it will work when done the way you've described? I always floor it first and then pull the paddle. Even if it also works the way you said too, you are going to get two downshifts in that case - one from the initial pull and then another after you push the accelerator to the floor.
__________________
A gen-u-ine BMW eff-eight-zero with them tandem clutches in the transmission and that dad gum sun roof on the top-a da cawr.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 08:54 AM   #10
w00tw00t
Lieutenant Colonel
w00tw00t's Avatar
United_States
37
Rep
1,733
Posts

 
Drives: 2015 AY M4
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Issaquah, WA

iTrader: (11)

what I remember doing is:
1. First floor the throttle and get the kickdown button to click
2. Then immediately downshift

the car automatically downshifted 3-4 gears to optimize accel. no need to hold down the left paddle while flooring the throttle simultaniously
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 09:14 AM   #11
jmflukeiii
Captain
9
Rep
727
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 Jet Black M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Tampa, FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by w00tw00t View Post
I've found that when in S5, if I double tap the paddles it downshifts 2 gears at a time... no need to use the paddle and the stick together
Yeah I was just noticing this morning driving that I notice most of the difference of the S modes when downshifting. S5 seems to downshift much quicker than S3, for example.
__________________
2011.5 E92 M3 Jet Black, DCT, Competition, Premium 2, and Convenience Packages, Black Novillo, Enhanced Premium Sound, 15% Tint, Black Kidneys/Reflectors/Gills/Roundels, DINAN Full Exhaust, DINAN Tune.
2006 Range Rover Sport Supercharged Black everything.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 05:14 PM   #12
OC3
Havin' a blast!
OC3's Avatar
United_States
53
Rep
4,819
Posts

 
Drives: 2013 M3 E92 Jerez Blk DCT ZCP
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmflukeiii View Post
Yeah I was just noticing this morning driving that I notice most of the difference of the S modes when downshifting. S5 seems to downshift much quicker than S3, for example.
Really?
__________________

BRP CW13 1:56 | CVR CW 2:01 | CVR CCW 2:02 | ACS 1:53 | WSIR 1:34
2013 E92 M3 Jerez Black DCT ZCP | JRZ RS Pro | Brembo | Endless | Volk TE37 18x10.5 squared | NT01/TD/ContiGrandAm | no other mods, nor weight shavings
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 05:33 PM   #13
Bosna
Picking fights with sharks
Bosna's Avatar
1
Rep
133
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 M3 ZCP
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Portland, OR

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmflukeiii View Post
Yeah I was just noticing this morning driving that I notice most of the difference of the S modes when downshifting. S5 seems to downshift much quicker than S3, for example.
... What exactly did you think the different modes were for?
__________________
2011.5 M3 Coupe DCT
2007 Lotus Exige S 6MT
2005 545i 6MT

Fast is subjective.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 05:36 PM   #14
ES_TRADER
Colonel
68
Rep
2,699
Posts

 
Drives: 328i, 335i, M3, 535i, X5, 36M
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: OC

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
2014 Ford Raptor  [0.00]
2012 328i E92  [5.00]
2013 X5  [0.00]
2013 335i F30  [4.00]
1990 Toyota Previa  [0.00]
1997 E36 M3  [5.00]
2011 E92 M3  [0.00]
2011 535i  [0.00]
I just use left paddle to downshift and the stick to upshift. So downshift with left hand an upshift with right

Never use the right paddle and the motion to downshift with the stick just feels unnatural. I don't know why but the motion to push it forward just seems strange. Anyone else feel this way?
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2011, 06:57 PM   #15
jmflukeiii
Captain
9
Rep
727
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 Jet Black M3 ZCP Coupe
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Tampa, FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by OC3 View Post
Really?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosna View Post
... What exactly did you think the different modes were for?
Thanks guys... the point of the post was that I feel the speed change in downshift much more than upshifting when in the higher S modes.
__________________
2011.5 E92 M3 Jet Black, DCT, Competition, Premium 2, and Convenience Packages, Black Novillo, Enhanced Premium Sound, 15% Tint, Black Kidneys/Reflectors/Gills/Roundels, DINAN Full Exhaust, DINAN Tune.
2006 Range Rover Sport Supercharged Black everything.
Appreciate 0
      06-15-2012, 10:58 PM   #16
Alpha///M
Scrappy Coco
Alpha///M's Avatar
United_States
6
Rep
356
Posts

 
Drives: 2012 M3 AW DCT ZCP ESS 625
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Long Island NY

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2012 BMW M3  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by estrader View Post
I just use left paddle to downshift and the stick to upshift. So downshift with left hand an upshift with right

