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      10-14-2011, 11:24 AM   #111
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No way.

When I got my license in 2000, my first car was a 1990 Volvo 760 (which I drove until 2006).

Why should my kids have it any different? Safety is the biggest concern but buying a car that nice for a kid is ridiculous. What do they have to work up to then?

Glad I drove my '90 Volvo for as long as I did. People laughed at my car through HS and College. NONE of them drive M's now (or anything near as nice). Definitely gave me perspective and appreciation for what it takes to get there.
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      10-14-2011, 12:08 PM   #112
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My first car was a Ford Tempo....shit brown color.

However, my second car was a brand new '89 Ford Mustang GT.....I was a junior in high school. Speaking from experience, I am lucky to have lived through those years with that car at my disposal.

If the OP is serious about giving the kid the M3, make her take a high-performance driving course first to experience real power and handling first. I think Bondurant offers something of this sort.
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      10-14-2011, 02:36 PM   #113
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If I had the means, the only thing that would hold me back from giving an M3 that I already own, or a new one to my own kids, would be their ability to handle it.

I'd be dead today if I had 414 hp under the hood at 16.

But if your kid is responsible and can handle a car, why not?

There are a lot of young people out there who can drive properly and drive the pants off some older more experienced folks, but they are very few and far between. A problem with young people is that they make poor decisions....You don't want a poor decision being made with that power on tap.
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      10-14-2011, 02:47 PM   #114
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      10-14-2011, 02:48 PM   #115
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Quote:
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I'd be dead today if I had 414 hp under the hood at 16.
+1. And I was a responsible honors student.

The trouble is, when you're 16, you don't have enough experience to know when you're taking too much risk.
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      10-14-2011, 03:00 PM   #116
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Do what you want, but in the end it is your responsibility...

Whatever happens is in your hands in all honesty, because you can't truly hold someone who is that young responsible for a machine like this IMO. There are times with this car where I definitely don't feel experienced enough, and I'm 27 and started learning and driving a bit when I was 14.

I don't think the performance driving school is a bad idea either. Could go a long way and would be fun bonding time as well.
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      10-14-2011, 03:30 PM   #117
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how responsible do you think your daughter is?
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      10-14-2011, 03:35 PM   #118
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Edit:

You know what... F it, not even going to start. Just LOL at some of the idiots posting in this thread. Straight up talking out of your asses.
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      10-14-2011, 04:05 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by Silvertige View Post
Rolf,

An e28 535is is no e92 M3. 0-60 mph is about 7.5 secs in 535. C'mon, that's minivan territory. Not really even comparable to an e90 328.

Even an e28 M5 is in the 6's 0-60.

And no, I'm not planning on letting my son or daughter roll in an M anything. That's just a scary thought when I think of all the stuff I did in an 1990 Acura integra at 16.
I never said that a 535is is a M3 ... nothing of the sort. I suggest you read my post again ... my daughter learned to drive in my then 535is and if I would not have felt comfortable in the way she drove the car after she completed her first 4 years of University I would have not given the car to her. Besides she was 22 at that time ...
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      10-14-2011, 04:13 PM   #120
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I wish I could go back in time and talk to the 18 year old me and knock some sense into him. Not just about cars and driving, but everything about life. That's all I have to say.
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      10-14-2011, 04:38 PM   #121
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My daughter drives next year, and she told me she wanted my M3 Sedan as her first car.

I told her she can have my Camry...
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      10-14-2011, 04:41 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RAID 5 View Post
My daughter drives next year, and she told me she wanted my M3 Sedan as her first car.

I told her she can have my Camry...
That's some funny stuff. I wish I could have seen the expression on her face when you told her that. I was very lucky to have a car my senior year in high school. I think any kid who has a car in high school is lucky!
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      10-14-2011, 05:11 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jqsmooth View Post
I wish I could go back in time and talk to the 18 year old me and knock some sense into him. Not just about cars and driving, but everything about life. That's all I have to say.
most feel like that. its the experience i was trying to convey to some on here. you cant tell anyone anything they think they know for themselves and will go on to make the same dumb mistakes rather than admit being wrong. you lose a lot of things getting older thankfully being stupid is one.
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      10-14-2011, 05:19 PM   #124
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Yes*

Under the condition that the kid learns to drive first.
NOT LEARN THE RULES OF OPERATING A VEHICLE ON STATE ROADS.
I mean LEARN TO DRIVE.

1) kid has to go karting for a few sessions
2) kid has to go to at least 3 autoX sessions. Preferably a couple with a beater, and a couple with the M.
3) kid has to take one or two HPDE sessions. Preferably a couple with a beater, and a couple with the M.

At which point, I would consider him experienced enough to know how much is too much.

The biggest mistake people make when beginning driving, is not knowing what the car can or can't do.

I watched a girl take a right angle turn in an old 80's battleship at roughly 40 mph.
She turned the wheel, and the car went straight.
She was shocked and incensed that the car didn't obey.

You could see it written all over her face.
The expression said : "OMG, WTF, HOW??? WHAT???".
Whereas me sitting in my car, watching her enter the intersection, knew exactly where this was headed.

We all know speed limits are not "maximum controllable speed".
We also have an idea of what is ... new drivers don't.

Kids don't obey rules until they've had to deal with the repercussions, or they get older and the fire in their butt dies out.
They will speed.
They will do it no matter what car you give them, whether it's an M3 or a FIT, they will haul ass and eventually screw up.

