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      01-05-2012, 11:35 PM   #1
benton0311
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Trade 335i for E60 M5 for kids/gear?

I hope this is in the right forum, too specific for off-topic but maybe too general for E90 or E60 specific.

I have an E90 335i that I love to death but I have kids and it's getting a bit small. My wife's Honda Pilot is the primary kid mover but if I'm working and she's not or if for some reason I need/want to drive my BMW it's getting pretty hard to cram everything plus two car seats in the 335. On top of that we've been thinking of having a third child.

Anyone put three car seats in an E60 M5? I just test drove one and, while sort of impressive, I wasn't blown away compared to my tuned 335i. It wasn't like "gee wow, this car is fast and handles like it's on rails" it was more like "okay, it's a little faster and it's nice to have posi again but okay." I did really miss the torque that I had but the V10 seemed to come alive past 5k and was a lot of fun up top. I had to keep it around 3500-4k driving around just to feel "normal" though.

The 5 series definitely has enough space and a much bigger trunk. I thought about a 535i but if I'm going to trade i'd like to at least go up in performance instead of down, even if I'm getting a bigger car. The maintenance sounds horrendous and while I never cared much about fuel economy it's like it might as well have a hole in the gas tank.

Any thoughts? My choices are to keep the 335i and only rely on her SUV to move the kids or get an M5 and be able to fit three car seats plus stroller and gear. I've though about the X5 and Cayenne as well but the rear seat is about the same size as the 5 Series/M5.
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      01-06-2012, 01:09 AM   #2
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I have/had an e90 335i, e60 M5, a cayenne s, and x5. I feel I am qualified to help.

The e60 definitely fits stuff better, and the back seat is significantly larger and more usable then the e90. It definitely has a hole in the gas tank, my best tank ever was 18.2mpg, and it happened once, mostly going down hill. My avg over 9,5xx miles was 14.01mpg. It also consumes a fair amount of oil for a modern car. Still it is a great car, and lots of fun on the highway. Smg is a little irritating in traffic and around town. I got rid of it when the warranty ran out, and because I wasn't driving it much due to work reasons.

The cayenne is pretty small for kids and the stuff that comes with them. It is the most fun you can have in an suv on the road, but it is still not fun enough to be your 'fun car' I tried that, it worked for a year then I got a fun car too. I really loved my cayenne, maybe it was the right car at the right time for me (before kid, snow boarding and wake boarding heavily).

The x5 is the wife's dd, and it is a great kid hauler, we got the diesel, so fuel economy is very good for a vehicle of it's size. The cayenne is built better then the x5, and it is more fun to drive then the x5.

I am confidant that I can put more stuff in the e60 then I can put in the x5, due to the shape of the cargo area.

Since you already have an suv I wouldn't buy another one. The m5 is a great car, but it will cost more then the average car to keep it on the road. It is a very nice place to spend time, and it hauls ass when you want it to. If you spend lots of time I town or in traffic....it can get irritating, and I always wondered about clutch life and all the voodoo going on in there.

In your situation I would have, and did buy an m5. A sensible person, who intended to put a bunch of miles on the car, would look into an e60 550i with the sport pack, or a new 535i.
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      01-06-2012, 02:23 PM   #3
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MisterSkiMask

Thank you very much, I couldn't have asked for a more informative reply. I've been kind of thinking the same thing, that even a "Sporty" SUV isn't going to satisfy me after a while. Have you driven the Cayenne Turbo or Turbo S? I'm wondering if that would be a little better than the S or GTS. I've also considered the ML63 AMG.

I think the E60 wins it for me over the X5 from what you're telling me. Now it's just a matter of seeing if I can pull the trigger on the M5. Fuel economy won't be too much of an issue because I travel for work so I only put about 8,000 miles a year on my cars. The only issue I'm struggling with now is the ridiculous repair costs of the M5. I got a quote from USAA for $4109 for a 3 year/36,000 mile warranty so I've got to factor that into the overall cost. I got a call back from the dealer that had the M5 that I test drove and it turns out the oil pump was going out which was going to cost them over $5k so the car was no longer for sale.

I'm still thinking about the 535i but it's hard to find one with a sport package and manual transmission.
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      01-06-2012, 04:45 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benton0311 View Post
MisterSkiMask

Thank you very much, I couldn't have asked for a more informative reply. I've been kind of thinking the same thing, that even a "Sporty" SUV isn't going to satisfy me after a while. Have you driven the Cayenne Turbo or Turbo S? I'm wondering if that would be a little better than the S or GTS. I've also considered the ML63 AMG.

I think the E60 wins it for me over the X5 from what you're telling me. Now it's just a matter of seeing if I can pull the trigger on the M5. Fuel economy won't be too much of an issue because I travel for work so I only put about 8,000 miles a year on my cars. The only issue I'm struggling with now is the ridiculous repair costs of the M5. I got a quote from USAA for $4109 for a 3 year/36,000 mile warranty so I've got to factor that into the overall cost. I got a call back from the dealer that had the M5 that I test drove and it turns out the oil pump was going out which was going to cost them over $5k so the car was no longer for sale.

