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      12-30-2011, 11:35 AM   #1
3XTR3M3
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"we don't need a supercar" - M-Division Product Manager

M-Division Product Manager, Matt Russell, says BMW thought about making a super-car while they were working on the 1M, but decided that there was no need for it because they already build supercars like the M5.

http://www.egmcartech.com/2011/12/12...ed-against-it/

Whatever.
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      12-30-2011, 11:37 AM   #2
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Merc has the SLS AMG
Audi the R8 V10 and GT
Porsche the GT2 RS
BMW... FAIL! The M5 is a great car but not in the leaque of those above.

BMW needs a true, 2 seat, 600+ hp rocketship to set the standard for the M brand.
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      12-30-2011, 11:44 AM   #3
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Translation= We have come to the conclusion that the investment wont reap sufficient reward.
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      12-30-2011, 11:54 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crabman View Post
Translation= We have come to the conclusion that the investment wont reap sufficient reward, but we would rather insist that the M5 is a supercar.
FTFY
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      12-30-2011, 12:12 PM   #5
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Hell. I'd settle for a dedicated BMW SPORTS CAR.

Z4=Roadster
1M=Sports Coupe
M3=GT Sports Saloon
M5=Executive Sports Sedan
M6=Supposed flagship of the M monicker, but big and heavy.
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      12-30-2011, 12:13 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James T. Kirk View Post
Hell. I'd settle for a dedicated BMW SPORTS CAR.

Z4=Roadster
1M=Sports Coupe
M3=GT Sports Saloon
M5=Executive Sports Sedan
M6=Supposed flagship of the M monicker, but big and heavy.
Promote this man to Admiral.
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      12-30-2011, 12:17 PM   #7
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Makes sense to me. Better to invest that R&D money into mainstream cars they will sell for a higher profit. Also BMW already has a good performance image in general and doesn't need to compensate for boring looking lineup with a supercar as Audi and Lexus do, for example.
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      12-30-2011, 12:23 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James T. Kirk View Post
Hell. I'd settle for a dedicated BMW SPORTS CAR.

Z4=Roadster
1M=Sports Coupe
M3=GT Sports Saloon
M5=Executive Sports Sedan
M6=Supposed flagship of the M monicker, but big and heavy.
Exactly. Forget about a super car, BMW doesn't even have a sports car
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      12-30-2011, 12:28 PM   #9
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BMW is so uninteresting these days
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      12-30-2011, 12:35 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crabman View Post
Translation= We have come to the conclusion that the investment wont reap sufficient reward.
And at the end of the day, that is what really matters.

I like to read about supercars, but I don't see myself owning one unless I hit the Lotto. And even then there's only two brands that truly make supercars to me: Ferrari and Lamborghini. Everybody else is trying to emulate those two with different levels of succes.

Even without a supercar BMW somehow have convinced me to buy 7 of their cars -3 of them M3- in the last 18 years. To me that's quite an argument against investing in supercars.
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      12-30-2011, 12:36 PM   #11
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In a way, Mr. Russell has a point - the car might not sell as well, and with BMW hitting record sales with their standard lineup, why bother? I could also never afford a supercar, so I don't mind one way or another on that basis.

On the other hand...building a supercar does more than just produce a supercar: the technology developed through the process trickles down into versions that many others can afford. Building a supercar stretches the creative thinking of the designers, engineers, and the company - and everyone benefits from that. By choosing not to build a supercar and push your team's limits...it's like choosing to move forward at a steady pace rather than leap ahead of the competition.

Hopefully, BMW's F1 division talks with the "regular guys" in the company.
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      12-30-2011, 01:42 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desertfox73 View Post
Hopefully, BMW's F1 division talks with the "regular guys" in the company.
BMW does not have a F1 division.... they sold it back to Peter Sauber a few years ago we the car market and everything went in the tank. Peter kept the BMW name in place cause BMW did the same for Sauber when they originally bought the team from Peter. The team name now has went back to Sauber-Ferrari. For the last few years with the BMW name in place the team was running Ferrari engines.

BMW dumped 100s of millions into the team and facilities and then did a fire sale back to Sauber for pennies on the dollar... not a great investment.

BMWs tech is at the top of the industry without a supercar Besides to much competition in the supercar market and to only sell maybe a a couple hundred cars a year not worth it.

