BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General BMW News and Cars Discussion
 
GTB Performance
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      01-23-2012, 09:51 AM   #67
Robin_NL
S0THPAW
 
Robin_NL's Avatar
 
Drives: AW 1M , Assetto Corsa
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: The Netherlands, Europe

Posts: 4,681
iTrader: (0)

Somewhere in (recent) prehistory, BMW produced this one, way before any //M car...



And this is a nice read as well for people who think turbo is something new and NA is the way to go. DISCLAIMER: My favourite car atm is a Ferrari 458 and my greatest car of all time is a McLaren F1 LM, both NA.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brabham_BT52
Robin_NL is offline   Netherlands
0
Reply With Quote
      01-25-2012, 12:03 PM   #68
IancoleTX
Dillo boxers
 
IancoleTX's Avatar
 
Drives: BMW
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: USA

Posts: 3,041
iTrader: (13)

Don't know what all the complaining is about. Turbos are a blast to drive, sound awesome, and are extremely fuel efficient if you keep your foot out of the boost. Show me an NA where you can increase the power output by 20% with a $500 chip too.
__________________
2011 135i 6MT - Alpine White / Savannah Beige
IancoleTX is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      01-25-2012, 03:30 PM   #69
Desert_Fox
Drop-Top Turbo
 
Desert_Fox's Avatar
 
Drives: 2013 335is E93
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: San Diego, CA

Posts: 388
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Send a message via MSN to Desert_Fox Send a message via Skype™ to Desert_Fox
I've owned two NA 3 series before my current 335i, and the N54 engine'd 335i is by FAR the most fun car I have driven from BMW. I love the torque! I've driven the E92 M3 about 3 times now, and each time it has not impressed me more than the 335i. I dont track my car, so the M3 seems pointless in my case.
__________________
Current 2013 BMW 335is E93 [Mineral White] [Coral Red] DCT, Premium Pkg, Convenience Pkg, Nav, Heated Seats, HK, BMW Apps
Retired 2007 BMW 335i E93 [Sparking Graphite][Coral Red] Steptronic, Premium Pkg, Sport Pkg, Navigation, Active Steering, Logic 7, Comfort Access, CF Trim
Desert_Fox is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-06-2012, 12:12 PM   #70
DoD74
Private First Class
 
DoD74's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 BMW 335i Coupe
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Dallas

Posts: 136
iTrader: (0)

Why so against turbo engines? I've owned 7 BMW's now, and the N54 and N55 engines on the current models are phenomenal. They far surpass the performance of the older NA engines. The bi-turbo design makes turbo lag practically non existent. I get very strong torque with my N55, 0-60 in about 4.5 seconds, and still get the smooth response and highway fuel mileage expected from a 6 cylinder. Plus, tuning turbos is SO much more efficient than trying to tune an NA engine. My last car was a 2009 335i coupe and for about $1800 I added 80 HP to my engine just by using The Dinan stage 2 turbo kit, all through my local BMW dealership preserving my warranty. You can't add that kind of performance to an NA engine for that little money, so I'll take my turbo engine any day...
__________________
BMW History:
2000 328iS|2002 E39 530i|2005 E60 530i|2007 328i Coupe|2009 335i Coupe|2012 335i Coupe
DoD74 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-06-2012, 12:16 PM   #71
gunnerxq
Captain
 
gunnerxq's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 "325i"
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Staten Island and Albany

Posts: 966
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by archangel4865 View Post
Why so against turbo engines? I've owned 7 BMW's now, and the N54 and N55 engines on the current models are phenomenal. They far surpass the performance of the older NA engines. The bi-turbo design makes turbo lag practically non existent. I get very strong torque with my N55, 0-60 in about 4.5 seconds, and still get the smooth response and highway fuel mileage expected from a 6 cylinder. Plus, tuning turbos is SO much more efficient than trying to tune an NA engine. My last car was a 2009 335i coupe and for about $1800 I added 80 HP to my engine just by using The Dinan stage 2 turbo kit, all through my local BMW dealership preserving my warranty. You can't add that kind of performance to an NA engine for that little money, so I'll take my turbo engine any day...
I added 40 HP for around $1200
__________________
Bilstein shocks, eibach pro-kit springs, Remus exhaust, stage 3 intake manifold,Stage 2 AA tune, BMW Short shift kit.
gunnerxq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-06-2012, 01:21 PM   #72
mmm def
Colonel
 
mmm def's Avatar
 
Drives: 06 330i, 11 S4
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NJ

Posts: 2,566
iTrader: (0)

Send a message via AIM to mmm def
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveL View Post
it's Mercedes here i come.Oh and a 4 cylinder 328 with Turbo??What the hell is that
You know MB is moving to turbos now don't you?
mmm def is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 03:04 AM   #73
Pangloss
Lieutenant
 
Pangloss's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 135i Convertible
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: South Florida

Posts: 563
iTrader: (0)

The title of this thread should be "Why is the Obama administration forcing turbos on us all?"