I'm still thinking about the 535i but it's hard to find one with a sport package and manual transmission.
My Cayenne S had the same suspension as the Turbo, so in the handling department it would be the same, I am sure the power would be great fun in the Cayenne Turbo. I put more of a premium on handling for a car to be fun for me.

Any M repair bill will be a comparatively offensive. The trans pump for the SMG, and the clutch are the ones that scared me a little. The M5 is cool and that engine is fantastic, great sound and I like an N/A engine that you can wind up.

You are right, any e60 with a stick will be difficult to find. Either way you go, happy hunting!
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      01-06-2012, 05:12 PM   #5
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You cannot fit 3 car seats in an E60, I tried at the dealers with my seats, then took a loaner to a baby shop and tried all sorts of combinations of seats, it's just not wide enough, couldn't even fit them in the wifes 09 V70. Give it a go yourself, the results will most likely be the same.

You can't fit thee child seats in an F11 either.
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      01-06-2012, 06:06 PM   #6
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CPO'd X5M. And you will love the way it drives. I am actually afraid to drive the X5M because I know Ill probably kill myself in it, my m3 feels like a turtle compared to that thing. The fucking transmission is epic in it as well. give it a test drive
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      01-06-2012, 07:07 PM   #7
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CPO'd X5M. And you will love the way it drives. I am actually afraid to drive the X5M because I know Ill probably kill myself in it, my m3 feels like a turtle compared to that thing. The fucking transmission is epic in it as well. give it a test drive
Personally, I would get a cayenne turbo long before I would get an x5m. IMO, the Porsche is built better. I think Porsche built the cayenne as a $110k turbo, then decontented it for the less expensive models where BMW build the base x5 then put stuff on it to make the high end model. you can definitely feel the difference.
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      01-06-2012, 07:57 PM   #8
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Personally, I would get a cayenne turbo long before I would get an x5m. IMO, the Porsche is built better. I think Porsche built the cayenne as a $110k turbo, then decontented it for the less expensive models where BMW build the base x5 then put stuff on it to make the high end model. you can definitely feel the difference.
To each his own. The fact that the X5M starts at 85 and nicely equipped is still under 100 after taxes isnt that bad. I love the X5M, it handles like a beast, and is the worlds greatest SAV. I dont like the interior of the Cayenne, particularly the design aspect of it. This said, the X5M interior could have been a little better... But dont take it from me, im a biased fanboy
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      01-06-2012, 10:54 PM   #9
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Unfortunately, the X5M is out of my price range and the X5 won't give me any more usable rear seat space than the E60. I have found a few Cayenne Turbos that are in my price range but the rear seats look pretty small on them, like X3 small.

It sounds like most of the problems with the M5 are related to the SMG transmission so I'm thinking I should stick to 2007+ with manual transmission.
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      01-07-2012, 01:58 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by benton0311 View Post
Unfortunately, the X5M is out of my price range and the X5 won't give me any more usable rear seat space than the E60. I have found a few Cayenne Turbos that are in my price range but the rear seats look pretty small on them, like X3 small.

It sounds like most of the problems with the M5 are related to the SMG transmission so I'm thinking I should stick to 2007+ with manual transmission.
Very hard to find an m5 with a stick, but it will be a great car!
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      01-07-2012, 07:04 AM   #11
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Very hard to find an m5 with a stick, but it will be a great car!
Strangely enough I've actually found a few locally. Here it seems like there's just as many manual M5s as manual 535s.
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      01-07-2012, 08:12 AM   #12
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M5. Sounds 10000 times better than a 335i and while it may not as FEEL fast, it pulls ridiculously hard up top. Enough in fact to pull on stock Gallardos.
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      01-07-2012, 08:46 AM   #13
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Oddly enough I wasn't blown away by the sound. It sounded pretty sweet up top but the inline 6 sounded better to me from idle to 5k while still sounding decent up top.

Long story short, I've always like the sound of inline sixes. For me personally my sound preference is E90 M3 -> E90 335i -> E60 M5.
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      01-07-2012, 09:38 AM   #14
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I say realistically the 535i would make a better choice, especially if you're going to have kids in the car most of the time. Remember, the e60 is only 22lb heavier than the e90. Swap your performance mods over and enjoy the extra room. Make sure to spec the sport package for the active roll bars which make a huge difference.
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      01-11-2012, 10:36 AM   #15
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I would never use an M5 as a kid-hauler. The only thing that car should ever be used for is hauling ass and looking great while doing it! Sure, the M5 can be used as a DD but doing so defeats the point of that car. You don't run errands to the grocery store or Walmart in an M5. That's what minivans and Camcords are for.

All of the Ms I have owned have only been used as special opps vehicles (going on a date, picking up an important client, taking a nice roadtrip, etc.)I mean what's the point of all that bhp in stop and go commuter traffic?

If you're going to be ferrying around a growing family then you probably ought to be looking at an X5. I disagree with the above posters comment that you can put more in an M5 than an X5. I too have had both and with or without the seats down the X5 has far more rear cargo space.

Just my .02.
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      01-11-2012, 03:21 PM   #16
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I disagree with the above posters comment that you can put more in an M5 than an X5. I too have had both and with or without the seats down the X5 has far more rear cargo space.