Never use the right paddle and the motion to downshift with the stick just feels unnatural. I don't know why but the motion to push it forward just seems strange. Anyone else feel this way?
When I use my left hand on my stick, I feels so un-natural! Maybe because Im right handed!
And when I push it forward with my right hand, it does feel strange, which is why I finish up fast!!!!
__________________
Alpha///M
ESS VT2 625- GTS DCT Tune- Full Challenge Exhaust- Mode Carbon- Other Stuff
Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 10:05 AM   #17
nradbmw
Private
4
Rep
82
Posts

 
Drives: RedZ06
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Houston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by estrader View Post
I just use left paddle to downshift and the stick to upshift. So downshift with left hand an upshift with right

Never use the right paddle and the motion to downshift with the stick just feels unnatural. I don't know why but the motion to push it forward just seems strange. Anyone else feel this way?
I do the same exact thing.
Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 10:30 AM   #18
LarThaL
Colonel
LarThaL's Avatar
65
Rep
2,634
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 M3
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: West Springfield, MA

iTrader: (0)

Although I prefer driving a manual from an enjoyment perspective, one of the biggest advantages I see of DCT is the ability to use the paddles and keep both hands on the wheels while shifting. Using the joystick defeats that purpose.
__________________
Precision tool: 2011 BMW ///M3
Sledgehammer: 2014 Audi S6

Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 11:05 AM   #19
DARK_M3
Banned
33
Rep
1,294
Posts

 
Drives: 08 E90, 89 Grand Wagoneer
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (3)

Jeeebus I have stumbled into the pandoras box of shifting options here. (I drive a manual and it just seems so much less.. complicated)

Regarding shifting with the "stick", the way it is (usually) with a true sequential race car shifter, is to have the car downshift by pushing the stick forward and upshift on a pull back of the stick. This is because this is the natural momentum of the car anyway. What kills me (and yes I've had several cars with a auto/paddle/"stick" mode, is that the lazy brained way manufactures make them is to push the stick forward for an "upshift" I'm assuming because the cars moving forward and lazy brained drivers need to equate it that way? I dunno but it should go with the momentum of the vehicle not the direction of travel IMO. That always bugged me with my previous cars.
Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 11:48 AM   #20
outie
Lieutenant
5
Rep
519
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 M3 ZCP
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: CA

iTrader: (0)

I just tried this, the computer won't register the stick shift even after about .5-1sec. You have to wait a bit before you can shift w/ the stick after the paddle shift. You are better off clicking the paddle twice.
__________________
Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 12:11 PM   #21
mlhj83
Scythe-Meister
mlhj83's Avatar
United Kingdom
22
Rep
1,035
Posts

 
Drives: '11 E92 M3 DCT ZCP
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: London

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DARK_M3
Jeeebus I have stumbled into the pandoras box of shifting options here. (I drive a manual and it just seems so much less.. complicated)

Regarding shifting with the "stick", the way it is (usually) with a true sequential race car shifter, is to have the car downshift by pushing the stick forward and upshift on a pull back of the stick. This is because this is the natural momentum of the car anyway. What kills me (and yes I've had several cars with a auto/paddle/"stick" mode, is that the lazy brained way manufactures make them is to push the stick forward for an "upshift" I'm assuming because the cars moving forward and lazy brained drivers need to equate it that way? I dunno but it should go with the momentum of the vehicle not the direction of travel IMO. That always bugged me with my previous cars.
You do know that DCT's shift lever is marked + towards the driver and - away from the driver, right?

Nothing wrong with a manual, but people have their reasons for choosing DCT, some good some bad. I for one feel that DCT can be as involving as a manual simply because the M engineers designed so many combinations and shift settings into DCT to optimise performance, traction and balance for every road and driving condition, plus you get to keep both hands on the wheel and focus on delicate steering inputs. When used properly, I find myself constantly changing settings to suit the current situation. Why? Because it works and it's fun. Everyone has a choice.
Appreciate 0
      06-16-2012, 12:21 PM   #22
SD-E93-11
First Lieutenant
United_States
3
Rep
324
Posts

 
Drives: 2011 E93 M3 Jerez Black/Black
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: San Diego, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by w00tw00t
I've found that when in S5, if I double tap the paddles it downshifts 2 gears at a time... no need to use the paddle and the stick together
Yes, doing this raises the awesomeness of the DCT downshift to new levels and always yields a more ferocious throttle blip. I didn't know this was restricted to S5 (which is my habitual driving mode).
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:47 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST