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      02-16-2012, 10:21 PM   #243
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There are a few things I'd like to point out that might help some of what you are saying. First of all, F1 cars are heavy downforce and downforce = drag. So adding drag isn't a big deal if you are getting downforce from it. Though they do try to optimize.

Secondly, the purpose for the high front nose is to keep the air below it clean for the rest of the body work. Thusly, they put the nose as high as they can to basically get it out of the way. They also house the front suspension, steering rack, and internal reservoirs in the nose. So these components all take a certain amount of space. Think of it as, the top of the nose is so high because they need the bottom of the nose to allow a certain area of clearance.
yeah i knew drag correlated with downforce, but when tenths of a second make the difference i was just saying the face seemed a little steep.


Thanks! Explains a lot better why the noses are so high.
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      02-16-2012, 10:37 PM   #244
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There are a few things I'd like to point out that might help some of what you are saying. First of all, F1 cars are heavy downforce and downforce = drag. So adding drag isn't a big deal if you are getting downforce from it. Though they do try to optimize.
Its a lot more complicated than that.
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      02-16-2012, 10:56 PM   #245
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Its a lot more complicated than that.
It is, but for the Lehman what he put satiated my question. I don't think we need to get into downforce vs drag. lol
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      02-16-2012, 10:59 PM   #246
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It is, but for the Lehman what he put satiated my question. I don't think we need to get into downforce vs drag. lol
honestly, and its no shot at you guys, its probably not getting into masisve details. Ive been studying aerodynamics for years and it still confuses the crap out of me and unless you have a background with it anything I say will come out as massive gibberish
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      02-16-2012, 11:10 PM   #247
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honestly, and its no shot at you guys, its probably not getting into masisve details. Ive been studying aerodynamics for years and it still confuses the crap out of me and unless you have a background with it anything I say will come out as massive gibberish
haha yeah, i understand the basics of DF and drag and how they relate to each other, but getting into it in depth is way over my head. haha

Here's a VERY crude rendering of what I'm talking about though. It just SEEMS like it would create a lot of unnecssary drag, although it WOULD add DF to the front end, it seems like it would disrupt the air flowing OVER the car to the rear wing, especially when DRS is activated.

Again, I'm NOT an engineer just blabbing. If it's getting old I'll stop lol

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      02-17-2012, 07:58 AM   #248
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Formula 1 is without an Italian driver for the first time in almost 40 years, as Jarno Trulli was replaced by Vitaly Petrov at Caterham.
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      02-17-2012, 08:04 AM   #249
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Its something more like this...but yeah thats the basic idea

Sorry about the bad MS Paint thing

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      02-17-2012, 09:35 AM   #250
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honestly, and its no shot at you guys, its probably not getting into masisve details. Ive been studying aerodynamics for years and it still confuses the crap out of me and unless you have a background with it anything I say will come out as massive gibberish
I'm all ears. The drag vs DF debate is a regular for any aerodynamic related topics or fluid dynamics for that matter. F1 obviously tries to optimize the balance between correct amount of down force to put enough pressure on the contact patch and air flow that will result in minimum turbulence with modest decrease in top-speed and acceleration.

It would be interesting to hear why you think the nose of the F1 doesn't make sense. I'm looking at the nose and I don't see any problem with it aerodynamically. Professional opinions will be appreciated.
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      02-17-2012, 10:21 AM   #251
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I'm no expert, but I wonder how aerodynamically sensitive of the step nose compare to typical ones in McLaren. Despite the look, is it to maximize the "efficiency of airflow" from the front to the back?

Also, Jarno Trulli is out, Vitaly Petrov replaced the Italian and will race along Heikki in Caterham.
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      02-17-2012, 12:24 PM   #252
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First picture of Mercedes W03. Another stepped nose.
Norbert Haug : "The nose is the most discussed issue. It's a stepped nose as some have seen. It's a very nice solution really and a very dynamic one."
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      02-17-2012, 12:40 PM   #253
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Glad to see Petrov on the grid. Trulli is being pretty classy over the whole situation.
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      02-17-2012, 01:47 PM   #254
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Glad to see Petrov on the grid. Trulli is being pretty classy over the whole situation.
For some reason m3post isn't loading from work. Never the less, I wanted to point out something I found funny.

Feb 14, Trulli: "I feel my seat is safe. They've shown no indication otherwise."

Feb 17, Caterham F1: "Petrov will be replacing Trulli."

While i'm not sad to see Trulli leave, seems he either got a raw deal or it was pending all along and just waiting on some certain term to click in. He has acted very sensibly about it all, which unfortunately tends to make me think he's known it was coming for a while.

Front page is updated.
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      02-17-2012, 05:49 PM   #255
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I'm no expert, but I wonder how aerodynamically sensitive of the step nose compare to typical ones in McLaren. Despite the look, is it to maximize the "efficiency of airflow" from the front to the back?
"A concern for safety is behind the new regulations governing the dimensions of the front of the 2012 cars. Article 3.7.9 of the regulations stipulates, in effect, that no part of the bodywork ahead of the front bulkhead (which protects the driver's feet) shall be more than 55cm higher than the bottom of the chassis. Noses were raised in previous seasons for aerodynamic reasons, to get air flowing under the car in order to create downforce, but on a couple of occasions they were thought to have contributed to the disturbing phenomenon of cars climbing over each other and being launched into the air during certain types of accident. The risk with the new arrangement is that the lower noses may cause a car to dive under the one with which it is having a collision, exposing the driver's head to danger.

McLaren's design is different because their chassis is lower than those of the other teams, designed to create a slightly different aerodynamic effect, meaning that they can avoid the dramatic step between the flat part of the front bodywork extending forward from the cockpit to the front wheels and the nose section, which has to conform to the new rules."
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      02-17-2012, 05:52 PM   #256
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I'm all ears. The drag vs DF debate is a regular for any aerodynamic related topics or fluid dynamics for that matter. F1 obviously tries to optimize the balance between correct amount of down force to put enough pressure on the contact patch and air flow that will result in minimum turbulence with modest decrease in top-speed and acceleration.

It would be interesting to hear why you think the nose of the F1 doesn't make sense. I'm looking at the nose and I don't see any problem with it aerodynamically. Professional opinions will be appreciated.
Hey sorry. Went out after work with some guys for some drinks. Ive had a bit too much to talk about this. Ill get it tomorrow when I sober up
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      02-17-2012, 10:47 PM   #257
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Hey sorry. Went out after work with some guys for some drinks. Ive had a bit too much to talk about this. Ill get it tomorrow when I sober up
It is Friday night. You did the right thing.
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      02-17-2012, 11:33 PM   #258
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Sad to see Jarno gone. But he went out with class and didn't threaten a lawsuit like Quick Nick. Gonna be different with no Jarno and no Rubens.
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      02-18-2012, 12:08 AM   #259
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Im very very sad to see Trulli go. The first F1 race i ever watched live was his first race for Minardi, he has been in the sport ever since i started following it, and it wont be the same without him, such a great personality, genuine guy. Had an opportunity to meet him in Montreal last year at a Lotus event.
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      02-19-2012, 05:32 PM   #260
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25 more days to go

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      02-20-2012, 12:22 AM   #261
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^ Not bad, although i'm missing some of that Eddie Jordan monologue.
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      02-20-2012, 02:53 AM   #262
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BBC doesn't host F1 anymore???
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      02-20-2012, 11:05 AM   #263
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BBC doesn't host F1 anymore???
Co-host with SkyF1, where Sky will feature a dedicated channel showing live practice sessions, qualifying and race of all 20 races in 2012 season. While BBC will show live 10 races and full replay of the other 10.
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      02-20-2012, 11:30 PM   #264
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25 more days to go

i have a count down setup on my ipphone
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