A true sports car would be another story.
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      12-30-2011, 01:46 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smmmurf View Post
BMW is so uninteresting these days
Agreed. As are a number of other manufacturers. I was a Honda fanboy until the early '00s. While I still miss my AP1 S2000, Honda makes very little any more to stir my soul.

Call it the recession, call it new fuel standards, or blame it on natural disasters like the Japanese Tsunami; I think we're living in a different automotive era, and the future doesn't look much better. (IMO at least; perhaps I'm just getting old )

Asif
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      12-30-2011, 02:08 PM   #14
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Agreed. As are a number of other manufacturers. I was a Honda fanboy until the early '00s. While I still miss my AP1 S2000, Honda makes very little any more to stir my soul.

Asif
I would not put BMW in the same league as Honda for making boring cars... They are in a class of their own right now.

I would disagree with BMW makes uninteresting cars, they are one of the few manufacturers that i want to go the the dealership to check out their cars.
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      12-30-2011, 02:09 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by username11 View Post
Lexus made the LF-A, their other cars still ride like flaccid donkey penis and are styled by the AARP.
This made me laugh pretty hard

Its unfortunate that's the way they feel about it. Whether it sells thousands of units a year or a few hundred there is a crowd out there that will buy them up. Look at how quickly the editions of the GT3s, R8s, SLS's, Lambos and Ferraris sell out. Cars like this will also increase the amount of people at the dealerships just looking at the car and then possibly test driving another model leading to a sale. I remember when the Carrera GT came out the Porsche dealer had one and they were packed, a buddy who works there said that in the 2 months they sat on that car their sales went up 40% on other models. It would be nice to see a true super car come out of Munich for a change.
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      12-30-2011, 02:26 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crabman View Post
Translation= We have come to the conclusion that the investment wont reap sufficient reward.
This is the correct translation. A supercar gives the brand more prestige, but they are worried about recuping losses.
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      12-30-2011, 02:35 PM   #17
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While I do enjoy a nice supercar, I am a Lambo kinda-guy (not that I can afford one) when it comes to supercars. Honestly, I would rather see BMW put more money into the M line-up, or develope a true sports car before going with a supercar. Sure, I would stare at it, but it wouldn't be a car that I would likely buy (even if I had the money). For me, I would rather have more tech or more power in my M3 than see a supercar sitting in a dealer showroom. Just my $0.02.
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      12-30-2011, 02:43 PM   #18
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      12-30-2011, 02:50 PM   #19
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Good thing...I don't need another supercar to lust after.
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      12-30-2011, 02:56 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by username11 View Post
You don't need the "trickle-down" technology from a profit-negative supercar when you have an F1 division.

There is no point, fiscally or otherwise. Kudos to BMW for being smart enough to realize that.

Lexus made the LF-A, their other cars still ride like flaccid donkey penis and are styled by the AARP. Acura made the NSX, now you can buy several versions of the Honda Accord with giant chrome grills. The R8 isn't a supercar, the V8 used a "trickle-up" RS-derived engine and the V10 came from Lambo.

It seems that history shows that building a supercar really does nothing for the rest of your line-up.
Actually Honda made the NSX. It was just branded "Acura" here in the US. The general consensus is that Americans like "elite" brands.

You had the same thought that I did, however. I thought more highly of Honda when they had an "interesting" car. The NSX, and even the S2000 that I bought, gave the company at least the appearance of caring about the driving "experience".

Now all that they have are boring econo-boxes. Even if they are rock solid and dependable, there's nothing to get excited about.

The good news is that I can't think of a BMW that isn't designed for the joy of driving. I tend to agree with them that they don't really need a loss leader of a supercar because all of their cars can be a blast.

There isn't an Accord to be found in the BMW stable. That being said, Veyron gives Volkswagon prestige. Just think what a Veyron-type vehicle could do to push BMW into the stratosphere.
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      12-30-2011, 02:57 PM   #21
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In a way BMW has a point. I would rather that they make a car like an M5 that competes with and superceedes supercars in a sedan format and is relatively affordable than build a supercar, and that's coming from someone who owns a supercar and is around them day to day. I also own a racecar and it's much better to have an M5 on steroids and a dedicated car for the track than a supercar.
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      12-30-2011, 03:03 PM   #22
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Quote:
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BMW needs a true, 2 seat, 600+ hp rocketship to set the standard for the M brand.
Yes, V10 twin turbo with twin scroll!
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