Just my .02.
There are more cubic inches of space in the back of the X5, but I found the shape of the e60's trunk to hold more of the stuff that I had to put in (Luggage, stroller, etc), I also have the back seat of the x5 slid and tilted all the way back (I think you only have this option if you have the bs third row), don't know if that makes a difference or not.

I also don't like to pack the suv so high that I can't use the rear view mirror, or stuff can fall on the kid in the back seat.
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      01-11-2012, 03:39 PM   #17
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+1 Gator328i

The M5 you drove had to be sick and tired if you thought your tuned 335 was equally impressive. I have been in 335's and find them to be nothing more then a fast mini cooper.

The M5 is a beast, one that doesn't even begin to shine until you get into the upper power bands, I think the M5 is not the car for you based on your stated usage and my perceived driving style. With this perceived driving style, I would recommend you go with utility for your family first.
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      01-11-2012, 05:08 PM   #18
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Just a heads up if you are looking at Cayenne Turbos, they get horrid gas mileage. We have one, an 05, that only gets driven occasionally because the gas mileage is that bad. The power is awesome, but even driving it very tamely still nets horrible mileage.
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      01-11-2012, 05:38 PM   #19
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I would never use an M5 as a kid-hauler. The only thing that car should ever be used for is hauling ass and looking great while doing it! Sure, the M5 can be used as a DD but doing so defeats the point of that car. You don't run errands to the grocery store or Walmart in an M5. That's what minivans and Camcords are for.

All of the Ms I have owned have only been used as special opps vehicles (going on a date, picking up an important client, taking a nice roadtrip, etc.)I mean what's the point of all that bhp in stop and go commuter traffic?

If you're going to be ferrying around a growing family then you probably ought to be looking at an X5. I disagree with the above posters comment that you can put more in an M5 than an X5. I too have had both and with or without the seats down the X5 has far more rear cargo space.

Just my .02.

Agree that stop and go traffic sucks for a fast car, but the great thing is that a M5 can pick up children after school and be used for running errands. It's almost like a supercar inside a fat suit. For most people, having a sports car ends when they have children, but the M5 says, "Hey, you don't have to drive SUVs or Minivans!"

I think it would be a great kid hauler. I mean, isn't that why people love the m3 and m5? They give people who want the utility provided by a sedan chassis to experience a fast and fun car to drive every day.
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      01-11-2012, 09:58 PM   #20
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Agree that stop and go traffic sucks for a fast car, but the great thing is that a M5 can pick up children after school and be used for running errands. It's almost like a supercar inside a fat suit. For most people, having a sports car ends when they have children, but the M5 says, "Hey, you don't have to drive SUVs or Minivans!"

I think it would be a great kid hauler. I mean, isn't that why people love the m3 and m5? They give people who want the utility provided by a sedan chassis to experience a fast and fun car to drive every day.
I'm sure people do it, but I know of no one personally who uses an M car as a daily driver do-everything-in it vehicle. Everyone I know who has an M car, whether M3, M5, or M6, uses it as a second or even third vehicle. An M5 is an $80-90k car and to put car seats in it so junior can spill his kool-aid all over the backseat, draw a picture with his crayons on the arm rest, and spit crumbs all over the floorboards is the height of insanity. Anyone who does that doesn't DESERVE an M-car.

You put kids in a minivan or an SUV because you expect them to get torn up and trashed. If you're married with children, as I indicated, an M-car is fine for a date out with the wife, a romantic getaway with her, using for business, or just to use as your own four-wheeled personal therapist.

Owning an M5, or any M car for that matter, carries with it the responsibility to respect the vehicle for its uniqueness and rich heritage. You do that by utilizing the car for the appropriate purposes.
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      01-11-2012, 10:10 PM   #21
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Fwiw I used my m5 as a dd with a child seat in the back. That is what the m5 is all about.
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      01-11-2012, 10:22 PM   #22
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I'm sure people do it, but I know of no one personally who uses an M car as a daily driver do-everything-in it vehicle. Everyone I know who has an M car, whether M3, M5, or M6, uses it as a second or even third vehicle. An M5 is an $80-90k car and to put car seats in it so junior can spill his kool-aid all over the backseat, draw a picture with his crayons on the arm rest, and spit crumbs all over the floorboards is the height of insanity. Anyone who does that doesn't DESERVE an M-car.

You put kids in a minivan or an SUV because you expect them to get torn up and trashed. If you're married with children, as I indicated, an M-car is fine for a date out with the wife, a romantic getaway with her, using for business, or just to use as your own four-wheeled personal therapist.

Owning an M5, or any M car for that matter, carries with it the responsibility to respect the vehicle for its uniqueness and rich heritage. You do that by utilizing the car for the appropriate purposes.
I don't think I'm alone in daily driving my M, including grocery runs, commuting to work, and even picking up kids from school. This is the main reason I got the M versus a Porsche--everyday practicality mixed with a race car engine and dynamics. It may not be the fastest sports car nor the most luxury sedan but it is one of the best balanced cars on the road.
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