Jus' a little somethin' to think about when you go to the polls this fall.
__________________
2012 135i convertible, DCT, Black/Beige, HK, Prem, M sport, no nav.
Pangloss is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 04:25 AM   #74
Sigma 3
First Lieutenant
 
Drives: A few things
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Tri cities

Posts: 341
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pangloss View Post
The title of this thread should be "Why is the Obama administration forcing turbos on us all?"

Jus' a little somethin' to think about when you go to the polls this fall.


yes and they are responsible for the king size snickers bar now being 2 pieces
__________________
In the land of the blind the man with one eye is King
Sigma 3 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 04:35 AM   #75
Levi
Brigadier General
 
Levi's Avatar
 
Drives: Alfa Romeo
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Germany

Posts: 3,199
iTrader: (0)

Next C 55 AMG is to get a NA 5.5l V8 making close to 500 PS.
Levi is online now   Germany
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 06:45 AM   #76
gunnerxq
Captain
 
gunnerxq's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 "325i"
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Staten Island and Albany

Posts: 966
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pangloss View Post
The title of this thread should be "Why is the Obama administration forcing turbos on us all?"

Jus' a little somethin' to think about when you go to the polls this fall.
+1
__________________
Bilstein shocks, eibach pro-kit springs, Remus exhaust, stage 3 intake manifold,Stage 2 AA tune, BMW Short shift kit.
gunnerxq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 10:23 AM   #77
Q4P
Colonel
 
Q4P's Avatar
 
Drives: Too Much
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: World

Posts: 2,296
iTrader: (0)

don't know where this hate and problem with turbo cars is coming from?

They offer a fantastic combination of down low TQ, fuel efficiency and awesome daily driving qualities. Mercedes is doing the same thing with almost all of its motors including the larger ones as well as Audi although they seem to be going the supercharger route. Take for example the Lexus GS350 where Toyota decided it would be a great idea to keep an NA V6 motor in a luxury sedan... so now you have a 3750 LB car with a 306 hp motor and 280 LB-ft of TQ... go drive that and tell me how enjoyable the car is around town and how great the fuel efficiency on this car is, I doubt you will be impressed. It is possible to create a fantastic NA motor although this is rare in a daily driven car due to the costs associated with it and the fuel efficiency issue. I have never been impressed with any NA 6 after driving even turbo 4 cars; the closest thing ever was the S54 motor and that was in an M car, although that engine was expensive to build, expensive to maintain and didn't have great fuel efficiency. Just something to think about...
__________________
2jZ + RB26 + 4G63 + LS9 + N54 =
Q4P is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-07-2012, 05:57 PM   #78
Rana135i
New Member
 
Drives: 2011 135i Matte Metallic Blue
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Canada

Posts: 24
iTrader: (0)

Flat torque curves all the way man, turbos are way more fun to drive, the pull is fantastic.

The only thing I like about NA is how raw the engine sounds at the high RPM.
Rana135i is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 06:56 PM   #79
oldman12
New Member
 
Drives: 2008 535i Sport
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Maryland

Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)

C'mon....

Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerxq View Post
No Just make Put more effort into making NA engines.
Porsche, there is no substitute, why... Cuz they have used the same platform for 40 years and simply tweak the underpinnings every time they release a 'new model'. I hear you but the majority of the manufacturers are in fact doing forced induction and quite frankly it's about time. When Nissan and Subaru (shoot even Mazda) have caught up to you on the track due to turbo charging, it's time to rethink your approach.
oldman12 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 06:59 PM   #80
oldman12
New Member
 
Drives: 2008 535i Sport
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Maryland

Posts: 15
iTrader: (0)

Wtf does Obama have to do with this discussion, oh yeah, more power and better fuel economy, my bad, thanks for the compliment.
oldman12 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 07:00 PM   #81
gunnerxq
Captain
 
gunnerxq's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 "325i"
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Staten Island and Albany

Posts: 966
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldman12 View Post
Porsche, there is no substitute, why... Cuz they have used the same platform for 40 years and simply tweak the underpinnings every time they release a 'new model'. I hear you but the majority of the manufacturers are in fact doing forced induction and quite frankly it's about time. When Nissan and Subaru (shoot even Mazda) have caught up to you on the track due to turbo charging, it's time to rethink your approach.
True but they haven't caught up to Porsche yet even with turbo charging. Its not all about speed but handling. Turbos don't make a car better for the track.
__________________
Bilstein shocks, eibach pro-kit springs, Remus exhaust, stage 3 intake manifold,Stage 2 AA tune, BMW Short shift kit.
gunnerxq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 07:38 PM   #82
F3_BMW
Private First Class
 
F3_BMW's Avatar
 
Drives: '09 335xi
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Denver

Posts: 118
iTrader: (0)

BMW is trying to be become obsolete while staying close to tradition. Since all the focus is on fuel eco turbos are the best way to have a smaller less trusty engine while keeping the same power.
F3_BMW is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 07:52 PM   #83
krnnerdboy
Colonel
 
krnnerdboy's Avatar
 
Drives: v10 m6
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: so cal

Posts: 2,039
iTrader: (10)

I'm a fan of turbos and I think most of the people in here are as well, but I too find it to be the easy way out for a manufacturer. With that said, I'm waiting for them to drop the n52 in the x3 so I could get it for my wife. Turbos and suv's are the best match... With just a jb1, I got my x5 35i to get it in the high 13's and it towed better than my 10 tundra w 5.7 and tow pack. That n55 was a beast
__________________

W463, f30, 640i gc , gt3
Recent past: z4m, x5 lci, boss 302, c6 z06, m6
krnnerdboy is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-11-2012, 08:45 PM   #84
gunnerxq
Captain
 
gunnerxq's Avatar
 
Drives: e90 "325i"
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Staten Island and Albany

Posts: 966
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by krnnerdboy View Post
I'm a fan of turbos and I think most of the people in here are as well, but I too find it to be the easy way out for a manufacturer. With that said, I'm waiting for them to drop the n52 in the x3 so I could get it for my wife. Turbos and suv's are the best match... With just a jb1, I got my x5 35i to get it in the high 13's and it towed better than my 10 tundra w 5.7 and tow pack. That n55 was a beast
+1 that is what I've been saying... that its an easy way out for manufacturers.
__________________
Bilstein shocks, eibach pro-kit springs, Remus exhaust, stage 3 intake manifold,Stage 2 AA tune, BMW Short shift kit.
gunnerxq is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-12-2012, 11:50 AM   #85
3PedalMINI
Rowing Through The Gears!
 
Drives: 2014 Unlimited Rubicon/2series
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: South Jersey

Posts: 54
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pangloss View Post
The title of this thread should be "Why is the Obama administration forcing turbos on us all?"

Jus' a little somethin' to think about when you go to the polls this fall.
+2

I F$*&@$ hate turbos. My 06 Mini was supercharged, my current mini is turbod and i HATE it. It is very laggy and un responsive and i really hate the stupid Japanese tuner blowoff (i have an intake and cant get around it) Granted i know i cant compare mini engines with BMW engines but the concept is the same.

I miss the supercharger wine and the instant response they provide. The fact that superchargers arnt efficient and terrible on fuel economy is bull shit now. We have a new 2012 audi A6 3.0t producing 300 HP. On the highway we get 32mpg in a car that weighs 3400 lbs. It is one incredible car and the engine is what makes the car, next to the handling It drives like a NA engine and if you didnt know the specs on the car you would never assume it was S/Ced the only thing is at redline there is zero supercharger whine

Eaton has come out with a way to reduce the parasitic draw next to nothing when its not under load and your just cruising. When you hit the throttle the supercharger engages. So its BS now that supers cant be a contender. I would buy an audi if they didnt do away with a manual and the refresh is hideous on the s5's.

Besides, i love the way the new F30's look and i love that BMW confirmed manuals though 2014 in NA, cant wait for the release of the coupe i am certainly not happy that they are turboed but im hoping a turbo engine in a BMW is far supior then that in a mini, i doubt it though
__________________
Ordered: 2series 4-17
3PedalMINI is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-12-2012, 12:38 PM   #86
romak47
Captain
 
romak47's Avatar
 
Drives: like a bat out of hell
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: SoCal

Posts: 933
iTrader: (0)

turbos are the way of the future,
the way of the future, the way of the future, the-way-of-the-future, the-way-of-the-future,the-way-of-the-future, the-way-of-the-future, thewayofthefuture, theway of thefuture.
__________________
JB4, DCI, Digi boost, CSL eyelids, 5% tint, KW v2's. Bastuck 85mm quad w/ berk resonated mids, LED int ltg, Perf SSK, CF int trim, 19" SF-71 rims, CDV mod, BMS OCC, ER+tial charge pipe. AR DP's, Helix IC,meth, drilled slotted rotors
romak47 is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      02-12-2012, 01:09 PM   #87
RnmEvo9
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Pembroke Pines, FL

Posts: 1,691
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3PedalMINI View Post
+2

I F$*&@$ hate turbos. My 06 Mini was supercharged, my current mini is turbod and i HATE it. It is very laggy and un responsive and i really hate the stupid Japanese tuner blowoff (i have an intake and cant get around it) Granted i know i cant compare mini engines with BMW engines but the concept is the same.
Perhaps you should've done more research on the turbo kit that you purchased for your Mini. Turbo size is just one aspect that can affect lag, and it seems you chose the wrong size for your needs. My n54 powered 135i has virtually no lag whatsoever compared to my previous turbo car (Evo 9). It offers a far more useful powerband for daily driving compared to the gutless NA engines that BMW offers today.
RnmEvo9 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      02-12-2012, 01:14 PM   #88
RnmEvo9
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Drives: 2007 335i
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Pembroke Pines, FL

Posts: 1,691
iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnerxq View Post
I added 40 HP for around $1200
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that is at the crank, not at the wheels.

Try this on for size (I am number 4037):

Name:  Cobb stage 2+.jpg
Views: 108
Size:  72.5 KB

I spent $1800 total (I could've spent less if I wanted to) for 3 mods done to the car and got those times at the drag strip whereas when I was stock I did 13.6@102mph. Try doing that naturally aspirated in your BMW motor.
RnmEvo9 is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:28 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST