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      12-15-2011, 03:03 PM   #23
swartzentruber
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Why are some of you construing the OP to be someone who is speeding or driving really aggressively based on his question. Driving on the track is not about top speed or driving aggressively, it's about adjusting braking and turning to conditions.

To the OP, I'll say yes. I do get complaints from my wife occasionally on how late I brake or how fast I take a turn. The funny thing is, usually I am trying to adjust for her. The fact of the matter is, it's not so much that once you have track experience you drive so aggressively, I think it's that you adjust to conditions more. This is in constrast to the "average" driver taking the same turn at 30, regardless of whether the road is dry, really wet, or snowy, then wonders why they spin in the snow.
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      12-15-2011, 03:13 PM   #24
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You need to have a few off's track driving...like a big spin in 3rd..that WILL slow you down on the road.

I know the result of pushing it, as a result anything above 60 or 70 kph is taken very carefully now, especially with lamp posts and crazies coming the other way.

(BTW no one is perfect, wet round abouts, motorway on ramps with no traffic.....yes track drving has helped...)

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      12-15-2011, 03:34 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by kiwistu View Post
You need to have a few off's track driving...like a big spin in 3rd..that WILL slow you down on the road.
Uh no, not necessarily. I've had a "big off" straight into a tire wall doing 5K+ damage to my track car. If anything, it possibly made me more conservative on the track (especially in the rain), but hasn't affected my street driving much. Not because I don't learn, just because I know I'm pushing the limits so much more on the track.

What track driving has done, I think, has made me more attuned to grip levels under different circumstances (wet/dry/snowy/hot/cold), so I may always try to drive (turn/brake) using 75% of available grip on the street (for instance), and at 90 - 95% on the track. That probably means I'll look more aggressive than others in good grip circumstances, and more conservative with bad grip.
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      12-15-2011, 04:24 PM   #26
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+1
But I have year round track weather so I'm pretty mellow when I'm on public roads all the time.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RudyP View Post
Interesting - a lot of people (me included) behave somewhat the opposite. The more I track, the slower and more sedate I drive on the street - just feels like there is no point in driving at 6/10ths on public roads when you can get your 10/10ths thrills on the track. My most aggressive driving tends to be in the early spring and most relaxed in the fall (I am not lucky enough to live in a climate with year round road course potential).
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      12-15-2011, 08:24 PM   #27
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It's interesting to see the wide variety of interpretations of my original post here. I do NOT drive like a DB. I conduct smooth lane changes, steering and braking inputs, and I always signal. I know exactly what attracts the cops and I have no desire to call attention to myself.

But, if someone cuts into my lane, I just let off the gas and let the motor slow me down instead of braking hard. If there is a corner I look for the best line and I have found I can coast through corners faster than others drive through them just by using proper steering inputs that don't scrub speed.

I also agree that my years spent racing have taken the desire to go fast on the street away for the most part. The reality is that with cars like ours, 100 feels completely safe and after doing it all day on the track, 55 feels like crawling.

I am not advocating excessive speed or DB driving, I am just wondering if your confidence from tracking seeps into daily driving and if anyone has ever become uneasy on account of it, even if you were completely safe?
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      12-15-2011, 08:41 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swartzentruber View Post
Why are some of you construing the OP to be someone who is speeding or driving really aggressively based on his question. Driving on the track is not about top speed or driving aggressively, it's about adjusting braking and turning to conditions.

To the OP, I'll say yes. I do get complaints from my wife occasionally on how late I brake or how fast I take a turn. The funny thing is, usually I am trying to adjust for her. The fact of the matter is, it's not so much that once you have track experience you drive so aggressively, I think it's that you adjust to conditions more. This is in constrast to the "average" driver taking the same turn at 30, regardless of whether the road is dry, really wet, or snowy, then wonders why they spin in the snow.
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      12-15-2011, 10:25 PM   #29
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I think it's just sitting in the passenger seat, not being in control and not being able to read the driver's mind is what makes passengers nervous. I'll be the first to admit it, I'd HATE it if I was the passenger while I'm driving. Meaning the stuff that I enjoy as a driver I'd hate to experience it as a passenger.
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      12-15-2011, 11:54 PM   #30
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Depending on the passenger I can partake in hooligan driving...others I can go fast as possible, just depends on the passengers. I have scared quite a few co-workers and especially with the fun of e-brake slides into parking spaces.
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      12-16-2011, 01:28 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RudyP View Post
Interesting - a lot of people (me included) behave somewhat the opposite. The more I track, the slower and more sedate I drive on the street - just feels like there is no point in driving at 6/10ths on public roads when you can get your 10/10ths thrills on the track. My most aggressive driving tends to be in the early spring and most relaxed in the fall (I am not lucky enough to live in a climate with year round road course potential).
I agree with RudyP. I'm an accomplished motorcycle enthusiast with a large quantity of track days under my belt on Superbikes, and once I got on the track, the less interesting any sort of aggressive riding or driving on the road has become.

I am not a fan of aggressive driving on the road, as there are too many uncontrolled inputs possible that can upset the driving dynamics and create negative outcomes.
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      12-16-2011, 01:33 AM   #32
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^^^ totally agree with driving more sedate on the street. Nothing to prove against a wanna track star at the lights.
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      12-16-2011, 03:44 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sameh View Post
I think it's just sitting in the passenger seat, not being in control and not being able to read the driver's mind is what makes passengers nervous. I'll be the first to admit it, I'd HATE it if I was the passenger while I'm driving. Meaning the stuff that I enjoy as a driver I'd hate to experience it as a passenger.
That is me as well.
Leaving aside all the "I drive on the track therefore I am a great driver" bravado...the simple fact is that some drivers (especially younger more inexperienced drivers) put there enjoyment of rapid driving ahead of their passengers nervousness.
I would never ride twice with someone who late braked or carried a lot of speed into a corner...that sort of show off driving is what gets you into an accident.
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      12-16-2011, 06:41 AM   #34
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I may be in the minority, but after tracking for a few years two things have occurred:

1. I'm scared to death of the drivers on the ride home. (It's amazing what folks do in cars instead of driving)
2. I've slowed down tremendously on public roads.
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      12-16-2011, 06:42 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwarner View Post
I agree with RudyP. I'm an accomplished motorcycle enthusiast with a large quantity of track days under my belt on Superbikes, and once I got on the track, the less interesting any sort of aggressive riding or driving on the road has become.

I am not a fan of aggressive driving on the road, as there are too many uncontrolled inputs possible that can upset the driving dynamics and create negative outcomes.

Well said.
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      12-16-2011, 10:40 PM   #36
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I do track days with my motorcycle as well and completely agree with your point of view. Once you've tracked for a while your senses and reaction times improve to the point where everything on the street seems like its occurring in slow motion. It makes most people nervous though.
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      12-16-2011, 11:28 PM   #37
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i dont drive anything like the track on the road, or have any desire too once i started tracking, its not even possible really. if you use the entire road in turns you pick up all kinds of shit debris that is along the road and other drivers dont act in a consistent and predictable way like they do on the track either.
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      12-17-2011, 10:01 AM   #38
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^^^ This is true. But, I never said driving like you do on the track. Only if track driving has influenced the way you drive on the street. Michaeljh gets it. Not DB driving, just an additional awareness and comfort level that can be interpreted differently by different people.
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      12-17-2011, 11:30 AM   #39
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as my first comment said being on the track makes me realize how poor drivers are on the street. they are unpredictable and i dont have any confidence in what they will do or their abilities. the same can not be said at the track. i will drive fast in open situations at times like anyone with this car but have less of a desire now as i have a real outlet. going 20 over in traffic is nothing like hot lapping for 30 minutes and pushing your car non stop at every point on the track. this cant be done on the road until your the last man on earth.
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      12-17-2011, 01:43 PM   #40
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as my first comment said being on the track makes me realize how poor drivers are on the street. they are unpredictable and i dont have any confidence in what they will do or their abilities.
Sorry to deviate from the thread, this comment reminded me of what happened to my brother 2 days ago. While onramp to hwy the car on front of him, instead of accelerating, made a sharp slow left turn, he managed to stop only to realize that the woman driving that car decided to make A U TURN while on ramp!!!!
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      12-17-2011, 02:07 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by immiketoo View Post
It's interesting to see the wide variety of interpretations of my original post here. I do NOT drive like a DB. I conduct smooth lane changes, steering and braking inputs, and I always signal. I know exactly what attracts the cops and I have no desire to call attention to myself.

But, if someone cuts into my lane, I just let off the gas and let the motor slow me down instead of braking hard. If there is a corner I look for the best line and I have found I can coast through corners faster than others drive through them just by using proper steering inputs that don't scrub speed.

I also agree that my years spent racing have taken the desire to go fast on the street away for the most part. The reality is that with cars like ours, 100 feels completely safe and after doing it all day on the track, 55 feels like crawling.

I am not advocating excessive speed or DB driving, I am just wondering if your confidence from tracking seeps into daily driving and if anyone has ever become uneasy on account of it, even if you were completely safe?
I agree completely. Used to track bikes and now the M and I drive in a manner that seems smooth and seamless to me. I rarely use my brakes because with our high compression engines you don't have to, because I'm rarely speeding in town. I like to have everything timed, like the city is laid out for me, and this car definitely reminds me of my bike days in how I drive it... Like I'm wearing it I see what you're saying.
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      12-19-2011, 11:48 AM   #42
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as my first comment said being on the track makes me realize how poor drivers are on the street. they are unpredictable and i dont have any confidence in what they will do or their abilities.
I see people doing crazy and stupid things on the time. Unpredictable? Not really. As I remind my wife occasionally, last time I checked, the laws of physics have not been repealed. Part of the art of driving well on the street is taking in all the subtle visual cues about others driving, and what they intend to do. You can learn a lot more from observing cars slightly speeding up, slowing down, and movements within their lane than you can can waiting (often in vain) to spot turn signals and brake lights. That's certainly one of the biggest ways that track driving has helped on the street -- I think you have to learn how to process things more quickly. As someone else mentioned, sometimes it does seem like everything on the street is happening in slow motion.
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