However, none of them is out to crash their car.
They crash only because they thought the car would stop, or would turn, when they need it to - when it really can't.

Eventually, they will have a few close calls, and will learn.
This comes with time and experience.
Some will be unlucky and will lose $ or health in the process.

The best thing you can do, is give them the opportunity to lean how to handle a car from the very beginning.
At least then, when they choose to speed, they might enter a turn at 30, rather than 40, because they know that's the fastest they can manage.

Then let the speeding tickets teach them not to speed.
At least they'll be in one piece while they collect the tickets.





That said, if I was buying a car for a son. I would :
1) Front engine.
2) AWD : Maybe an STI or an EVO. That way oversteer and understeer are not too exaggerated.
3) Always have the best tyres on the car for the given season.
4) Take the car to a tuner, and have them DE-TUNE the car to moderate power levels. Something like a Camry, or just a tad more.

You know they will tailgate people, so they might as well have good brakes.
You know they will go through turns too fast, so they might as well have good roadholding.
You know they will gun it in turns, so they might as well not understeer into the curb, or spin out into the curb.

They don't need much power, just enough to be safe merging.
With time, you can get the car re-tuned for more power - inching it up as they gain experience.

I would be very wary of starting a kid off with RWD.
AutoX or some track sessions would be a requirement for me to let them out on the road with an RWD first car.

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 10-14-2011 at 05:26 PM.
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      10-14-2011, 05:22 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chriszeh View Post
most feel like that. its the experience i was trying to convey to some on here. you cant tell anyone anything they think they know for themselves and will go on to make the same dumb mistakes rather than admit being wrong. you lose a lot of things getting older thankfully being stupid is one.
Yeah, getting old sucks but has it's advantages too. You see things differently, rationally.

I guess if I was the OP, I'd ask myself what would I wish my parents did for me when I was that age. And go from there...
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      10-14-2011, 06:09 PM   #126
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BS, BS, BS... Simple fact is when good parents instill good values and high levels of responsibility in their kids, there is no reasonably foreseeable problem in an M3 or any other sports car regardless of how fast or expensive the car is. It's when parents fail, then there is a problem..

When I was 15yrs old and could get a motorcycle license, my folks got me a Ninja 600. No problems. When I was 16 folks got my a nice sports car for my first car, no problems.

I am more driven for success than just about anyone I know and that wasn't hampered by the fact that my folks gave me nice stuff that I didn't have to work for. If anything because I had nice stuff and was included in their lifestyle as a gift, I feel I am less inclined to be lazy and give that lifestyle up. Sure I didn't start at the bottom and work my way up, but that doesn't mean I have any intention of experiencing it down there.

I am still alive 37, and that wasn't cut short because I was given fast still to drive at a young age. Sure I crashed a car, happened because someone ran a stop sign, it was unavoidable.

My folks were good parents, they did their job and therefore I did the right things. If your kids can't handle a fast car in their late teens, it's likely you have ill prepared them to handle all the other things life has in store for them as they approach adulthood.
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      10-14-2011, 06:34 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scheherazade View Post
1) kid has to go karting for a few sessions
2) kid has to go to at least 3 autoX sessions. Preferably a couple with a beater, and a couple with the M.
3) kid has to take one or two HPDE sessions. Preferably a couple with a beater, and a couple with the M.
Just one thought, a kid going through this, then may think they're better than other drivers on the road, and they can tame 414hp better because they've the skills now... Not saying this will be the case, but it may make them drive even faster with this tiny bit of training.
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      10-14-2011, 06:51 PM   #128
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Just one thought, a kid going through this, then may think they're better than other drivers on the road, and they can tame 414hp better because they've the skills now... Not saying this will be the case, but it may make them drive even faster with this tiny bit of training.
He most likely will get chip on his shoulder from the experience.

I expect a kid with that early experience will [initially] be more likely to drive aggressively, but less likely to make mistakes while they do it.

The point of the exercise is to learn boundaries by pushing the boundaries in a safe setting.

You know they'll drive like mad eventually - willingly (speeding) or unwillingly (didn't know they needed to slow down for X).
Might as well do it with an instructor, critical feedback, and direction.
Make it positive and educational, rather than a bad experience or a close call.

Not having the experience will not stop them from pushing their luck, in any car. Civic or M3.
But having the experience will prevent them from being totally ignorant to what's about to happen.




I learned how fast I can take a turn in the wet by losing it and sliding into someone's yard, stopping just short of their house, missing every tree on the way.
For me, since there was no damage, it was actually a positive experience. It saved me from doing it again in a different circumstance that could have ended badly.
I had friends that weren't as lucky.

I could have also learned the same thing by hooning around an empty wet parking lot, had I been given the chance.

-scheherazade

Last edited by scheherazade; 10-14-2011 at 07:07 PM.
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      10-14-2011, 07:02 PM   #129
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No f*cking way I'm buying either of my daughters a high-horsepower, RWD car for their first. That's not simply asking for trouble, that's begging and writing a check for it...

Seriously - that's a great way to lose a kid
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      10-14-2011, 08:04 PM   #130
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Bad idea IMO. Young and invincible, I would've been dead at that age in that vehicle.

Who knows though, your son may be more mature than most.

My $.02.
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      10-14-2011, 08:33 PM   #131
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      10-14-2011, 10:23 PM   #132
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Quote:
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My daughter will get a big f@cking Volvo when she is 16 - 25 tons of swedish steel.
+1

Or a 1985 Dodge Ram - 50 tons of American steel
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